First Reef, Please Help

JSA

New member
Hi All,

My Name is John and I live in Indiana,

I have kept fresh water aquariums for 20 years and want to give the marine aquariums a go.

I have been lurking on here for a while trying to start learing what I need to get my basic setup up and running and have tried to search through the forums to find answers to most of my questions without needing to post repeat questions you all have answered over and over.

Please excuse this long winded post but I want to cover my bases about what I want to do in this first post.

The tank I have chosen to go with is the AGA 125g and it will be built as an in-wall tank in our family/theater room. The room behind the wall is a laundry room so all waterline connections are easily accessible and I have an electrician comming over next week to run two 20a circuits to dedicate to the sytem.

I purchased a PFO 2x250w MH ballast and 2 ushio 10k bulbs along with a PFO VHO retro light kit that will support 2 uri super actinics. this will be the main display lighting. For cooling, i also bought 2 icecap fans that have the temp probes so I can have them mounted into the light fixture to blow across the lights.

My plan for livestock is already in place:

2 clowns
1 yellow tang
1 Coral Beauty
1 sixline wrasse

after full year of established tank, last addition will be 1 mandarin.

6 total fish

Corals will be soft and LPS only, no clams or SPS.

Frogspawn
Brains
Shrooms
Zoas
trumpet
hammer
finger leather
toadstool
palys
GSP

I know the MH lighting is not neccessary but I got the ballast from a friend for exchange of a co2 reactor from one of my planted tanks so MH it is...lol

Now for the newbie Q/A part:

From what I understand, the tanks flow can be lower on a softie tank than on an sps setup so I have chosen to go with 4 MJ900's with the prop mods. Does this sound like a good decision?
I plan to mount 1 in each corner.

I also whant to go against the grain per say and set up my tank differently than most i'v seen.

I am considering going with a non-drilled tank and making a skimmer box thats the width of the tank and putting it at one end, I will use a pump placed inside the box to feed water to a 55g tank that will be mounted higher than the display tank. the 55 will be a refugium with a shallow sand bed about 2" to 3" deep and have LR and Macro. the 55 will be drilled and the overflow will gravity feed back into the display at the opposite end from the skimmer side. The pump runing this will be a magnum 350 power canister with the filter media removed. Instead of floss and filter sleeve, I plan to use the canister to run activated carbon which will be changed monthly at water changes.

My reasoning for the 24/7 carbon is because I want to try to go skimmerless and let the tank have the higher neutrient levels for the corals, This is why only 6 fish bioload in 175g of water.

Questions here:

Is 55g a good size for a refugium on a 125 or does it need to be bigger?

How many pounds of LR do you think the system should have to pull off this idea?

The fuge lighting will be 4x55w PC running reverse cycle from main display.

I am also considering the use of a home built algea turf scrubber to add more bio filtration but still researching this part. So far the idea is to use a MJ1200 hooked up to a wave timer to feed a spray bar over a screen, water would be pulled from display the same way as refugium is, and dump into the refugium so no algea would accidently get sent into the display.

I'll end this post here and thank you all in advance for any recommendations you can give or opinions you share about my plans.

Hope I'm not too crazy and sorry if the post sounds scattered, some of these ideas are just formulating.......


John
:rollface:
 
sound pretty good. the only thing I would recommend is to make it as simple as possible. more simple means less headaches and less problems to deal with later.
I like the sump/fuge idea over the display instead of under, sounds interesting and unique. only problem is that you will have a problem regulating the evaporation rate cuss this is done in the return section.... which in your case is in the overflow section of your dt?
 
thanks for the reply,

I was thinking I might use an ATO device with a 10g resevoir to top off, I already have a ro unit and will add a DI canister to it. The RO/DI will fill the 10g, I have a kent float valve I can install in the 10g to regulate its fill and the ato sensor would be placed in the display tank. I wonder if the sensor should be placed in the overflow itself or out in the open area along the back of the tank??

my hope is to create a simple setup using as few equipment items as possible, hence the gravity fed return to display.

so far the equipment involved is:

4 MJ900 in display
2 heaters in display
1 heater in RO tank
1 heater in Salt Mix Tank
1 powerhead in Salt mix tank
1 pump in RO tank for top off connected to ATO
1 Pump in salt Mix Tank to feed display at water changes
1 magnum 350 to run carbon and send water to fuge
2 PC ballasts for fuge lighting
1 VHO ballast for display Actinics
2 plugs on PFO MH Ballast for 2x250w

equipment will be plugged into 2 DJ 100 power strips.
Lights will be on timers
Lights and mixing pumps will be on ground fault
magnum 350, display heaters, and 4 mj900's will be on non-ground fault to guard against false trips causing problems


not exactly minimal simple but seems close....


John
 
I have some thoughts but have a question first. Is the ATS for nitrate removal? You mention that it's for added bio-filtration, but, to me, that's not an optimal use for one. The focus of an ATS is to remove nitrates from the system by actively growing and harvesting algae. It's the "harvesting" that is so problematic. I doubt that you will need more bio-filtration, as most systems colonize to their needs. We don't suffer from a lack of colonizing areas, typically.

That brings my thoughts to your question about live rock. To me, it's not about pounds but about displacement. Some like a lot of rock visible in the tank, others little. Vertically displayed as opposed to horizontally. Some of the rock is very dense and some very porous and that affects the weight. Seventy-five pounds of Caribbean will not "fill" as much of the display as the same weight of Tonga branch. Housing softies means you may want to place a lot horizontally and in steps so that you have places to perch all the colonies you get, reserving a bit of plateau for leathers, or gorgonia or whatever, that grow vertically. You will probably want to reserve some sand space for the LPS that like to be there.

It's really hard to peg down how much rock you need unless you go to someone like (I think I am getting this right) marco's rocks. A retailer like that gets your tank dimensions, talks to you and then sends you pictures of rock that will fill your tank to your vision. If you go the more normal route of buying some bulk from some retailer, it's hard, if not impossible, to plan in advance. Another route is to utilize a good LFS in your area and hand pick your own.

The canister filter for carbon is an excellent use but changing that carbon so infrequently is, I think, an error. Less carbon, more frequent changes, imo. One to two cups would be more than sufficient but I don't leave mine in more than three days. I run mine only about half the time, too, but that's a matter that is solved on a tank by tank basis.

I prefer Koralias to the mod'd MJ's. I have the mod'd MJ's in my growout and frag tanks but I find them a bit too noisy for the display. (The MJ's also seem to run hotter than the Koralias and that adds to the evaporative needs of the system in the summer for cooling.) Softies and LPS can tolerate a lot more flow than many think, just as they can thrive with a very small amount. It's all a matter of placement.

If you haven't seen the CFL flood light (with the built in reflector) for fuge lighting, I would recommend a look at melevsreef dot com. To give credit where due, that is the first time I had seen them. I use them and love them. You can get the same PAR with three that you would get with your four PC's for the electrical consumption of one.

I like your overflow plan. I use and like overflow's a lot. The secret is to plan for redundancy so that a blockage from air or critters will not overflow your tank. Having backups of your U-tubes makes maintenance easier, too.

I would separate your return pump from your display circulation electrically. If you lose power to that circuit, you will have no flow in your tank. If I lose power to my display return, all of my tanks have movement from a different circuit. Also, I don't like heaters on a non-GFCI circuit, especially if they are glass.

I think my last thought is about your top-off. I put my ATO in the sump. I don't like to see my display volume fluctuate so the sump is where I choose to monitor evaporative loss. Do you have a plan to limit your RO/DI's on-off cycling? I would go to a larger reservoir, if at all possible, with a low-level switch to turn on the RO/DI and a high-level switch to turn it off.

HTH and good luck with the planning and build!!
 
Sounds like you have done your research. Everything sounds pretty good, except for not putting things on a GFI. Heaters and powerheads are notorious for leaking stray voltage into the tank. If one of them starts to go bad, you'll want the GFI to trip. My GFI has never tripped because of powerheads or heaters.

You probably don't need 4x55wPC lights for the fuge. Lots of people use the spiral compact flourescent bulbs. You'll definitely want to go with an ATO of some sorts if the fuge is above the tank. You'll have to have your ATO sensors in with your pump at the end of your tank.
 
Token,

Thanks for taking the time for such a detailed reply.

I think I caused confusion on the ATS. Yes, my thought was as a nitrate remover, I said Bio-Filtration, should of said organic and not chemical to lower nitrates in the first place.

As for the live rock, it will be hand picked Tonga Branch. I am about 1/2hr drive from Inland Aquatics in Terre Haute, Indiana so I am going to be using them as my LFS. I have dealt with the guys there in the past and have always had nothing but great things to say about them. Mike and Josh helped me get this bug so I guess I'll have to blame them for my wallet getting thinner but other than that, Great guys!

As for the Carbon, I will try 1 cup and change every weekend to start and see how that goes.

I made a note to myself about the heaters and pumps, will put on GFI's. The mag 350 will be isolated.

I can go bigger on the RO Resevoir with no problem. I was talking with a friend today and he asked me what type of doser i was going to use to regulate Ca and Alk....(uhhh.....damn) I started researching this little forgotten tid bit and think i might just spend the money on a Litermeter and add the top off module to it also covers my ATO .

dosing and evap replinishment seems like two areas i might like to just automate so i don't forget to do it.

I'll look into the CFL light too... thanks!

NirvanaFan,

Thanks for your input about the GFI's, Will Change the plan! Thanks!

john
 
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