Electronic HQI ballasts/Magnetic HQI

[ksed]

I've seen some companies advertizing electronic hqi ballasts.
Can they drive an hqi bulb eg. Aqua Connect or BLV as efficiently as a magnetic hqi ballast.

 

[bboy aqua]

as long as its the ballast wattage and bulb match then that ballast will fire hqi bulbs

 

[OneReef]

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=1236502

 

[wife no likey]

I don't think the question was whether or not it will fire the bulb, but if it will actually drive it at the increased wattage.

For example, does the icacap 400w actually behave like 430w hps "son agro"?

 

[DarG]

Electronics are more efficient than mag HQI's with most DE bulbs when the bulbs are new atleast. It's not efficiency that is the issue, its output as in par. Only the magnetic HQI can deliver the higher wattages that many DE bulbs (and HQI rated SE) can draw from the ballast. They arent limited to 250 watts plus a few percent that electronic ballasts are. Electronic HQI's are only true hqi in that they can fire the bulbs and keep them lit. The magnetic HQI ballasts are capable of higher wattage delivered to the bulbs which translates into higher par levels from the bulbs. The cost is that they do use more energy to do so. There is also information suggesting other "issues" with DE lamps run on electronic ballasts (available on the web if you are interested) The DE lamps are spec'd for magnetic HQI ballasts as well (M80 for 250 watt and M81 for 150 watt) as they are designed to be run at the higher output.
You have to be careful becase not all HQI magnetic ballasts are true hqi either. The PFO M80 and M81 and the Sunlight Supply Blue Wave M80 and M81 are.

Lower par, less electricity used ... Electronic

maximum par, more electricity used ... TRUE HQI magnetic ballast.

 

[ksed]

Thanks DarG for your message. I'm currently running 2 400watt bulbs (usho 14K HQI spec) on a 400 watt PFO HQI ballast. I currently have some issues with the ballast where it has a slight humming noise. It does go away after a couple of hours of operation. I contacted PFO directly to see if we can resolve any issues and they said there is nothing they can do unless the noise is excessively loud. I'm just preparing myself incase the ballast goes - I'm wondering if you know of any other manufacturer that make HQI ballasts in a 400 watt form. BTW, the ballasts are about 3 months old. I'm aware that the product comes from Advance Lighting. Do you know off hand if the ballast I own is a true HQI ballast?

From what I understand, HQI ballasts are prominent in Europe. Do you know why the electronic hasn't taken off in Europe, especially since the HQI is more efficient in electrical consumption?

BTW, I agree with you about the Sens. Unfortunately, I'm from Toronto and we know that we suck, so we're stuck cheering for the other guys!

 

[DarG]

Not really such thing as a true HQI for 400 watt. It's basically a 430 watt HPS ballast. Actually I think it is exactly a 430 watt HPS ballast. Im not real familiar with the details of the 400 watt bulbs other than very few would be considered actual HQI. But I believe that the 430 watt HPS ballast is what is recommended for these bulbs as far as magnetic ballasts. There is a designation for these ballasts but Im not positive if it is a real ANSI designation like that of the lower wattage halides.
I am pretty sure that the PFO that you have meets that designation, is a 430 watt HPS ballast and is the best magnetic ballast to use with those few HQI 400 watters.

If electronics havent taken off in Europe it's probably because they know that the DE's are spec'd for magnetic HQI and electronics are completely different. There are several factors that are believed to very possibly be negatives of electronic ballasts for DE bulbs besides lower output and color shift. It tends to start an argument on the forums so I leave it alone. I would have to assume that these may be why electronics arent popular in europe assuming that they arent and referring to 250 watt and 150 watt DE bulbs anyway.

The absolute best person to ask to on the forum is PaulErik. He will either provide more information, the right information or some of both. Seriously, contact PaulErik by PM or direct a thread to him.

Well, I think you gotta pick some new other guys because the Sens arent gonna be around long. I love playoff hockey even with how screwed up the NHL has become.

 

[ksed]

DarG Thanks for your reply
I agree with the NHL , I actually have lost some interest over the years due to the screw-ups,But we'll leave it at that.
Thanks for the reference.

 

[submytion]

I love my 3 HQI PFO electronic ballasts. They run cool.

 

[ksed]

Sorry I forgot to mention it on the last post, do you use ethanol or any other form of bacterial supplement to keep the water clear.

 

[DarG]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12319760#post12319760 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ksed
Sorry I forgot to mention it on the last post, do you use ethanol or any other form of bacterial supplement to keep the water clear.

Me? ... no.

 

[hahnmeister]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12315675#post12315675 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bboy aqua
as long as its the ballast wattage and bulb match then that ballast will fire hqi bulbs

You cant fire DE or HQI rated SE bulbs on a probe start ballast though. You also dont want to run SE bulbs on HQI ballasts (they will fire, but have a glorious short lifespan).

 

[ganjero]

so xm 10k 250w DE will run better on a magnetic hqi ballast than on the ice caps?

 

[ksed]

If the XM DE is an hqi bulb then yes it will run better on an hqi ballast or m80 if thats a 250watt bulb.

 

[ksed]

ganjero if you look at XM webpage it mentions that the XM250wDE bulb is spec to run on a m80 ballast which is an hqi in North American standards

 

[DarG]

Every DE bulb that I have seen specs for is spec'd for M80 ballast if its 250 watt and M81 if its 150 watt. Those are magnetic HQI ballasts. There is a warning though that many M80 (and M81) ballasts sold in the US are not true HQI magnetics as per euro. spec. Some of them, mainly asian made, are actually just standard pulse start ballasts. The PFO and SLS Blue Wave M80 and M81 ballasts are true HQI magnetics as in they run the bulbs to the European specs for HQI magnetic ballasts. These ballasts are not any more expensive that some of the more popular electronics, in fact they dual versions are less than buying two of some of the electronics and only a few dollars more than a pair of some of the other popula electronic ballasts. A dual PFO or Blue Wave HQI mag. ballast is in the 220 - 240 dollar range.

Check the ballast spec for the DE lamps near the bottom of this link ...
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-03/sj/index.php

 

[PaulErik]

Most of the major brand 250-watt DE lamps are built to ANSI M80 / European high current (HQI) electrical specs. The ones listed in that article are built to that standard (3.0 amp lamp current).

I’ve been sent some sample 250-watt DE lamps and some of the Chinese imports really confused me after testing them. The North American companies importing these lamps were listing them as M80 spec lamps. Then I finally got in touch with the actual lamp manufacturer I found these lamps were actually built to another standard (ANSI M138/M153) which is a low current (2.1 amp) lamp. This maybe why some of the prebuilt DE fixtures are equipped with pulse start (ANSI M138/M152) ballasts. What gets more confusing is why the lamp manufacturer prints M80 on the lamps and packaging while the electrical data sheets from the manufacturer don’t even meet M80 specs.

 

[DarG]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12335251#post12335251 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by PaulErik
Most of the major brand 250-watt DE lamps are built to ANSI M80 / European high current (HQI) electrical specs. The ones listed in that article are built to that standard (3.0 amp lamp current).

I’ve been sent some sample 250-watt DE lamps and some of the Chinese imports really confused me after testing them. The North American companies importing these lamps were listing them as M80 spec lamps. Then I finally got in touch with the actual lamp manufacturer I found these lamps were actually built to another standard (ANSI M138/M153) which is a low current (2.1 amp) lamp. This maybe why some of the prebuilt DE fixtures are equipped with pulse start (ANSI M138/M152) ballasts. What gets more confusing is why the lamp manufacturer prints M80 on the lamps and packaging while the electrical data sheets from the manufacturer don’t even meet M80 specs.

Thats not a shocker Ive read about cheap chinese built DE lamps being run on HQI magnetic ballasts, true M80, not M138's and lasting only a few months. Im sure that these are really meant to run on M138's. Many of the ebay 9.99 - 29.99 DE's if not all of them will probably burn out quick on the PFO or Blue Wave M80's. The Current USA 250 watt mag ballast included with their 250 watt DE fixtures is an M138 ... yet they call the fixtures and lamps HQI. Very confusing for anyone who doesnt do some research first. PaulErik, that is why your contributions to the forum and your presence here is very valuable. I for one appreciate the help and information that you provide. Thank you again.

 

[ErikS]

Are we certain it's limited to the no-name imports?

Many love them but I had the same experience with ReefLux bulbs, fired on a genuine M80 (AquaMedic - I've been inside the box, certainly an M80 ballast). As Hahn said they had a sort & glorious life (two bulbs, not just a single bad example)............the only DE I've had fail in such a short order (less than 6mos).

You'll note the company only sells electronic ballasts = their own product doesn't drive them to the max.

 

[hahnmeister]

I think many of the cheaper bulbs from the Orient may be the same way (except the pheonix it seems). My EVC's just dimmed rather fast... even for a 20,000K. Helios, Arcadia, Happy Reefing, etc... as well as Coralife, Current USA... etc... most likely all cheap bulbs.

Moral of the story... pay the price for the better bulbs by Ushio, Giesemann (Ushio still lol), Radium, etc. The electricity you waste by buying the cheaper bulb which loses output so much faster will exceed the higher up-front cost.