Poison warning: serious stuff, venom, toxins. Hospital stuff. [pix of items]

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The one in the picture below, top rock on left side, If I touch it my hand goes numb, I wear gloves around it now..
FTS4_22_2015_zpsjquhtkcw.jpg
 
3. repeated exposure of human skin to water in which corals are carrying on chemical warfare can sensitize an individual to reef water---so badly that they will ever after break out in a rash as a consequence of touching such water. This has happened to two lfs owners that I know. Wear gloves.


so once I add corals to my tank i always need to wear gloves when touching the water?

when handling corals, i need to wear goggles?
 
Ideally, yes. It also depends on type of coral, and your tendency to put your hands into the tank for every minor thing (don't!) and on a variety of circumstances including possibly your own body---although there is a profound difference between a sensitivity (which some reefers do get in repeated exposure!) and a toxin (an outright poison which will affect every person thus exposed). Many corals exude chemicals to which we can become sensitized. TWO or at least a few species of palythoas (palys) which closely resemble zoanthids (zoas) ---aka buttons---are highly TOXIC, ie, poisonous. If you work with palys, you should avoid palythoa heliodiscus and palythoa toxica---the two species this thread has uncovered (read the whole thread!!!! including the pix) that are the prime problems. There may be others. Look at the pix. See if you have one of these two types. If you do, I would, frankly, get rid of them, by some same means of disposal that does not involve exposing your eyes, nose, hands, or breathing fumes or getting splashed with the liquid.

As to the advisability of goggles---while fragging anything, especially with a dremel, yes! living coral in the eyes is not good. Wear glasses or goggles. If handling corals, even gentle hammer---yes, wear gloves. If you are going to be (as lfs owners are) dipping your hands into your tank multiple times a day---exposure even to the water in that frequency is not good: wear gloves.

The best gloves for sensitive operations are nitrile exam gloves, your local pharmacy, even grocery. If you have a wound or hangnail, rubberband the wrist of that hand so it stays dry while you work.

When pipetting or starting a siphon, use methods other than mouth for suction, especially if you have zoa-types in the tank.

These are basic precautions that can keep you happy and healthy in the hobby, and your corals will also be happier --- they have tiny stinging cells that get ripped from their tissue by our finger-ridges and pores, and they're much happier not having to 'heal up' after a human has fingered them bare-handed.
 

From this article: "Throughout the Mediterranean region, palytoxin exposure has been linked to fever, conjunctivitis, and respiratory symptoms in persons exposed to marine aerosols during proliferations of palytoxin and palytoxin-like compound"“producing marine algae (i.e., algal blooms) (5), but detailed inhalation studies in animal models are lacking."

So am I reading this correctly that certain algae can produce palytoxin-like toxins? Does anyone know what kind of algae, and if there are any typically found in a home aquarium?

Also, the article describes "marine aerosols" as being produced by scrubbing or placing the coral in hot water. So if you don't do these things, are the toxins confined to your tank water? I can take precautions to protect myself when working in my aquarium, but I want to be sure I don't have any kind of toxins getting into the air to affect others in my household. I actually don't have any zoas or palys in my tank (and don't plan to), but I still want to take the best precautions against any other corals that may release toxic chemicals.
 
I have no idea, but caulerpa weed, which is a pest in the Mediterranean thanks to an escape, is certainly too toxic for many fish.

Main thing is, re family safety, dispose safely, be clean and orderly with disposals, wash nets and tools and store, and put locks on all your sump and storage cabinets if you have inquisitive kids: marine toxins aren't all they can get into.
 
I have no idea, but caulerpa weed, which is a pest in the Mediterranean thanks to an escape, is certainly too toxic for many fish.

Main thing is, re family safety, dispose safely, be clean and orderly with disposals, wash nets and tools and store, and put locks on all your sump and storage cabinets if you have inquisitive kids: marine toxins aren't all they can get into.

Saw Andrew Zimmerman munching caulepra on a show this week....
 
Anemones can also inflict irritation or worse. Moray Eels can inflict painful bites! Mantis Shrimp are nothing to take lightly and Sea Urchins can pose dangers as well.
 
Anemones can also inflict irritation or worse. Moray Eels can inflict painful bites! Mantis Shrimp are nothing to take lightly and Sea Urchins can pose dangers as well.

True enough, but the point of this thread is to point out the potential deadly consequence of Palytoxin. I have been in the ER discussing with the ER doctor how Palytoxin could kill me, and then spent the next 3 days being treated for acute respiratory failure.
 
Thanks for all the warnings! I've been doing this reef stuff for about 7 years. Its only me and another neighbor down the street. We order online so we ever talk about things like this or even know about half of it. I just recently learned about palytoxin poisoning. Lucky my ignorance has been blissful, and I haven't required an ER visit.
 
First, some background:

I've been in the hobby since the mid 80's. I'm also a certified diver with over 1000 dives in the Caribbean and Pacific as far as Hawaii. I've been stung in the water by various creatures on a number of occasions, all through my own inattention, mostly while taking a photograph of something else.

Those exposures pale in comparison to what I did to myself in my own home, with creatures that I have kept for 20+ years without issue.

I needed to move my 60g tank into another room for new carpet. Although Zoanthids and Palythoas had covered a majority of the rock in the tank, I pretty much ignored them as I drained the tank and prepared to move it some 15 feet. Because the rock (a large piece of pumice siliconed to the bottom) could not be removed, my arm rubbed against the paly and zoas for 20 or so minutes while cleaning things up. At that point, I noticed that my arm was turning red. Oops! I turned to my wife (a RN) and said "If I stop breathing, call 911 and tell them it is palytoxin exposure" Her response was "Huh?". I explained it in detail after washing with soap and water. I then refilled the tank and we went to dinner. By then, it looked like a almost 2nd degree burn - no blisters, but bright red and burning/itching. It didn't get any worse that evening. The pain kept me from sleeping well and when I finally got up about 5:30AM, I looked at my arm, now covered with weeping blisters. I woke my wife to tell her I was off the the Urgent Care and away I went. It was just after they opened on Easter Sunday. I walked in and the triage nurse asked why I was there. When I told her it was Palytoxin exposure she gave me a blank look, so I carefully took off my coat and showed her my arm. She walked me past a roomful of people waiting to be seen and straight to the Dr's office. After filling him in, he called Poison Control. Their first question was "Is the patient still alive?" Because obviously I was, they explained that there really wasn't anything to do at that point but steroids so I got a prescription and went on my way.

All in all, it cost me a trip to the UC, the steroids, and a week off work. (I work in a OR - scrubbing was NOT gonna happen!)

Kids - don't let this happen to you!!!!

Here's a picture of the tank - please note the profusion of palythoas and zoanthids


And here's a picture of my arm about 1 week post exposure




FWIW - my upgraded tank is a SPS/LPS reef with a few mushrooms - not a paly or zoa to be seen!
 
First, some background:

I've been in the hobby since the mid 80's. I'm also a certified diver with over 1000 dives in the Caribbean and Pacific as far as Hawaii. I've been stung in the water by various creatures on a number of occasions, all through my own inattention, mostly while taking a photograph of something else.

Those exposures pale in comparison to what I did to myself in my own home, with creatures that I have kept for 20+ years without issue.

I needed to move my 60g tank into another room for new carpet. Although Zoanthids and Palythoas had covered a majority of the rock in the tank, I pretty much ignored them as I drained the tank and prepared to move it some 15 feet. Because the rock (a large piece of pumice siliconed to the bottom) could not be removed, my arm rubbed against the paly and zoas for 20 or so minutes while cleaning things up. At that point, I noticed that my arm was turning red. Oops! I turned to my wife (a RN) and said "If I stop breathing, call 911 and tell them it is palytoxin exposure" Her response was "Huh?". I explained it in detail after washing with soap and water. I then refilled the tank and we went to dinner. By then, it looked like a almost 2nd degree burn - no blisters, but bright red and burning/itching. It didn't get any worse that evening. The pain kept me from sleeping well and when I finally got up about 5:30AM, I looked at my arm, now covered with weeping blisters. I woke my wife to tell her I was off the the Urgent Care and away I went. It was just after they opened on Easter Sunday. I walked in and the triage nurse asked why I was there. When I told her it was Palytoxin exposure she gave me a blank look, so I carefully took off my coat and showed her my arm. She walked me past a roomful of people waiting to be seen and straight to the Dr's office. After filling him in, he called Poison Control. Their first question was "Is the patient still alive?" Because obviously I was, they explained that there really wasn't anything to do at that point but steroids so I got a prescription and went on my way.

All in all, it cost me a trip to the UC, the steroids, and a week off work. (I work in a OR - scrubbing was NOT gonna happen!)

Kids - don't let this happen to you!!!!

Here's a picture of the tank - please note the profusion of palythoas and zoanthids


And here's a picture of my arm about 1 week post exposure




FWIW - my upgraded tank is a SPS/LPS reef with a few mushrooms - not a paly or zoa to be seen!

Yup, never to be seen again in my tank!!!!
 
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