Steven Pro
New member
Anyone used or heard anything about the new Aquarium System Stealth Heaters? I always like the old Visi-Therm's and have been intrigued by their ads for this new model.
Aquarium System Stealth Heater
- Thread starter Steven Pro
- Start date
Steven Pro
New member
I guess not too many people have used one of these yet.
I did find one thread about them,
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=518573&highlight=stealth+heater
It does not look too promising.
I did find one thread about them,
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=518573&highlight=stealth+heater
It does not look too promising.
TANGBOY5000
Premium Member
We discontinued carryng them, too many returns. Try an Ebo-Jager or the new AGA heaters if you're limited to the LFS for your heating needs.
ScooterGuitar
New member
I hated mine. Takes way too long to heat up. 100w model wouldn't keep heat in 15g of water! I too like the standard old Visi's.
I am a big fan of the Stealth. 100 Watt heater heats my 20 gallon tanks perfectly, keeps the temperature stable, and does not attract larvae with that annoying light (I breed clownfish and raise the spawn). Reasonable price, and I can get them at the pet store. Unbreakable.
I have heard that there are problems with this line, but I have not seen them. Never had one fail on me.
I have heard that there are problems with this line, but I have not seen them. Never had one fail on me.
db_triggerfish
Premium Member
no good imo, it stuck too many times threw it away. i am going to try finnex controller. I have not query it yet, maybe no good also.
pjf
Premium Member
Shatterproof?
Shatterproof?
When my "shatterproof" heater floated, its hot end stuck out of the water with the thermostat end underwater. I came back from vacation to find that it had burst into pieces with fragments sticking to the inside of my refugium cabinet. Thank God for GFI!
Let me know if they have since added weights to their heaters.
Shatterproof?
Did you notice that these heaters float when their suction cups lose their grip?
When my "shatterproof" heater floated, its hot end stuck out of the water with the thermostat end underwater. I came back from vacation to find that it had burst into pieces with fragments sticking to the inside of my refugium cabinet. Thank God for GFI!
Let me know if they have since added weights to their heaters.
New AGA heaters
New AGA heaters
The new AGA heaters are Hydor remarked AGA. I just had a 300 Watt AGA and when I pulled it out because my tank was getting real warm it had condensation inside the tube. I returned it to Petco. Yes I know Petco charged double the price for it than online. I haven't bought a replacement yet cause I want a known good heater...
Mike
New AGA heaters
The new AGA heaters are Hydor remarked AGA. I just had a 300 Watt AGA and when I pulled it out because my tank was getting real warm it had condensation inside the tube. I returned it to Petco. Yes I know Petco charged double the price for it than online. I haven't bought a replacement yet cause I want a known good heater...
Mike
JennM
Reefer
Bringing this old thread back to life. I found it by googling "Problems with Stealth Heaters."
I sold them for a couple of years, and quit when I started getting returns for various problems - sticking on, not coming on, and the worst one - stray voltage.
I just removed another one (sold ~3 years ago) that was tossing 39 volts into the water. That explains why the guy's tang had bad HLLE despite a good diet and good water quality.
I have a few more of these in service in tanks we maintain and was looking to see if there was any sort of recall on them, or if there were more widespread problems.
When I first started encountering problems and had stopped carrying them, I brought it to the attention of a Marineland (now UPG) sales rep and he told me it was the first he'd heard of any problems.
They do have a lifetime warranty - so I have been able to return defective ones to my distributor regardless of when they were purchased. I'm contemplating taking them ALL out of service, regardless of any obvious problems, but it may take a bit of convincing for the distributor to take them all back - so I'm researching to give them a viable reason to accept them back - as well as to let UPG know.
Sooooo...
If anybody else has had problems with their Stealth, please add to this thread.
And if you have a Stealth, and it appears to be working OK, but you're seeing unexplained HLLE in tangs or angels, or have had any other behavioral anomalies, you might want to test your tank for stray voltage using a multimeter, just in case.
Thanks for any additional input.
Jenn
I sold them for a couple of years, and quit when I started getting returns for various problems - sticking on, not coming on, and the worst one - stray voltage.
I just removed another one (sold ~3 years ago) that was tossing 39 volts into the water. That explains why the guy's tang had bad HLLE despite a good diet and good water quality.
I have a few more of these in service in tanks we maintain and was looking to see if there was any sort of recall on them, or if there were more widespread problems.
When I first started encountering problems and had stopped carrying them, I brought it to the attention of a Marineland (now UPG) sales rep and he told me it was the first he'd heard of any problems.
They do have a lifetime warranty - so I have been able to return defective ones to my distributor regardless of when they were purchased. I'm contemplating taking them ALL out of service, regardless of any obvious problems, but it may take a bit of convincing for the distributor to take them all back - so I'm researching to give them a viable reason to accept them back - as well as to let UPG know.
Sooooo...
If anybody else has had problems with their Stealth, please add to this thread.
And if you have a Stealth, and it appears to be working OK, but you're seeing unexplained HLLE in tangs or angels, or have had any other behavioral anomalies, you might want to test your tank for stray voltage using a multimeter, just in case.
Thanks for any additional input.
Jenn
clockman
New member
I use 2 Stealth 200 watt heaters on my 90 gal. I like to fumble around a lot with my sump equipment and I'm sure I would've broken several glass heaters by now. I've heard some people complain about not having an indicator light to tell if the heater is working. I'd rather rely on the thermometer for that though. I've had them for about a year w/ no problems.
JennM
Reefer
FWIW I have the same complaint and so do customers about the indicator light (or lack thereof). I've "caught" a few heaters going bad when I've noticed the light never seemed to go out, and with the Stealth, you can't tell unless your thermometer tells you something is wonky or you touch the heater.
My main concern is the stray voltage issue. Most people can figure out on their own if the temperature isn't right - too high or too low. Most don't even know how to check for voltage and a heater that SEEMS to be working (more or less) is causing all kinds of problems in fish that are sensitive to voltage present in the water - which we don't feel to the touch. You'd feel amps, but not volts.
Often by the time we're summoned to assess a problem, it's too late - fish are either damaged beyond healing by the HLLE or they wig out one day and plunge their heads into a rock ... I've seen that happen a couple of times. My theory is that the voltage confuses them - interferes with their lateral line organ and otherwise screws up their "navigation" system, or just the stress from the constant electrical interference finally causes them to "go crazy".
Jenn
My main concern is the stray voltage issue. Most people can figure out on their own if the temperature isn't right - too high or too low. Most don't even know how to check for voltage and a heater that SEEMS to be working (more or less) is causing all kinds of problems in fish that are sensitive to voltage present in the water - which we don't feel to the touch. You'd feel amps, but not volts.
Often by the time we're summoned to assess a problem, it's too late - fish are either damaged beyond healing by the HLLE or they wig out one day and plunge their heads into a rock ... I've seen that happen a couple of times. My theory is that the voltage confuses them - interferes with their lateral line organ and otherwise screws up their "navigation" system, or just the stress from the constant electrical interference finally causes them to "go crazy".
Jenn
I just removed another one (sold ~3 years ago) that was tossing 39 volts into the water. That explains why the guy's tang had bad HLLE despite a good diet and good water quality.
FWIW, I'm quite skeptical of your comments, and somewhat surprised that you so freely admit your commercial biased viewpoint and that you are starting this old thread back up in order to try to get monetary compensation for heaters that may have displayed no issues at all.
I do not think it is clear that induced currents and voltage cause HLLE, but even more so, I'd be surprised if heater design will impact induced currents that much. Any flow of electricity through wires will induce voltage and currents in nearby seawater. How many other brands of identically sized heaters have you monitored for induced voltage in the exact same setup that you have tested these stealths? I presume that you are not talking about a true current leak as that is easily monitored by whether a GFI is triggered in grounded seawater.
Further, if the heater is in a sump, there won't be any induced voltage or current effect in the main tank. So if you see problems with fish in such tanks, you might look for other causes. Steven, the OP of this thread, wrote a nice article detailing all of the possible theories:
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-06/sp/index.php
From it:
"Stray Voltage and Ground Probes:
Of all the theories regarding MHLLE, this is the one that I have the most trouble believing, and, after subsequent readings by David Kessner, it would appear my gut impression turns out to be correct."
I just ordered 2 of the 250 watt for the same reasons others did: too many broken glass heaters in the past. Hopefully they'll be fine, but I do not use the controls on them but rather use them with a temperature controller.
FWIW, I'll compare them directly for inducted voltage to a similarly sized Visitherm I have and see if there is any difference. Since I do not believe that induced voltage from a heater is something that will change as time goes by (assuming the wiring pattern inside the heater does not get changed around somehow), it should be a suitable test of at least the first part of your hypothesis.
FWIW, I'm quite skeptical of your comments, and somewhat surprised that you so freely admit your commercial biased viewpoint and that you are starting this old thread back up in order to try to get monetary compensation for heaters that may have displayed no issues at all.
I do not think it is clear that induced currents and voltage cause HLLE, but even more so, I'd be surprised if heater design will impact induced currents that much. Any flow of electricity through wires will induce voltage and currents in nearby seawater. How many other brands of identically sized heaters have you monitored for induced voltage in the exact same setup that you have tested these stealths? I presume that you are not talking about a true current leak as that is easily monitored by whether a GFI is triggered in grounded seawater.
Further, if the heater is in a sump, there won't be any induced voltage or current effect in the main tank. So if you see problems with fish in such tanks, you might look for other causes. Steven, the OP of this thread, wrote a nice article detailing all of the possible theories:
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-06/sp/index.php
From it:
"Stray Voltage and Ground Probes:
Of all the theories regarding MHLLE, this is the one that I have the most trouble believing, and, after subsequent readings by David Kessner, it would appear my gut impression turns out to be correct."
I just ordered 2 of the 250 watt for the same reasons others did: too many broken glass heaters in the past. Hopefully they'll be fine, but I do not use the controls on them but rather use them with a temperature controller.
FWIW, I'll compare them directly for inducted voltage to a similarly sized Visitherm I have and see if there is any difference. Since I do not believe that induced voltage from a heater is something that will change as time goes by (assuming the wiring pattern inside the heater does not get changed around somehow), it should be a suitable test of at least the first part of your hypothesis.
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JennM
Reefer
WHOA - wait a minute please, sir. I think you have completely and totally misunderstood my intentions here.
Yep, I'm a retailer, not hiding that. I am NOT seeking monetary compensation - at least not for myself.
What I am seeking is to remove and replace what I have found to be a brand of heater that has an unusually high failure rate, with another brand of (hopefully) more reliable heater, AT NO COST to my clients who bought the Stealth heaters.
I AM able to do this with ones that have already failed, simply by returning them to the distributor, with an explanation of the problem.
I *could* pull them all and send them back and lie and say they were faulty but I really don't want to do that because that's dishonest. At the same time, I feel compelled to do *something* because I've seen these heaters fail on too many occasions to leave others in service in good conscience.
I'm not a scientist. I don't play one on TV. I'm a hobbyist, and I've been in the retail end of the hobby for 8 + years now.
As for arguing the voltage issue, say what you will - I don't have the science to back up my anecdotal observations but based on what I've seen over the years I've come to some conclusions concerning voltage and illness, in particular, HLLE, and also anecdotally when what I believe to be the problem or source is corrected, the symptoms reverse if the fish aren't too far gone (ie scarred) to recover. Sometimes they regain their health except for the scars, but pitting and further fin and lateral line erosion stops.
In the instance I referenced, my client called me to say "all his fish were dying" - which was more than a bit of an overstatement. When I arrived, his yellow tang was wedged into a crevice in a manner that was not what I'd consider to be normal behavior. The client thought the fish was dead - but it was still breathing.
Customer also reported his GFCI had tripped earlier in the day and it took several attempts to get it to stay on - but he admitted he did not investigate the "cause" of the tripped breaker.
Upon testing with a volt meter, we found 39-41 volts in the water (the reading fluctuated back and forth). We unplugged the heater, reading was a steady 2 volts. Coincidence? Methinks not. Installed a new heater (different brand), and the reading stayed consistent at 2 volts.
The tang was left in the tank after discussing options about what to do with it. I actually expected it to be deceased the next day. It was up and about the next day, and after following up, I hear it was fine as of yesterday (the incident happened on Nov. 21).
This is not the first time I've seen problems arise with this brand of heater. This is not the first time I've seen problems arise with a short in a piece of electrical equipment causing voltage in a tank, which resulted in some sort of fish malaise. Is it science? No. It is observation from many years in the trade, and having deal with all sorts of equipment and failures thereof.
So if you don't want to offer any personal experience, don't. I didn't ask the question to make a fast buck, I simply asked it so that I could approach my product vendor to see if I could replace potentially faulty items with new ones, without costing my clients any money. If you want to hang me for that, then go for it.
Given the amount of Stealth heaters I've seen go bad over the last few years, I'm actually kind of surprised they weren't recalled. IMO they should have been.
If anyone else has any experience to impart, I'd appreciate it.
Thanks,
Jenn
JennM
Reefer
I've had some issues with Titanium heaters too... Won (which I hear the problems have been corrected with - this was a few years ago) and Pacific Coast.
The good old Ebo Jagr is hard to beat... I've been trying some Aqueon heaters (made by the former All-Glass Aquarium) and they seem OK - but they are glass - so that doesn't help the klutzes among us or folks who keep Cichlids that like to throw their decorations around...
Jenn
The good old Ebo Jagr is hard to beat... I've been trying some Aqueon heaters (made by the former All-Glass Aquarium) and they seem OK - but they are glass - so that doesn't help the klutzes among us or folks who keep Cichlids that like to throw their decorations around...
Jenn
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