How hardy are the Brazilian Orange SH??
- Thread starter FishGuy5
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billybobed
New member
Cool, never seen these in person, but seen pictures online. I don't know of the specific care of these guys, but as others would likely mention, be careful with the wild caught. Risks bringing outside bacteria/disease in, feeding issues, etc. Do you have any pics?
Brazilian seahorses can be many colours. They are H. Reidi seahorses.
Wildcaught and not trained to eat frozen can be very difficult to keep as many will never switch to frozen and you have to buy/grow adult brine shrimp and gut load them for feeding.
Wildcaught are bigtime carriers of many pathogens which make them a risky purchase and if that purchase is expensive, you may be just kissing that money goodbye.
Wildcaught and not trained to eat frozen can be very difficult to keep as many will never switch to frozen and you have to buy/grow adult brine shrimp and gut load them for feeding.
Wildcaught are bigtime carriers of many pathogens which make them a risky purchase and if that purchase is expensive, you may be just kissing that money goodbye.
TamiW
Seahorse Wrangler
If you're willing to feed live food for the life of the seahorses, and you have backup plans for when lfs's are out of food, it is possible. I've kept wild caught reidi before, and the biggest problem was convincing them to eat frozen. I don't think any did reliably. I could get them to eat frozen ghost shrimp if I waved it in front of their faces with tongs, and occasionally mysis (the girls seemed more inclined to try new things).
However, feeding live to seahorse can be extremely expensive. I think there were months I spent over $100 on food and when one fish store in the area was out of ghost shrimp, it seemed like they all were. Plus, ghost shrimp isn't the best food since its from freshwater. Setting up a mysis culture is time and space intensive and difficult to maintain.
This was all before CB seahorses were readily available. CB seahorses are SUCH blessings. My life was just about getting my seahorses fed back then. Several trips to the LFS each week, ordering food online, etc . . . Eating cheap food so I could afford food for my seahorses.
If you're anywhere near the ocean, you might be able to collect your own food.
Oh, and they won't last long eating only brine shrimp, so rule that out right now.
In terms of diseases, I've always found wild caught reidi to be pretty hardy. They should be dewormed but they aren't particularly sensitive to diseases, unlike some wild caughts. But never mix with captive bred seahorses, they'll likely give the cb seahorses something they're carrying.
The short answer is: I wouldn't do it again, but it can be done, just expect a lot of cost, time, and potential heartbreak.
However, feeding live to seahorse can be extremely expensive. I think there were months I spent over $100 on food and when one fish store in the area was out of ghost shrimp, it seemed like they all were. Plus, ghost shrimp isn't the best food since its from freshwater. Setting up a mysis culture is time and space intensive and difficult to maintain.
This was all before CB seahorses were readily available. CB seahorses are SUCH blessings. My life was just about getting my seahorses fed back then. Several trips to the LFS each week, ordering food online, etc . . . Eating cheap food so I could afford food for my seahorses.
If you're anywhere near the ocean, you might be able to collect your own food.
Oh, and they won't last long eating only brine shrimp, so rule that out right now.
In terms of diseases, I've always found wild caught reidi to be pretty hardy. They should be dewormed but they aren't particularly sensitive to diseases, unlike some wild caughts. But never mix with captive bred seahorses, they'll likely give the cb seahorses something they're carrying.
The short answer is: I wouldn't do it again, but it can be done, just expect a lot of cost, time, and potential heartbreak.
pledosophy
Active member
I kept my WC brazillians (reidi)for 5 years. The male for six months longer then the female. Mine never ate frozen food and were scared of brine shrimp (they would hid under the rocks and respirations would increase). I fed them live ghosts and salt water white shrimp for the 5 years. Getting food can be a hassle to say the least, and I would pay in food for a couple days what a CB would cost a month, but . . . I loved those horses so it was worth it.
My female was fine one morning, dead the next, no disease present. My male slowly wnet blind (probably from internal parasites). I did make a feed type bag, but a blind seahose can only catch so much live food.
JME
My female was fine one morning, dead the next, no disease present. My male slowly wnet blind (probably from internal parasites). I did make a feed type bag, but a blind seahose can only catch so much live food.
JME
TamiW
Seahorse Wrangler
I don't think anyone is feeding live brine. If you feed them live brine as anything other than a treat, they will not survive for very long. Brine shrimp has virtually no nutrition, and enriching will not help enough to make a difference.
If you want these seahorses to live you're going to need to find a better food source ASAP.
I don't mean to be dramatic, but I think you missed this in all the responses based on your question. If I miss interpreted then I apologize.
You need to be feeding them food other than brine shrimp as a staple. This means now. Especially if they were at the LFS for any length of time eating just brine shrimp. You need to get them small ghost shrimp, saltwater feeder shrimp, mysis shrimp or amphipods asap, and you will need to have a constant supply of these foods.
Here are some sources you can get live foods from:
Sach's Aquaculture Store "“ AquacultureStore.com
MBL Aquaculture "“ MBLaquaculture.com
Florida Aqua Farms "“ Florida-aqua-farms.com
Reefs 2 Go "“ Reefs2Go.com
Live aquaria also sometimes has saltwater feeders, though I don't see them now.
If you want these seahorses to live you're going to need to find a better food source ASAP.
I don't mean to be dramatic, but I think you missed this in all the responses based on your question. If I miss interpreted then I apologize.
You need to be feeding them food other than brine shrimp as a staple. This means now. Especially if they were at the LFS for any length of time eating just brine shrimp. You need to get them small ghost shrimp, saltwater feeder shrimp, mysis shrimp or amphipods asap, and you will need to have a constant supply of these foods.
Here are some sources you can get live foods from:
Sach's Aquaculture Store "“ AquacultureStore.com
MBL Aquaculture "“ MBLaquaculture.com
Florida Aqua Farms "“ Florida-aqua-farms.com
Reefs 2 Go "“ Reefs2Go.com
Live aquaria also sometimes has saltwater feeders, though I don't see them now.
I don't know what you consider nutrition to be but live brine shrimp grown from GSL cysts have protein percentages ranging from 49.7 to 62.5% dry weight. This is BEFORE gut loading.
Most foods we feed our normal fish would have protein percent in the 45% range.
Brine shrimp start off as newborn nauplii with a bit lower protein, but have a high lipid content. As they grow the lipid content decreases and the protein level increases somewhat.
By gut loading, you can increase vitamin levels, protein levels, or lipid levels, just by feeding an appropriate food for what you want.
Brine shrimp will ingest any appropriately sized particles so if you have something in liquid form it will have to be emulsified as the Selco products are, in order for the brine shrimp to properly ingest it.
This information comes from the United Nations article "Manual on the Production and Use of Live Food for Aquaculture" edited by scientists from the Laboratory of Aquaculture and Artemia Reference Center at the University of Ghent in Belgium.
For complete info on artemia scroll down to section 4.0.
For the nutrition levels of ongrown artemia scroll to section 4.4.1
Manual on the Production and Use of Live Food for Aquaculture
TamiW
Seahorse Wrangler
Rayjay, you are absolutely right. What would have been more accurate to say is that adult brine shrimp posses little nutritional value to seahorses as they are mostly protein with very little lipid content, and usually that of the wrong lipid profile. Due to brine shrimps tough exoskeleton and a seahorses short digestive track, even enriching with the proper lipid ratios provides little benefit to seahorses.
Sorry but I guess this is another case of both in disagreement.
I don't believe the brine exo. is any tougher than mysis exo, and in fact when I was culturing mysids, the mysid exoskeletons took a lot longer to degrade than brine shrimp exoskeletons.
If they get enough nutrition from the mysis, then they will get enough from the brine shrimp, even though mysis nutrition levels are slightly higher.
Also, I'm not a big believer in the need for high amounts of fatty acids in the diets of the seahorses other than in the primary growing stages.
I have one seahorse that will eat nothing but frozen brine shrimp now for four years. (H. reidi)
For seahorses, like all my marine fish, I believe variety is still the number one point in fish feeding.
I try to give a variety to my horses by feeding mysis, brine, and live brine gut loaded with varying products like Algamac Protein Plus, or occasionally Algamac 3050 (lipids).
Powdered spirulina is also a great food for gut loading.
Like my seahorse that only eats frozen brine, I also have a mess of Reidi that are just over 10 months old now and I still can't get them on anything but Sally's San Fran frozen brine. They look at Hikari but won't touch.
As for mysis, they want no part of Hikari or PE even though they have been exposed to it continually since they were about 6 weeks old.
I don't believe the brine exo. is any tougher than mysis exo, and in fact when I was culturing mysids, the mysid exoskeletons took a lot longer to degrade than brine shrimp exoskeletons.
If they get enough nutrition from the mysis, then they will get enough from the brine shrimp, even though mysis nutrition levels are slightly higher.
Also, I'm not a big believer in the need for high amounts of fatty acids in the diets of the seahorses other than in the primary growing stages.
I have one seahorse that will eat nothing but frozen brine shrimp now for four years. (H. reidi)
For seahorses, like all my marine fish, I believe variety is still the number one point in fish feeding.
I try to give a variety to my horses by feeding mysis, brine, and live brine gut loaded with varying products like Algamac Protein Plus, or occasionally Algamac 3050 (lipids).
Powdered spirulina is also a great food for gut loading.
Like my seahorse that only eats frozen brine, I also have a mess of Reidi that are just over 10 months old now and I still can't get them on anything but Sally's San Fran frozen brine. They look at Hikari but won't touch.
As for mysis, they want no part of Hikari or PE even though they have been exposed to it continually since they were about 6 weeks old.
Well, I can never say for sure that I'm right on ANY topic, just that it's my opinion based on my experience and research.
As for gut loading, I dislike Selco type emulsions because they don't store well for long periods.
I prefer to use Algamac 3050 in it's place.
That being said, I only use it a lot when the fry are young.
Once they get older (mid juvenile stage and later) I don't believe they need anywhere near as much fatty acids, so my prefered food at that time is the Algamac Protein Plus.
If I'm out of Algamac PP then I use spirulina powder.
I also use the Algamac and spirulina for growing rotifers, no longer using phyto.
For the brine shrimp cultures, I use phyto for the first couple of weeks and then switch to feeding with AM or spir. for the remainer of their growth.
(phyto grown brine are then gut loaded before feeding to the fry)
As for gut loading, I dislike Selco type emulsions because they don't store well for long periods.
I prefer to use Algamac 3050 in it's place.
That being said, I only use it a lot when the fry are young.
Once they get older (mid juvenile stage and later) I don't believe they need anywhere near as much fatty acids, so my prefered food at that time is the Algamac Protein Plus.
If I'm out of Algamac PP then I use spirulina powder.
I also use the Algamac and spirulina for growing rotifers, no longer using phyto.
For the brine shrimp cultures, I use phyto for the first couple of weeks and then switch to feeding with AM or spir. for the remainer of their growth.
(phyto grown brine are then gut loaded before feeding to the fry)
TamiW
Seahorse Wrangler
I started keeping seahorses during the pre-captive bred holocaust when seahorses died left and right when fed only brine shrimp, enriched or not. So I strongly feel that brine shrimp does not work as a long term diet for seahorses. Back when feeding live food was a requirement, people feeding brine shrimp only; enriched and otherwise, lost their seahorses, and it was quite evident from photos they were starving. You could see the tissue loss in the areas between their plates. People who fed other live foods had much greater success.
It was discussed ad nauseam all over the internet 5-10 years ago, until captive bred seahorses became readily available and thus feeding got easier with frozen. To be honest, I was actually more than a little taken a back at the suggestion that enriched brine shrimp would be okay for anything other than a treat.
Rayjay, I can't say why you had success with a couple that are stuck on brine shrimp. My instinct is something else is going on there; either they're eating mysis when you're not watching, or they're getting enough feeds from a refugium or something.
Conversely something else could have been happening back when seahorses were primarily fed brine shrimp and died as a result. It wasn't because they were wild caught, because those that were fed other live foods thrived. It wasn't that these enrichment feeds weren't available then, they were. It could be related to the soft plate disease mentioned in the second post here: http://www.seahorse.com/index.php?I...view&id=2464&option=com_joomlaboard&view=flat
It could be something else.
I remember other studies at the time too that discussed problems with gutloading and feeding brine shrimp. Not specific to seahorses, so I may have to do some serious digging; this was an eternity ago in internet time and many of the sites and groups at the time are no longer in existence. But I'll see what I can find.
It was discussed ad nauseam all over the internet 5-10 years ago, until captive bred seahorses became readily available and thus feeding got easier with frozen. To be honest, I was actually more than a little taken a back at the suggestion that enriched brine shrimp would be okay for anything other than a treat.
Rayjay, I can't say why you had success with a couple that are stuck on brine shrimp. My instinct is something else is going on there; either they're eating mysis when you're not watching, or they're getting enough feeds from a refugium or something.
Conversely something else could have been happening back when seahorses were primarily fed brine shrimp and died as a result. It wasn't because they were wild caught, because those that were fed other live foods thrived. It wasn't that these enrichment feeds weren't available then, they were. It could be related to the soft plate disease mentioned in the second post here: http://www.seahorse.com/index.php?I...view&id=2464&option=com_joomlaboard&view=flat
It could be something else.
I remember other studies at the time too that discussed problems with gutloading and feeding brine shrimp. Not specific to seahorses, so I may have to do some serious digging; this was an eternity ago in internet time and many of the sites and groups at the time are no longer in existence. But I'll see what I can find.
