Cheap, effective 12v Li-ion Battery Backup for Vortech

[bhazard451]

There have been a few DIY battery backup threads using Sealed Lead Acid batteries to create a battery backup for a Vortech (or Apex.. etc). There aren't many that show Li-ion batteries being used.

While a SLA 12v 18000mah initially costs less, you still need to add a charger, fuse, wires, plug, etc. The battery is also 15lbs.

These Li-ion batteries already have the charger and wires connected, and only need a fuse and plug end. You can get a plug + fuse for $1.50 each + $3 shipping from Ecotech. Just cut the one attached to the battery, and solder the ecotech wire on, and you'll have a compact, fully functional battery backup you can use for your Vortech.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/14075746437...X:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1427.l2649#ht_5976wt_1060

They have these on ebay in 6800, 9800, and 18000mah batteries, but the 6800mah are the best bang for the buck. You could have two on hand, 13600mah of battery power, for $38. The 9800mah battery itself costs around $34, and the 18000mah $80+.

Although it would cost the same as a SLA DIY battery backup when approaching 18000mah, A Li-ion setup is a bit easier, much smaller, lighter, sleek, offers more mounting options, and can last longer (charging cycles). It is also what is used in the official Vortech backup itself. The on/off switch is a nice touch.

I refuse to spend $165+ for basically the same thing from Ecotech, but I cannot go another power outage without a backup. This is the best way I've found.

 

[Landsailor]

I don't know what Vortech is using, but I've been around electric helicopters enough to know that I simply do not trust cheaply made lithium batteries. Nothing on that auction that mentioned a charge controller and that gives me the heeby-jeebies.

It will probably work just fine if the power goes out when you're home and awake to connect it, but it's not "basically the same thing" unless you're putting it inline with automatic switching and charging capabilities.

If you're out of town and come home to a dead tank, will it be worth what you "saved"?

 

[bhazard451]

I don't know what Vortech is using, but I've been around electric helicopters enough to know that I simply do not trust cheaply made lithium batteries. Nothing on that auction that mentioned a charge controller and that gives me the heeby-jeebies.

It will probably work just fine if the power goes out when you're home and awake to connect it, but it's not "basically the same thing" unless you're putting it inline with automatic switching and charging capabilities.

If you're out of town and come home to a dead tank, will it be worth what you "saved"?

If you don't have a battery backup at all, the same line of thinking can be applied if you are home or not. At least with a backup, you have a chance. It also plugs directly into the Vortech controller, charges, and switches in-line just fine.

If you weren't comfortable not seeing overcharge protection in the listing, just use another listing that mentions it? The On/Off switch is even safer if you want to shut it off instead of continually being on, as long as you are around when an outage occurs.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Portable-12..._Batteries&hash=item337253e8fa#ht_4166wt_1060

How much different do you think the design is inside of a vortech backup unit? Trickle charger, 12v 18000mah battery, fuse. Its not exactly cutting edge tech.

 

[Trevenator]

Thanks bhazard. Im placing a order now.
Just going to get a 6800mAH and the plug + fuse.
Great peace of mind for around $24 for my mp10w

 

[bhazard451]

Thanks bhazard. Im placing a order now.
Just going to get a 6800mAH and the plug + fuse.
Great peace of mind for around $24 for my mp10w

6800mah (if it really is 6800mah), should last about a day for an MP10.

 

[turtlespd]

Hmmm I was just searching this issue and love the idea. Is there a way to tell how long one 6800mah battery will last on a single mp10. I also like the idea of using two 6800 and maybe even three. If I do decide to use two or three on one vortech, how should this be wired?

 

[Dapg8gt]

Good thinking. Tagging this one to give a go. Thanks.

 

[bhazard451]

I would be running two separately, just swapping when one dies. For safety reasons, I would just buy a bigger battery if you didn't want to do that.

I'm not sure how things would react with the charger if the batteries were connected by their wires in parallel, so I wouldn't attempt it unless someone else knows a bit more on that. Normally, it would charge fine and just take twice as long, but I don't like to take chances without being 100% sure.

 

[turtlespd]

I would be running two separately, just swapping when one dies. For safety reasons, I would just buy a bigger battery if you didn't want to do that.

I'm not sure how things would react with the charger if the batteries were connected by their wires in parallel, so I wouldn't attempt it unless someone else knows a bit more on that. Normally, it would charge fine and just take twice as long, but I don't like to take chances without being 100% sure.

I was under the impression one of these guys could offer 12-24hrs on a mp10. If that is possible then I'll give it a shot but I don't want to spend 80 bucks on one of these.

 

[bhazard451]

I was under the impression one of these guys could offer 12-24hrs on a mp10. If that is possible then I'll give it a shot but I don't want to spend 80 bucks on one of these.

6800mah can run an MP10 around 24 hours.

 

[turtlespd]

Just bought one! Thanks bhazard51.

 

[bvoss]

One thing to consider. If you short out, or over charge a LI battery it will go into thermal runaway. It will melt and produce a metal fire that you cannot even put out with a fire extinguisher. Cheap LI batteries are worse. They are not DIY friendly.

Search e-bay for a 12v Belkin UPS. You can get them for less than $20 shipped. I just bought 10 for my club for $12.50 each including shipping. You can replace the plug on the unit with a fused cable you buy from Eco Tech for $1.50. That leaves you with a 7 AH backup with about 10 minutes work.

Just an alternative....

 

[bvoss]

I forgot to mention that those Belkin units use-old fashioned gel cells. The include the automatic switching and charging circuits and are UL approved. They are also a plug-and-play backup for an Apex. The cable the comes with plugs right in.

During the last power failure these units drove an MP40 for 8 hours. Another one.powered my Apex for more than 12.

 

[Aporia]

+1 on BVOSS' warning. Li-Po can be dangerous if not treated properly. I am into model airplanes and there are many stories of people burning down their home or shop from Li-Po issues. I use them but keep them in a surplus ammunition box! They can be fine but the energy density approaches that of a hand grenade. If you go that route make sure you do research on the charge and protection circuits required. If you let the battery drain completely dead you can destroy some or all of the cells.

 

[brandon429]

Im a big rc head too, as soon as I saw the pricing they are offering for 3s at that mah I didn't even bother to click. In rc circles if you want a reliable 3s that won't burn your house down, you are going to pay at least $150 per 5000mah. Plus you will need to balance the cells occasionally if not every charge to be safe, lipo w beat sla but not in the initial cost of protective/servicing equipment.

 

[Landsailor]

My friends say "don't charge LiPos in any building you want to keep."

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

 

[bhazard451]

The charger and overprotection circuit are absolutely vital. It does come with it, but yes should it fail and the batteries ever were overcharged, they would be dangerous. All batteries can be, but li-ions are that much more dense.

Where are the $12 belkins available? The 12v ones at $12 I found were 3.5ah, not 7.

Another thing to remember, if you have a smartphone, you are already handling and charging a ~1800mah Li-ion battery every day. The extended one in my phone is 4200mah.

 

[Haxer]

One thing to consider. If you short out, or over charge a LI battery it will go into thermal runaway. It will melt and produce a metal fire that you cannot even put out with a fire extinguisher. Cheap LI batteries are worse. They are not DIY friendly.

Search e-bay for a 12v Belkin UPS. You can get them for less than $20 shipped. I just bought 10 for my club for $12.50 each including shipping. You can replace the plug on the unit with a fused cable you buy from Eco Tech for $1.50. That leaves you with a 7 AH backup with about 10 minutes work.

Just an alternative....

Could you provide a link, I searched too but found only the battries, not the chargers too.

 

[ArrecifeJunkie]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Belkin-Batt...wer_Supplies&hash=item3371c0b7fd#ht_847wt_952

7.2Ah according to Belkin website.

 

[bhazard451]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Belkin-Batt...wer_Supplies&hash=item3371c0b7fd#ht_847wt_952

7.2Ah according to Belkin website.

Those are all used, and possibly approaching end of life... which is less safe to continually charge anyway.