Copper question for the chemistry gods

[acceler8]

I'm planning a little DIY project and I need to know in what ways copper reacts with an aquarium. In my project, a copper pipe will be near the surface of the water but not actually touching. There will be no opportunity for splashing, condensation runoff, etc. Completely isolated except for ambient airflow. My question is, will the marine environment cause copper particles to become airborne and settle in the tank? And even if so, in high enough concentrations to matter? There also could be brass and silver involved as well.

Thanks!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

How near is near? Any chance for condensation or effluent from the pipes to land in the water? What is the pipe for?

No, I do not believe that any copper will become airborne and become a problem. The only concern, IMO, is liquid water moving from the pipes to the tank water.

 

[rrome]

Doing this is just asking for trouble down the line...

 

[acceler8]

Thanks for the replies! This will be a copper tube that is sheathed in a titanium tube. Only titanium will be in contact with the water, with the copper section exposed well above the water line. I plan on using some sort of plastic barrier between the two preventing any moisture from running down the combined tubes. There really is no other way than to use copper.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Can you describe the use, or is it a secret?

 

[Jens Kallmeyer]

HI

Never underestimate Aerosols. They can fly further than you think and there is more of them than you can possibly imagine. Salt aerosols can reach the tubing, causing corrosion and eventually transport the stuff back into your tank

I had an ugly case with a radioactive liquid forming aerosols in a lab. we had to scrub that place for hours to get it clean again. And the source was just a 100 ml beaker, standing on a table for a few hours and bubbling slightly, not an aquarium with water movement.

I think you are asking for trouble

Best wishes

Jens

 

[acceler8]

Actually this is somewhat of a secret right now, but I plan to post here, and possibly in the DIY section if all goes well.

I was afraid of exactly what you are referring to, Jens. I'm trying to devise a way now to minimize the risk. Thanks for the concern.

P.S. How accurate are copper test kits at extremely low levels? If accurate enough, I might try my plan on an empty SW tank for several months and chart the levels.

 

[bertoni]

The hobbyist test kits don't detect low enough levels to be useful for reef aquariums. Invertebrates are often sensitive to doses down in the ppb range.

 

[Jens Kallmeyer]

HI

If you can test it on an empty SW tank, just drop in a piece of Xenia, mushroom or Zoo. If it survives, there shouldn't be any harmful concentrations of copper. The testkits are not sensitive enough, if they show you something, it is too late.

Best wishes

Jens

 

[acceler8]

Thanks for all the advice, and a test tank with some Xenia sounds like just the ticket, I will try that.

Now for a new related question:
I am going to be using Titanium as well and all I can find is AMS 4945B which is HAYNES Ti-3Al-2.5V alloy (Titanium - 3% Aluminum - 2.5% Vanadium). I did do some research and found that trace Vanadium can be somewhat helpful with calcium uptake, and that aluminum is pretty much bad on all accounts. My question is, could these metals leech out of an alloy? Do Titanium aquarium heaters really use pure titanium? True c/p Titanium is $$$!


Thanks again!!!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I don't really know much about potential leaching from titanium alloys, and which are more or less suitable. Aside from corrosion issues for the device, I wouldn't worry too much about leaching of aluminum or vanadium from a mostly titanium alloy in terms of toxicity.