Excellent article in March issue of Reefkeeping!

[rshimek]

Hi,

The bottom line on what was tested and what wasn't....

1)I used IO and it is the most popular salt, so I wanted to test it.

2)There have been some questions about Coralife for years, so I wanted to test it.

3)Dennis Tagrin of DT's said that the salt he used in his culturing was low in heavy metals, so I wanted to test it.

4)A hobbyist who heard I was running the tests sent me a free bag of the Bio-Sea, so I tested it.

At this point, I had enough physical space in my office lab for the 88 beakers that testing 4 salts, 2 hobbyists, 2 controls would entail.

And, at this point, I had spent about $1000 in equipment, supplies, urchins, and chemicals for the test.

So I went with that.

Another experimental run would cost about another $500 to $750. I could not and can not afford to do another one, so I didn't test any of the other salts.

 

[ddenham]

Two questions:

And, at this point, I had spent about $1000 in equipment, supplies, urchins, and chemicals for the test.

So I went with that.

Another experimental run would cost about another $500 to $750. I could not and can not afford to do another one, so I didn't test any of the other salts.

Is there any way we (through RC) could help subsidize this sort of research?

also, have the salt dealers made any sort of statements? Do you expect them to? I know it's still early.

 

[rshimek]

Originally posted by ddenham

Hi,

Is there any way we (through RC) could help subsidize this sort of research?

Not as far as I know. And, frankly, I don't have much interest in doing more of it. The effort is significant, the rewards pretty near zero.

also, have the salt dealers made any sort of statements?

I don't know of any.

Do you expect them to?

I really don't know. I suppose I half expect to be sued, but who knows.

 

[ddenham]

Not as far as I know. And, frankly, I don't have much interest in doing more of it. The effort is significant, the rewards pretty near zero.

I don't necessarily mean another salt study, but a way to help you with your seemingly ongoing research. The idea that you should be putting out your own funds for something we all benefit from is ludicrous.

 

[Harpo]

I too would like to contribute $ or whatever to your efforts. Let us know.
Mark

 

[Harpo]

For anyone wondering about relative costs:

My last bucket of Red Sea from PetCo (didn't have time to get to my lfs) was $59.99.

The cost of Crystal Sea Bioassay with shipping to area code 95969 in Calif. from Florida was $53.44.

Mark

 

[ShipMate]

"The effort is significant, the rewards pretty near zero."

Ron, please consider that your efforts are greatly appreciated and tremendously significant to thousands of us who have serious interest in keeping and preserving the delicate lifeforms in our tanks, yet do not have the expertise to undertake such demanding and complex experiments.

 

[Peabody]

Ditto, Dr. Ron.... seriously! It is VERY appreciated

I too would also contribute to further test.research however I could.

 

[rshimek]

Hi Folks,

Thanks for the expressions of support. I will definitely make it known if I will doing any future projects that could use some assistance.

As it stands, my plate is rather full until late summer - too much to do, and not enough time to do it (including giving a full year's graduate level invert course in six weeks - utter insanity, that, but fun insanity ). At the end of summer, I may try to undertake something else.

 

[johnrags1234]

Lets hope that the next research project that you spend your valuable time on gets appreciated like it should. I know alot of people think it is awesome what you do, but the whole thing about you getting paid by a salt company was WAY out of line IMO. I dont think people understand how much time you undoubtidly spend doing these projects, and that you end up spending your OWN money on these experiments. Keep up the great work!

John

P.S Im looking forward to seeing you speek at C-SEA. Would you mind sharing what your topic is?

I suppose I half expect to be sued.

This wouldnt realy happen would it? That would be a terrible move on any companies behalf IMO.

 

[lllosingit]

Hi,

Is there any way we (through RC) could help subsidize this sort of research?

Not as far as I know. And, frankly, I don't have much interest in doing more of it. The effort is significant, the rewards pretty near zero.

also, have the salt dealers made any sort of statements?

I don't know of any.

Do you expect them to?

I really don't know. I suppose I half expect to be sued, but who knows.

DR Ron if you were to be sued, "hope it doesn't happen" (knock on wood)
I would be more than willing to contribute to Your defense fund

 

[rshimek]

Originally posted by johnrags1234

Hi,

P.S Im looking forward to seeing you speek at C-SEA. Would you mind sharing what your topic is?

Check out my website, www.rshimek.com for the title, it will a synopsis of all of the water stuff I have done.

 

[BonsaiNut]

I just wanted to post a personal "thank you" for what I thought was a well thought-out and well-executed study. I think that additional work along these lines can only improve the quality of artificial salt mixes available to the trade -- and we will all benefit.

BTW - there are some parallels between the study you did here and work that is done on a regular basis in the animal feed industry (for farm stock as well as domestic animals like dogs and cats). Though feed scientists will create formulas based on computer modelling, they cannot release feed without adequate testing on livestock. For example, if you release a dog food with a claim that it is nutritionally complete for all life stages, you have to present scientific evidence (from tests conducted with live animals) that dogs would thrive eating nothing but the subject food.

It is an interesting thought -- imagine if, in order to claim that your salt mix was "real" ocean salt mix, you had to demonstrate survivability of certain organisms, in line with natural sea water Maybe the day will come when we can buy "custom" salt mixes targeted for different uses - fish only tanks, reef tanks, or for breeding and larval rearing

But the bottom line is, we shouldn't care about numbers on a bag -- we should only care about the impact on the creatures that we are keeping.

Well done!

 

[rshimek]

Originally posted by BonsaiNut

Hi,

It is an interesting thought -- imagine if, in order to claim that your salt mix was "real" ocean salt mix, you had to demonstrate survivability of certain organisms, in line with natural sea water Maybe the day will come when we can buy "custom" salt mixes targeted for different uses - fish only tanks, reef tanks, or for breeding and larval rearing

NEAT THOUGHT!!

Maybe it will come to pass!!!