AZSB and the decline of the EV aquarium store. (long)

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psimitry

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So this has been kinda brewing for a while now. And now since Paul has apparently left, and since AZSB really got on my bad side the other day by closing early (it was 6:40 and Marcus was locking up as I pulled in. As soon as Marcus saw that someone was pulling in, he bolted, never looking back), I thought I'd finally type this up.

So yeah - AZSB has definitely seen better times. It's kind of a shame too because AZSB was looking up to be my favorite fish store there for a bit. But it looks to be in sharp decline, so I think I'll try to write about it a bit, sort of give it a "what they did wrong and right" and try to relate that to the rest of the East Valley stores that seem (for the most part) to be in a general state of decline (disclaimer - this obviously comes from an anecdotal, customer perspective. I don't claim to be an expert on the aquarium store industry).

As far as AZSB goes though, here's kinda what I've always thought they did wrong:

1. The TV. It's not so much that the TV they had was a bad thing in and of itself, but it was the most outward symbol of the entire staff's lack of commitment to the store. I've worked in extremely slow stores at extremely slow times, so I know that despite what some people say that "there's ALWAYS something to do!", I don't really have a problem if there really isn't anything to do.

Except that at AZSB, there was some really obvious things that really DID need to be done. Really basic things like removing pricing on livestock tanks for items that were sold and writing it for new livestock. There were times that I would go in there and pricing for fish that had sold weeks ago were still there, and pricing for new fish wasn't - all the while Paul or whoever was working was sitting there watching TV.

2. Loss of Jack. There's no doubt that Jack barely new what he was doing when it comes to the aquarium hobby and I'm sure that was frustrating as all hell for him. BUT there's no doubt that he had an enthusiasm for helping people out. Even if Jack was in a bad mood, he was always friendly, always wanted to help and always followed up on things he committed to. Which brings me to:

3. A complete and utter lack of followup. This usually came in the form of Paul. As much as I really liked the guy, he seemed absolutely incapable of making sure that things got done. He always promised things and very rarely delivered. When I wanted a Sapphire skimmer for my skimmer, Paul told me that he could have it in several hours if I called and told him I wanted it. So at one point I did.... and it never showed up. A couple of days later I go in, talk to Jack, and he digs around, calls Paul, and it was never ordered. Jack took care of it and made sure that I got it.

Another good example was when I was looking for a Four-line wrasse. Paul told me that he could absolutely get ahold of one for me, and that he would put it on his next order. No problem, right? Wrong. It never showed up. I offered to pre-pay on one. Nope. Eventually, I was told that they're just really rare and that they couldn't get ahold of one.

I bought one from Aquarium Arts a few days later (he actually jumped on me last night. RIP little dude :( )

4. Pricing Overhead in that store was high, I'm sure. It was a good location with a decent amount of space. When the store opened, pricing was OUT. STANDING. You could buy buckets of ReefCrystals cheaper than I had ever seen them anywhere else. I actually considered moving back to Tropic Marin Pro for a bit due to how cheap it was there. Livestock was priced excellent, just in general, everything was cheap.

I remember talking to a buddy of mine after it opened that the pricing was awesome, but there's no way it could last.

How right I was.

Over the span of the next year, fish that would normally be $40-50 at some stores were $80-100+ at AZSB. The price of salt nearly doubled and the price of dry goods also rose sharply in price (the best example I noticed was the filter cartridges for my Biocube rose from $10 for a two pack to $15 for the same pack). Oddly enough, I don't think their liverock pricing ever rose from the excellent price it started with.

I get that items are never going to be as cheap in a retail outlet as they are for an online store. It wasn't so much that I had an issue with their rising pricing, it was the AMOUNT it rose, and I have to believe that if they rose pricing so sharply in order to pay the bills, it very likely cut down on the volume that they were getting (eventually, even though it was about 15 miles away, I started driving over to Aquarium Arts despite the fact that AZSB was less than a mile away).

5. Here Today, Gone Tomorrow! The types of items carried at AZSB changed WAAAAAY too often. Key here is the availability of food. Paul got me hooked on Laguna food when he suggested I try it out. One of his selling points to get me coming back for it was that AZSB was the only place in the valley it could be obtained.

Only AZSB was no longer carrying it. Why? Well at some point, Paul told me that AZSB owed the company who makes Laguna some $$$. <sigh>

In addition, things like PE Mysis was available only occasionally, and often times it was either in cubes or flatpack but not both.

6. "Premium catch fees." What. You mean that despite the fact that you put the cost of the fish on the tank itself, you're going to charge me more for it because you were dumb enough to put it in a display nanocube??

Yeah, so that one ended pretty quickly, but unfortunately so did the display tanks.

-------------------------------

So that's kind of everything that they did wrong, what did they do right?

1. Their corals. Though occasionally overpriced, AZSB's coral selection is quite simply the best I've seen for sale at any store in Arizona. Note, that it's not the best looking coral I've seen at a store, but all of the best looking corals are always in a tank labeled NFS. It's awesome that AZSB always had really good looking corals in their tank and they were for sale (even if the prices were rarely marked).

2. Their fish. One of the things I've always loved about AZSB is that you could always expect to go in there and find fish that you didn't often see at other LFS'. Not that theirs were the extreme exotic monstrosities that you saw at ATR at it's height (more on that in a bit), but that they were always in a range that you couldn't find at say Petco or whatnot, and they always looked in good shape.

3. their drygoods selection. It's strange actually, how I am continually going into this store and finding things that I didn't know they carry. Granted, they really need to advertise their dry goods a bit better, but I don't really know what they could feasibly do with their limited floorspace.

4. Paul as knowledgebase. Say what you will about Paul (and I did. :) ), but the man knew his stuff. When my tank was in mid-crash last November, he was able to talk me down from the metaphorical ledge, and get me to examine and diagnose my tank properly. We were able to figure out what was going on in my tank that was causing problems (in this case, a shattered glass heater) and get it fixed. I lost a few things here and there, but a was able to save a lot more.

-----------------------------------------

Suggestions for improvement:

So if Paul has left the store, and the remaining owners (not sure who that is at this point. AFAIK Jack left, Paul left... who's remaining?) want the store to improve, there's a few things that I think could really improve the store.

1. Commitment to the business comes, the TV goes. It seems obvious to me that the people who are currently in the employ of AZSB do not have the discipline necessary to have a TV in the store for downtime when there genuinely is nothing to do. It's simply too much of a temptation. This isn't a slam on the people who are there - I wouldn't have the discipline either. I'm WAAAY too lazy for something like that.

BUT, with a renewed commitment to the store and making sure that everything is done properly, I think that it could vastly improve the ability to make goods and livestock really move. Make sure that every fish in the store is properly labeled with a species and price (and preferably a date of arrival). Make sure that all of the food is properly priced in an easy to figure out method, rather than the random assortment of bar code stickers that is currently there. It's little things like that that make people buy.

2. Drop pricing as much as possible. I realize that in today's economic climate, it's tough to justify spending money on an aquarium when things like eating and paying the rent are necessary. Lowering pricing would help offset this. I don't expect to be able to walk in and get grand opening pricing, but at the same time, I don't expect to walk out and feel like I've just been mugged.

3. Once the TV is gone, START STOCKING TANKS IN IT'S PLACE. Seriously. Tanks are expensive as all hell, and keeping them in-stock is rough. But I think that they are an absolutely essential part of running an aquarium shop. Not that I'm advocating keeping in 7 240 Gallon tanks at any given time, but how about a couple 29's, a 55, a 90 and a 125? Likewise, it's dumb to have a (roughly) hundred square feet devoted completely to employee relaxation. It may sound like a good idea, but putting it up front where customers first walk in the door makes it seem like it's laziness.

4. Get new employees. It's really sad that the people who know the most about aquariums in the aquarium shops are really just kinda jerk-ish. It's plainly obvious that people like Marcus and Skip (ATR) know an absolute TON about the hobby, but they've also come off to me as really arrogant at times.

So yeah, I'd get new people, novices included. People that are actually excited about the prospect. And I'd almost recommend some type of uniform for the crew working. Something like "Red shirt = newbie, but can easily fish out a fish out of the tank for you" and "Blue Shirt = experienced aquarist."

5. Get the hours back up. So when the store opened, it was open until like 9, right? Then suddenly it was 8, now 7. It may be that it's not worth it to keep the store open that extra hour from 7-8. But y'know what? You pay your employees what.. $15 an hour? Max? The additional shop lights would cost what... $2 (the others are already on timers and run anyway)?

So let's assume that the operating cost for running that store is an extra $20. Well, I know I went in the other night expecting to buy about $50 in food and possibly livestock, so it wouldn't have been a completely bad idea. That and since, they would be the only fish store open after 7, it'd be a draw for people to come in.

6. In-store only weekend sales. I really think that the stores that do this have a good thing going. Make it known to your regular customers that you have in-store sales going on on the weekends. Say... I dunno.. 1-2 items on a deep discount. These specials wouldn't be in the newsletter (something I imagine that most people, like me, delete without reading anyway) and people have to come in to see them. I think that this would encourage a lot of impulse buying.

----------------------------------------------

So now that I've ranted about AZSB for a LOOONG time now, it's time to really talk about the general decline of stores in the East Valley.

For example, WHAT HAPPENED TO ATR? The last time I walked in there, I felt like I had walked into a friggin' ghost town. Half the coral tanks had water in them but very few corals, half the fish tanks had water in them but were empty. The shpw-sized exotics of old were gone and replaced with (in my opinion) petco caliber specimens. Their food selection has gone down to pretty much nothing, their liverock is even more insanely overpriced than it once was.. the place is simply a disaster. This doesn't hugely surprise me since I was told that Skip stopped managing the place and is now some sort of on-site aquarium maint guy.

Pets Inc. isn't all that much better off. Sure, they have a decent selection of fish, but all of their corals are very "meh" and overpriced, and it's clear that the store's focus is very much on freshwater. Not a whole lot to say about them. Their tank selection is definitely second to none is one thing I will definitely say is very nice about them.

Aquarium Arts is, in my humble opinion the best store in the EV right now, but even they're not without their faults. Their fish selection is in my opinion, the best I've seen for diversity and pricing, but their inverts are rather... unimpressive. They have a ton of tanks for their inverts but they're usually sparsely populated with the unimpressive specimen here and there, or with a sickly looking anemone, or something else you could just as easily pick up at Petco. Their coral selection is also less than stellar. I've simply never been impressed with their corals. OCCASIONALLY you go in there and find an interesting frag, but usually you walk in there expecting to find brown corals with brown polyps mixed with some brown. It's just not impressive. A shame too because they have some really nice coral tanks (not to mention their show tank which I've always thought was amazing).

I have yet to visit Arizona Ocean (or however it's called) so I can't really comment on it, but Reptiles and Reefs was a joke (at least it was the last time I was there with no signs of improving).

So yeah - EV stores seem to generally be declining. What's up with that? Is it the same across Phoenix?? I've heard good things about some of the central phoenix stores but never been, and it's a shame to see some of the best stores out here just go down from what they used to be.

Thoughts?
 
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......To many stores plain and simple IMO

Should be two three nice stores on the East side and one nice one on the west side so 4 fish stores for the how many millions of people in the valley sounds good to me.

Look at krispie creme they were on top of the world until they opened one ever 5 miles then the sales went to the birds and the whole thing went bankrupt
 
i think its called
the economy... rising gas prices... etc etc etc (EVERYTHING going up in price).

that is the one possible/probable answer to what you are asking!
(re east valley stores)

all the people who 'had' money
no longer do (disposable income atleast)... the disposable income they once had is gone... definitely less money to be spending on 'playing' - toys/hobbies/fish etc...

alas the current 'condition' of lfs/east valley
making less money = less inventory, less selection to choose from... they arent making the money to keep buying the exclusive corals, fish etc... and IT COST A FORTUNE to ship anything... so be prepared for everything hobby related to be going way up in price salt etc etc... its not their fault and is way beyond their control...

when it was brought up about azsb
few mos ago (here in local forum) - when jack or whoever it was asking to sell out his share of the business (the ad he place on craigslist)... i mentioned then that i didnt think azsb would be around much longer... when one has huge overhead but the DAY TO DAY operations were being run the way they were (basically chasing people away everyday - Paul et al)... then there is no way a store can make it... espec a super store like azsb was turning into(massive overhead)... they were already facing tough odds bec of the BAD TIMING they were up against (in opening the store - rapidly rising cost of living etc)... then couple that w/ chasing people away - there was no way they were going to make it... they needed all the customers they could get to pay the huge overhead
 
Definitely not a good time to open a SWF store in the valley, about a year and half ago after having just moved here I considered opening a Golf Retail Store of some sort, so glad I didn't with the economy being what it is. "Luxury" items just don't do so well in a down economy.

Still don't understand why when stores keep opening they are doing it in East Valley, even with housing market as it is, Buckeye, Avondale, Surprise, and Goodyear are still the fastest growing markets in the valley and four of the ten fastest growing suburbs in the country, and still not a single LFS over here. :mad:
 
I have a opinion of the industry in general and business practices but I will not post personal opinions about someone. Kicking someone with a family that lost a their dream is pretty bad karma.

Also, it's not like AZSB is the only business going under. As many of you know, there was a fish and coral wholesaler here in the valley. The owner is probably one of the nicest guys you would ever meet. He would do anything he could to help others and support their stores. Well, that business, after over 40 years in the valley, has gone under as well.

The first reason for these failed businesses is the economy. Disposable income seems to be at an all time low for the last decade. There are more fish tanks up for sale on Craigslist then I have ever seen and that is due to people cutting back on unnecessaary expenses. Livestock and equipment is one thing, but people are trying to cut back on their electric and water bills so the REEF is the first thing to go.

The other thing hurting these stores is direct buying at discounts. Places like Petsmart and possibly Pets Inc are able to have their own suppliers of fish and corals and eliminate the broker businesses like my wholesaler friends. They buy in bulk, ship out to all of their stores, and sell cheaper then everyone else. It is the same business plan as Walmart and Target. Anyone see the price of salt at petsmart recently? By my house it is cheaper then any of the LFS or about the same price. Even if it was $5 more, I would spend double that driving to a store on the East Side to buy it. Then again, with the price of salt at Drs Foster and Smith, it doesn't make sense to leave the house to buy it when it can come to me cheaper.

That is the final problem. The internet has changed many industries and it has a profound effect on the Aquarium business. Fish stores can't compete with online prices period.

There is good news for the LFS and the solution is being seen in the new Arizona Ocean I believe. Over commerical building is starting to crush the market the way residential building has the last couple of years. Soon, rents in strip malls where LFS's are usually built are going to fall dramatically and really reduce the overhead they are paying. Even established stores will be able to renegotiate their leases by thousands of dollars per month as these outlets sit empty. From what I've seen, "Now Available" is the fastest going business in the valley because I see their signs everywhere.:)

It will be interesting to see who survives the economic downturn and after its over, who rewards their customers by not driving up prices right away when the economy picks up.
 
A lot of things I agree with and a lot I do not but we all have our opinions....

- I can count 8+ times that I called in at around 10am on an out of stock - non stock item, stopped over and picked it up at 3pm for a great price! Never an issue.

- One time I ordered a phoenix bulb from Paul, that was the same time I was asking for a used bulb on the forum. I went into the store to pick it up and Paul told me straight that he forgot to order it and he felt really bad, He said he saw me looking for a used one and would be willing to take one out of one of his fixtures for me and sell it to me for an insane used / almost new bulb price and he did to keep me happy. Bulb was so new, did not have any spots or darkness in the center yet. Very happy about that as I was broke at the moment.

- Yeah the TV was a little much, but at the same time I used to see many customers on that couch watching tv or whatever. I even found myself watching the olympics for about 45 minutes one day while we laughed at Misty the volley ball player wanting the President to slap her on the arse haha.

- Jack would have been the one asking for a premium to catch a fish, he was a little off his rocker when he asked for more money to catch it.

- Marcos was generally cool & always gave crazy low prices if you asked, which definitly hurt the bottom line of the store but definitly had his bad days attitude wise. Not sure if he was angry about behind the scenes stuff, but still no excuse to not give it 100% and a smile to customers

I try not to get into the politics of a store but bottom line, business partners NEVER work out, one always ticks the others off no matter what. Always save and go at it alone and you have only yourself to blame.




Why the store will most likley fail no matter what and even when they moved in, I could not figure out how they would make it...

- The location is prime and very expensive
- A large of a store to start out with, no need for that kind of expense and square footage.
- Tried to be the best with wow factor, in the end they did not even get all the display tanks running before the collapse.
- Rather that go budget on lighting, at one point I counted like 18 250w MH's running. OMG that months electric bill had to be totally insane. I commented to my buddy "I bet in two weeks those are all gone" and sure enough over 1/2 were.
- In trying to be the best by a large margine on price, they shot themselves in the foot with the out of this world prices, then when they realized they could not make it at those price points, they raised them past goofy levels. Should have been balanced from day 1.


The only thing Paul did on a constant basis that really frustrated me was the fact that he flipped flopped on drygoods & opinions all the time. Made it seem like he just wanted to sell the item with the highest markup. One week "this is the best item X", then the next week it was "no this is the best item Y" Or "this is the best available" and when he no longer carried it, it was suddenly the worst product.

Customers are not dumb, I remember every word he said the previous week or day about products. That was my only complaint.
 
as far as AZSB is concerned
the behavior that i saw at that store... towards both myself/family and other customers/people visiting that place (literally each time we visited there was one thing or another until we just stopped going in)... as well as what would be considered 'cruel' behavior towards livestock in the store (feeding an ailing clam to the predator tank in front of customers/staff/my wife and family - w/ everyone ( but US) gathering around to cheer on the 'fanfare' thinking it was neat/cool)...

have no problem voicing my dislike for that place
the management and how it was being run!... its not like he was an 'innocent' bystander in this situation and was just down on his luck... HE PLAYED AN ACTIVE ROLE in this stores demise and that is a fact.

when someone opens a business for the 'public' to frequent
they better get their act together... no matter how much someone might like paul, and he may have had a vast storehouse of hobby knowledge etc BUT when it came to customer service/people skills/managing a 'RETAIL' operation - then he was seriously lacking in the skills necessary to be successful... in my experience in business people like paul are better off working behind the scenes as wholesalers etc etc - IOW not out in front of the public dealing w/ customers on a day to day basis... retail/customer service is about (((((kissing a**))))), knowing how to ETC ETC ETC (all varying degrees of this)... he didnt have that and would even question people about using credit/debit cards for making small purchases (they are charged fees for this which cuts into their 'profit')

sorry but that hole was 'dug'
that store isnt the victim of bad luck etc... it was run into the ground.
 
There is good news for the LFS and the solution is being seen in the new Arizona Ocean I believe. Over commerical building is starting to crush the market the way residential building has the last couple of years. Soon, rents in strip malls where LFS's are usually built are going to fall dramatically and really reduce the overhead they are paying. Even established stores will be able to renegotiate their leases by thousands of dollars per month as these outlets sit empty. From what I've seen, "Now Available" is the fastest going business in the valley because I see their signs everywhere.:)

It will be interesting to see who survives the economic downturn and after its over, who rewards their customers by not driving up prices right away when the economy picks up. [/B]



I agree with that statement 100%. While not a jaw dropper with livestock, Az Ocean is the first start up store that I have seen that will most likley make it as overhead would be very low. That is what impressed me about the store. Smart business & a SUPER good attitude.

I do not care about...
- a large building
- TONS of items in stock
- Lots employees.
- Fancy huge display tanks you have to swim in to get a coral from the bottom

I care about...
- health of the livestock / keep the darn tanks clean & get rid of dead fish!!! It happens to all stores, but do not let them rot in the tanks!
- A clean store. I hate seeing food left in counters from lunch & so on.
- a good attitude with a smile & welcome back without blowing smoke up a customers rear. Answer a customers question to the best of your ability but if you do not know somthing, do not be afraid to say so. This hobby is MASSIVE, I do not expect anyone to know it all. But of course knowing the basics is a must.
- have reasonable prices on items compared to the net and be able to get those items within around 24-48 hours. Would not EVER ask a LFS to match online prices, but if they can come within $5-10 on an item, no problem. Just do not hose me on prices
 
It's the volume of customers pure and simple. I know some stores had lost over 25% of their sales even before the sub-prime and $4 gas hit. It appeared to start when gas got > $2.50. That directly drives the level of stocking and inventory carried. Shipping is driving prices up. (I wonder when the on-line shops will have to raise shipping. They have to be losing money big time.)

And yes the Internet and group buys are really starting to hurt. When the economy was great those had a small impact. When you've already lost >25% of your business it matters a great deal more.

I won't comment on specific stores. I disagree with much of what was said. I do feel that maybe in this economy our expectations are a bit higher than can be realistically be met...
 
My shopping at fish stores is not going to keep anyone in business but;
Last time I was at ASB it was almost difficult to get the guy off of his butt so he could catch me some fish. I had emailed first & was promised a pretty good deal and that deal never happened. I dropped a couple hundred bucks, it was like pulling teeth to get waited on & I was not given the discount that I had expected after all. I could have gone somewhere slightly closer, payed about the same & may or may not have gotten better service. Haven't been back since.
I almost went to ATR last week but I called first & they talked me out of bothering over the phone.
Haven't been to AA for a few years now. The last several times I went in the service was lousy & the prices were high. When I bought a fish that ended up dying 2 days later of something that I am very sure it was sick with when I bought it. I shouldn't have bought the fish but that fish also shouldn't have been for sale.
When I really need something so far, I usaully end up driving out to Aqua Touch. It's quite a drive, kinda expensive & they don't always have the best selection but they have never pst me off or sold me anything that was sick.
I look forward to checking out Az Ocean one of these days.
Frizz
Frizz
 
Re: AZSB and the decline of the EV aquarium store. (long)

1. The TV. It's not so much that the TV they had was a bad thing in and of itself, but it was the most outward symbol of the entire staff's lack of commitment to the store. I've worked in extremely slow stores at extremely slow times, so I know that despite what some people say that "there's ALWAYS something to do!", I don't really have a problem if there really isn't anything to do.
For those of you that don't have a family to take to the LFS with you, perhaps a TV would be something that you didn't think belonged there. I personally loved it so that I could look around and chat without having to worry what my kids were into and which employees were giving me the evil eye because I brought my children with me.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13395543#post13395543 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Philwd

I won't comment on specific stores. I disagree with much of what was said. I do feel that maybe in this economy our expectations are a bit higher than can be realistically be met...

I couldn't agree more Phil. Each store in the valley has their pluses and minuses. Whether it be price, health of livestock, customer service etc. I am sad for Paul that this did not work out for him and wish him only the best of luck.
 
Re: Re: AZSB and the decline of the EV aquarium store. (long)

Re: Re: AZSB and the decline of the EV aquarium store. (long)

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13395850#post13395850 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by buffalobunch
Each store in the valley has their pluses and minuses. Whether it be price, health of livestock, customer service etc. I am sad for Paul that this did not work out for him and wish him only the best of luck.

I totally agree. Running a business is hard. Starting one even harder & retail is the worst. Takes luck, commitment & lots of money to get it up & running well.
Frizz
 
im not going to bag on you taht put paul down... but the truth is many of you wernt there when the store was first opened for a dry run. paul was a different man back then.... sadly many, and i do mean MANY things have gone wrong along the way. alot of it having to do with hassels of contractors and the display tanks. its no wonder then i have seen paul go from a enthuastic koweledge filled man (sometimes cocky) to a sometimes bitter and upset man, he bet it all on his dream and it sadly didnt work out... i think we all need to get of his back, i know too well how it feels to put a large time and money investment into a project only to have it ultimently fail :( you will be missed paul, and i cant thank you enough for getting me my start in the hobby. when i went all round the valley looking for help, and was ignored, lied too or price gouged (200 dollars for 20lbs of white poor looking live rock!) you were there giving me great advice and prices, and all the while being repsectful that i was on a budget, not like some store that said.... well if you cant afford this light (MH light for like 500 over only a 15 gallon tank!) you shouldnt even be ooking at saltwater tanks. you will be missed :)
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13395543#post13395543 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Philwd
It's the volume of customers pure and simple. I know some stores had lost over 25% of their sales even before the sub-prime and $4 gas hit. It appeared to start when gas got > $2.50. That directly drives the level of stocking and inventory carried. Shipping is driving prices up. (I wonder when the on-line shops will have to raise shipping. They have to be losing money big time.)

And yes the Internet and group buys are really starting to hurt. When the economy was great those had a small impact. When you've already lost >25% of your business it matters a great deal more.

I won't comment on specific stores. I disagree with much of what was said. I do feel that maybe in this economy our expectations are a bit higher than can be realistically be met...



well you (might) have a point!

if the economy was still strong and cost of living where it has been (up to the last few years)

then stores like azsb/atr
could still stay in business EVEN THOUGH they either provided terrible customer service, maintained and air of 'elite-ism' (like membership dues were to be collected to be a customer there :lol: ) arrogance etc

ETC ETC ETC
(all that has already been mentioned - bottom line being BAD customer service/relations)... iow in in spite of these 'negatives' they were still going to be around/in business

driving some people away
(like myself/family)... while still maintaining their regulars - who would still be enough to keep the lights on or even better to have allowed them to continued to THRIVE... keeping the wallet fat!

under this set of (good economic) circumstances
these stores could read our little negative 'critiques' of their stores (on the forum) and laugh all the way to the bank... WHO CARES under these circumstances - the lights are staying on and the bank balance is looking good!

unfortunately (imo) azsb/staff took this attitude to BEGIN WITH
like he/azsb was the <font size="5" color="#0000FF">profanity removed</font> and were here to stay... they were the new big boys on the block and were here for world domination... it was a luxury for anyone to be able to frequent these doors... they (customers) are lucky we dont charge admission to enter!... then walk into the store and have employees w/ BIG CHIPS ON THEIR SHOULDERS not even give a welcome greeting or be cordial/friendly whatsoever - but the opposite - very unwelcome climate/attitudes like they didnt want our business or need it.

end of story...
look where it got them... that store no matter what the economic 'atmosphere' of the times... was going down the wrong path... even under better times that store was headed for doom - it may have just taken a little while longer...

when it was brought up about jack selling his share of the business
(discussed here on rc few mos back)... i mentioned then that they would be out of business in 6mos to a year... I WAS WRONG... it was sooner!... i also said in that thread that the best thing the partners could do is GET RID OF PAUL and put up a sign saying UNDER NEW MGMT and that is (what looks like) finally what they ended up doing hopefully these decisions were not made too LATE!

when i was in there and met Jack
as i understand it either he owns the childrens shop across the way... which is a very nice childrens store (looks like its 'professionally' run) and my wife and i have gone in there several times and made purchases... iow its a friendly, agreeable, customer service oriented business w/ nice friendly staff there waiting to help out... i never understood how one store w/ the same owner could be run so much differently... when i met jack- who seems to be the yin to pauls yang... i realized the difference in how the 2 stores were being run... and who was responsible for the climate at the reef store

i wish Jack and any other partner in that business
the best of luck turning things around... i also hope they have enough cumulative experience to run a store like that and get it turned around... i would imagine that if they put it up for sale there might be enough interest (one of the other lfs?) that they might be able to recoup some of their losses - but that is doubtful (considering how much money/CREDIT was seemingly dumped into that location)... there are all types of 'getting out' scenarios that could be entertained (vs bankruptcy or going out of business) but these scenarios usually never indicate recouping any losses... although sometimes it can save ones credit etc etc (they STILL have a very expensive lease in someones name who has to keep paying whether the store goes out of business or not!!!)
 
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It is very difficult to meet everyones expectations in a retail store. Apparently more so for a passonate hobby like this one. Customer Service is the driving force that allows one busimess to succed where so many others fail.

Ownership must take complete responsibilty when customer service fails. It is a primary business requirement that begins at the top..i.e. ownership level. This fundamental requirement must be instilled by ownership/management. If customer service is not present, then the employees are not provided with the necessary support, leadership amd management.

I'm uncertain of the ownership structure and capital availability for this busimess, but AZSB and Marcus were the driving force of our entry into the hobby. We are grateful for the time and energy extended to us while we were shopping and learning at the same time. If in fact, AZSB does not survive, it will be a loss felt by many in the hobby.

If funds and misinformation are not an issue for you, there are many other LFS in the area to shop. We will all be reduced to settle the best that each has to offer...at least while we still have several options to consider, instead of having it at one stop.

Of course, I would prefer each LFS to provide scores of knowledgable and trained employees to answer all my insane questions. It would be better if they would then offer internet pricing. It's uncertain how they would be able to afford to pay the employees with such pricing and store front expenses! But hey, the owners should be there to help us....profit should not be expected. We should all offer our savings to start and operate a business at a loss or breakeven with loads of risk.

It sounds like many recognized the initial business plan as weak and unrealistic. But we are glad to take advantage of the prices when offered. I would too. But should we complain with such anger when they tried to correct it?

Every visit to AZSB has not been perfect. There were times it could and should have been better. I'm hopeful their problems can be solved. If not, let's hope the remaining LFS can learn form our comments and improve their business.

I would be happy if the LFS would offer honest information, be there as a source of information for complex questions with multiple opinions and offer reasonable prices that allows the busimess to survive. If they could present this with a smile and good attitude, we would all shop there.
 
seriously neptune.... jack was an artard ... so he was nice! big deal... i dont go in their to meet nice people or have a good life ecperience , its not a church or a effing bar. its a fish store and i go there for INFO. and paul had a TON of that, sure he was rough around the edges, but he knew his ****.... get off his back... from all your posts you make it seem like he killed your child or something sheesh!
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13398387#post13398387 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by KRASHPD
Looks like its about time for the in before the lock video.

I think you're probably right. It's a shame. My purpose for opening this thread wasn't necessarily to say "anyone/everyone sucked and they should be put to death for it!!!" The point was to discuss the (at least my perception of) the appearance that a lot of the stores around here seem to be in sharp decline.

More to the point, it was also in hopes that the shop owners around the valley (and I know they're on here) including AZSB could get a general read on what they were doing right, what they were doing wrong, and how they could improve.

Bummer I guess that it's degraded into a he said/did match.
 
It's almost funny..

When someone leaves a company.. How the haters come out of the woodwork..

Usually, it's 2 or 3 people.. That are the most vocal.

Those haters amongst us, you know who you are..

Yes, Paul was rough around the edges at times.. I think alot of people forget a couple things tho. AZSB was NEVER Paul's primary job.. He kept, and still has to this day his day job in IT. Without it.. AZSB would have never happened. Thankfully his employer let him work remotely or from home (read: he did his day job @ the fish store)

What I think a few people have mistaken for rudeness boils down to the fact the man was either on the phone for his work, or he was having a stressful day with the day job.. We all have them.. Cut the man some slack.. No one's perfect.. Do you have any idea how hard it is to essentially work 2 jobs, and be a father? And still manage to be friendly and approachable 24/7??

Could he have been more friendly.. Yes.. But is that any reason to crucify him here publicaly on a forum he can't defend himself on? (You all do know he's banned from RC right?)

AZSB isn't going anywhere to my knowledge.. Yes, they've had some issues with Partners, and they've had their problems.. But tell me this..

WHAT STORE HASN'T??
 
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