20 gallon frag tank setup!

Brock Fluharty

New member
I have a 20 gallon high that will be sitting empty very soon, and I want to turn it into a frag tank. To start with, I just want everyone to know that this is not for profit. I hate it that people sell named zoas for in the upwards of $10s / polyp. That is why I am going to start with the few zoa colonies I already have, and get some frags from them. Once the frags grow out (in a month or two hopefully) I will trade them for different types of zoas, or other types of corals. I will continue this until I have a good selection, then I will start selling them. No matter what color, size, name, whatever, all of my zoas will be $3.00/polyp. I cannot do this with other corals that do not grow in the "polyp" form. I do have a few ?s though.

For lights, I am going to TRY LOA lights. I know that these have bene used for macro, etc., but I have never seen them used for low(er) light corals, such as softies, zoas, etc. These lights are cheap, and are supposed to put out more light than the watts they use, if that makes sense...I will try these lights out on macros, then softies, then zoas, then LPS, then SPS, and see which ones will "thrive" under them.

I am not goingto use a skimmer right away, but I probably will later on. I currently have...orange with blue center zoas, yellow polyps, green with brown skirt zoas, lavender with red ring around mouth, and some other smaller frags. I'm not gonna list macro, as I have a lot of different kinds. I'm also going to have a few peppermint shrimp in the tank, so that they can hopefully breed, and the palys, or zoas can eat the fry.

The frags will be placed on eggcrate racks. There will be about 4 shelves that can be utilized for placement of the corals. If these lights turn out to be extremely bright, then the softies will go on the bottom rack, and (if possible) SPS on the top.

It will be BB, with 1, maybe 2 powerheads (probably Maxi-Jets) to keep the flow up. I'm going to paint the back, sides, and bottom blue, or white. I like the look of blue, but I would think that light would reflect better off of white than blue.

Now I just need to find someone who sells frag plugs made of acrylic, or plastic.

Brock
 
go to the cincinnatti frag swap they always have a vendor there that sells frag plugs that are plastic and cone shaped with the bottom cut flat(best I can describe it) it has many holes in it. They are very nice to have. (I can't remember which vendor it was but they also sell them on their website)
 
0_o the length of your post makes my modem cry, not that it matters...)

For plugs you can use thoes flower water steak thingies that flower shops put some flowers in (Hope that made sence, although I doubt it.)

The rack Idea is the sam implimented in Rogers frag tank, which I beleive is where you got that idea...not that it matters.

What kind of filtration are you going to use?

Um....cant think of anything else....
 
I guess by LOA lights you mean Lights of America compact fluorescent screw ins. These will probably grow some zoas and softies but I do not think you will have much luck with LPS or SPS. I would think you would need about 6 bulbs for it to work well for you. I would try to stay as close to natural daylight as possible to make the frags grow quickly. I think the LOA bulbs are about 5.5 K and should be the correct spectrum but I am not sure. If it were me I would scrap the idea of the LOA lights and buy one 175 watt MH and it would be enough to grow your frags out. It would also grow SPS and LPS. Shane as far as the egg crate goes, its been around for a long time so I do not think Brock is thieving any "new technology". I think making agronite plugs would be more cost effective in the long run over other media. Also if you plan any SPS you will definitely need a foam fractionator or you will be doing a lot of WC's. I think you are on your way to an interesting project that will be fun to build. Also do not forget to put enough water current in the tank, it is essential to a frag system.

Good Luck
 
I didnt say he was theiving any "New technology"....I was actually implying that it was a good idea ~_~. Anyway...yeah...*thinks* I have these ugly, brown, small zooanthids... (not the ones you gave me, Phill) and I kinda dont want em, and I dont think anyone else wanted them last time I stated this fact. (Correct me if Im wrong) So if no one else has already asked for them, they are yours next time I'm up that way...
 
It is VERY easy to make your own plugs. Go to a Christian book store. Buy some plastic Communion Cups. They are tapered and just the rightr size. Make sure to use veg oil or vasaline as a release agent to get the plug out. Then Cure for a month or so in freshwater then saltwater.
 
Thanks Shane, but I don't remember seeing a frag tank at Roger's...

Thanks for the zoas!

Ok, so the LOA probably won't work? I'll get one anyway, maybe to put on another tank for macros.

I was just thinking of maybe getting T5's...do MH pendants come completely ready to plugin?
 
I just want everyone to know that this is not for profit.

It matters little to any of us who makes money off of this hobby or does not. We all try to make enough to pay for our habit or experiments. There is nothing wrong with that IMO. What is wrong is doing it for only one reason, there are people out there that look at their tanks as a liquid ATM and nothing more. They don't care about the balance that makes it a living reef and a thing of art and beauty. Instead they frag their mother colonies until they can not be fragged again. Next they move onto another coral which they inevitably kill the same way.

I used to not understand these outrageous price tags either but that was before I did more research and understood why these things are "rare". There is a reason the "purple monster" is priced as high as it is and is named as such. Anytime you deal with rare coral that has a lineage you pay more, if you do not it's like selling a prize race dog without it's papers. It may be a nice dog but when it comes time to sell the puppies you have effectively ruined a proud lineage and a legend may end with that action. Think about it you will understand.

My action of teaching propagation is to make things more affordable but not to kill the industry. Let me explain. Before the CVRC pom-pom xenia in our area was selling at over $89 a stalk! I managed to get my hands on some. I got it to live and divide, something that was hard to do in those days LOL. I eventually got a lot of small frags which I started trading with my LFS. I got my first 265 watt PC light by doing that. I soon had a massive list of people who wanted frags and I tried to live up to the arrangements. However my coral was not as willing as I was, it crashed. Later I got another piece and another strain. 6 strains in all and experimented with propping them. I soon had a very hardy umbellata strain which by this time I began to make available at the shop. This strain began to show incredible growth and survivability and I realized that there was no reason to sell it at abnormal prices anymore. The days of $89 a stalk xenia were over.

But that is xenia, I personally don't think anyone around here has the facility that would be required to commercially propagate something like say the "purple monster" or the "Oregon tort". Selling your frags every now and again is fine and good but don't expect to make a million unless you understand the principles, ethics and the physics of coral propagation. Does that mean I like high priced coral? No it means that there is a reason for it being high and if there is "NO legitimate reason" (as with xenia), then by all means have at it.

I think the best example ever of any member to date that was successful at both keeping a great show tank and making enough to pay for his hobby by fragging it (he had to) was Lowcel, if he had wanted to he could have been selling on RC, e-bay etc and making a killing, but he did not get to greedy and gave away most of his best pieces to friends. Remember these are animals try to treat them as such and you should enjoy the hobby for what it is rather than what you wish it to be :)
 
Dude, I think this is a great Idea, and I would Love to be the first one to get in on this. I have some Zoas I would like to donate. If you would, brock, give me a cal at 940 0205 for details
 
For lights, I am going to TRY LOA lights. I know that these have bene used for macro, etc., but I have never seen them used for low(er) light corals, such as softies, zoas, etc. These lights are cheap, and are supposed to put out more light than the watts they use, if that makes sense...I will try these lights out on macros, then softies, then zoas, then LPS, then SPS, and see which ones will "thrive" under them.
LOA makes/made a 65k floodlight that was the "poor man's pc" several years ago. They were around $30.00 at Home Depot and a lot of people used them at the time.
I ran a 20H reef with one for a while and had no problem keeping softies. Not bright enough for sps but anything you can keep with power compacts should do fine.
 
Thanks Shane. Since you will donate some zoas, I will return the favor once I have some nice frags growing.

I'm going to start a log about how I am setting it up, but i'm not sure if i'll put it here, or make a new thread. I think i'll leave it here.

I drained the tank today, and put the stand, and tank in my room. Tomorrow, i'll update when I get the light, spray paint, eggcrate. etc.

Ron,

Do you work/own JoMarrs? If so, can you order a Hydro FLO Rotating Deflector? I'm planning on using one of these in the frag tank. I'm going to start with the LOA lights, then i'll upgrade to MH once i've sold a few frags, and saved up enough from them. BTW, LOA lights are $11.00 at Wal*Mart now.

I understand what you mean Ron, but it seems to me that people will have zoas that "look like PPE's", so they think that they ARE PPE's. I am goingto shun away from buying these to grow, as I do not want to sell frags for outrageous prices, and empty peoples' wallets. I would much rather sell them 4 or 5 different types of zoas, and keep this hobby thriving, rather than them go to LFS's, where the corals are all WC. Of course, CVRC members get first choice, and can always come pick out there own frags. ;)

Brock

BTW, just saw the Imax movie about the coral reef. They touched a lot on coral bleaching due to a few degrees water temperature increase. Very sad. I really enjoyed your speech about it Ron. Especially seeing that coral that was 100 or so years old, and dying...:( Apparently though, deforestation is an even bigger problem in some places, because the rivers running into the ocean are becoming silty, and they are covering the corals, which deprives them of light. They slowly starve...the film did sya that several reefs are making a comeback, thanks to awareness, and especially in Fiji, them teaching the children ethics of the ocean. E.G., not to overfish, respect the reefs, etc.
 
What color should I paint the back/walls/bottom? I was debating over blue, or white.

I don't really want to use the aragocrete (sp?) plugs, simply because they take a long time to make, cure, etc. Plastic ones come ready to use. I found one website that sells them. Also, with aragocrete, I wouldn't know how to make the little square extension on the bottom so that they don't blow, or get moved around.

Shane,

I like the idea of the flower things. I know what your talking about. They usually put the stems down in those, and then you can put them into styrofoam squares, to make a "floral arrangement". I see it a lot at funerals.
 
I mean no offense by this statement but my status with Jo-Mar's is not a topic of open discussion here, I do not mention the shop on this forum as per an agreement with RC mods long ago. I would suggest you just call around some of the LFS and find the part you are looking for as there are several good ones around here, anyone should be able to order it for you but Im not sure.

people will have zoas that "look like PPE's",..

There is nothing that looks like a PPE and the only way any of the named corals should be sold is with a clear verifiable history of it's lineage IMO. When we start selling frags of the PM (Rogers), it will include a certificate of authenticity verifying it's origin and purchase date.

I would much rather sell them 4 or 5 different types of zoas, and keep this hobby thriving, rather than them go to LFS's, where the corals are all WC


No offense but not all LFS fall into that category and I think a few here will attest to that at least they should. I know a LFS where the coral is over 85% aquacultured and it has nothing to do with $$$ but ethics.
 
Ron,

I meant the LFS's around here. Sorry about mentioning the store.

That is exactly what I meant about the PPE's. People have a zoa that looks a little bit like them, then they sell it as PPE's for lots of $.
 
Yeah....thoes flower thingies....
anyway I appreciate the offer. I am going to be home on sunday, so if you would, could you call me sometime, and we will work out how to get them to you(the zoas). Um.....cant think of anything else as i am - 48 hours of sleep and am pratically braindead. (Thank god for spell check ^^)
 
And now you know exactly why I agreed to create the CVRC. It is a tool to empower new hobbyists so they will know when they are being told the truth, rather than being lead down the wrong path and quitting in desperation and disgust.
 

No offense but not all LFS fall into that category and I think a few here will attest to that at least they should. I know a LFS where the coral is over 85% aquacultured and it has nothing to do with $$$ but ethics.
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I agree Ron, we have been trying to work with more aquacultured, that is, when it's available for a reasonable price, and not just brown acros. I believe wild still needs to be sold, for now, so we can procure healthy animals for aquaculture, and learn how to care for them. Maybe one day we can learn how to keep and frag healthy Goniopora, Elegance(again), or carnation corals to name a few.
 
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