Advice please!?!?! My clowns have ich and I'm about to go on holiday!!

[LadyDave]

Please can someone advise me on the best course of action.....

I've just noticed my two clowns (one black, one common - only two fish in the tank) have ich. I suspected the black one may have it yesterday but the spots are so tiny it was difficult to tell. Now, under my blue lights, I can see white spots on both of them. They seem to only he noticeable right under the blue light tho!

Anyway, I'm in the process of cycling my quarantine tank (couldn't set it up till a few days ago - long story about waiting for new carpets to be fitted) which is a 90litre with a trickle filter. I've put filter floss and ceramic rings in the filter and was hoping to cycle it using that with liquid ammonia.

Problem is that I think I may need to move my fish ASAP to QT, looking at them now. I would do an emergency QT method and do one or two water changes each day if I was going to be home but I'm going on holiday in 4 days time (and out on Xmas day) so won't be around to do these water changes. My mum will be popping in to feed them but asking her to change water - mix and test for salt and whatever else Id need to is just too much to ask of her.

What are my options now??? Are the fish likely to survive if I left them in my DT for two weeks?? Is there anything I can do in my QT in the next 4 days to make it ready for the fish? Aggggghhhh - nightmare!!!!

 

[Mrscribbled]

Instant Ocean Bio-Spira will instantly cycle the QT. Then dose copper. All this can be done in 4 days if needed, ideally have the caretaker do the final copper dose on day 6, since its best to raise copper levels slowly.

 

[LadyDave]

Is the stuff you named available in the UK? I've never seen it!

Also, I was a bit unsure of dosing copper, would rather try hypo to be honest. If I dosed with an ammonia remover daily (I can get my mum to do that) and spend the next 4 days decreasing the salinity - would that work? SG in my DT is 1.025. Would a drop to 1.009 in 2 days be too drastic for the fish?

 

[LadyDave]

Meant that to say 4 days, not 2!!

I've put some filter boost stuff in my QT tank but I'm not convinced that any of them actually do "instant cycle" a tank.

 

[Mrscribbled]

Fish can be dropped to 1.009 in a few hours. I don't live in the UK so can't tell you if a lfs carries bio spira. Make sure the hypo treatment does not go above 1.009, I'm actually more comfortable treating with copper than hypo, being less room for error.

 

[LadyDave]

I've checked - it's not available over here. There are alternatives but like I said, I'm not convinced they work.

So if I QT my fish tomoro or tonight, dose ammonia remover every day and lower the salinity over the next 4 days, does that sound like the best course of action? My mum will be adding too off water to both my tanks while I'm away so can get her to add the ammonia remover too.

 

[Mrscribbled]

I'd get the S.G. lowered well before you leave, so you have time to get things in order, leaving right after hitting 1.009 won't allow you to have a set top off ammount, time of day, fish reaction to treatment before you leave. Make sure ammonia neutrilizer is added exactly every 24 hours. Even when dosing this, anymore than 4 days can be risky with no water change.
Dr. TIM'S One and Only and Bio Spira do work, but are the only two products that work as well as described.

 

[LadyDave]

What do you think my fishes chances are if I wait to QT them when I get back? It'll be in 11 days time.... I'd much rather be here to sort all this, test and check everything myself.

 

[Mrscribbled]

Sorry, I can't answer that question. I haven't had luck with th "feed well and wait" aproach. Ich is however more forgiving than velvet.

 

[LadyDave]

Ok so neither of the products to instant cycle my QT are available here. I'm gonna put some carbon and dose some ammonia remover tonight. From there on I think this is my plan.....
Mix up a big tub of salt water at 1.009 and leave a 10litre bucket and precise instructions of a day and time for my mum to empty 10ltrs of QT water into that bucket and replace it with 10ltrs of the 1.009sg stuff on two days while I'm gone. I will also get her to add the ammonia remover with the top off water, daily.

I will QT my fish once my ammonia has hit zero, gradually lower the salinity to 1.009 and do daily 5litre water changes with the ammonia remover until I go away.

Does this sound ok???

 

[Mrscribbled]

Yes, but S.G. can be lowered fast. Raising back up slow.

 

[LadyDave]

Ok, how fast?

 

[Mrscribbled]

I have done in a matter of an hour, half a day would work well. Keep an eye on PH. Honestly it's been a couple years sincr I've used hypo, but never had a problem aclimating fish to it fast.

 

[LadyDave]

Ok great, thanks! Hopefully I'll have got the ammonia under control by tomorrow afternoon then will add fish (after checking PH - thanks for the reminder, my buffer is now on hand!!) ASAP and lower the salinity probably over about 18hours.

Did you find hypo didn't work as fast or not work at all?? Im hoping that it will at least inhibit the ich until I get home and can then monitor copper dosing myself if I need to.

 

[LadyDave]

After you saying half a day, I might lower the SG as and when and just see how it goes!

 

[LadyDave]

Well now I'm not sure if the fish do have ich or something else. The spots on my fish are tiny, not salt like.... But all the pictures I've seen of velvet look more like a slime than what my fish have. It's most noticeable on the ends of the fins, under the blue light. They look like a sprinkle of fine white spots on the clear bits of the fins.

Apart from these spots, the fish look TOTALLY fine!! No heavy breathing or rapid gill movements, they're both swimming all over the tank, fins are all upright, no clamping and they are WOLFING their food down.... Definitely no loss of appetite and no lethargy.

Is it possible they could have something else? I've still not quarantined them as I've struggled with water quality and now I'm unsure if it is ich so I'm not sure what to treat them with!!!!

 

[MrTuskfish]

I hate to toss this in. But, with clowns you always have to consider brooklynella when similar parasite ID is uncertain. Brook can take a while to reach the dangerous level, then rapidly kill the fish. Sloughing or peeling skin is the common factor with most cases of brook, but the initial stages can be spots and little else. Once it takes hold, brook is very hard to cure and formalin is the only treatment I know of.

 

[Mrscribbled]

Chloroquine Phosphate has been proven to work on brook. 80mg/g, in this case perhaps the best treatment in that it will treat ich, velvet, and brook.

 

[LadyDave]

Thanks for the responses. Can I get Chloroquine Phosphate at the chemist? All my LFS's have a very small stock of marine treatments. Also, how do I dose it? Would it be a prolonged treatment or of the dip variety?

I went to one of my LFS today to pick up some RO water to mix the hypo salinity stuff as per my previously mentioned plan. The guy there said it sounds more like velvet but suggested QT would stress them too much and increase the infection. I have only had the fish for 2/3weeks so he said stress and the fact the spots disappear and reappear sounds like QT would make it worse.

I'm not overly convinced on his theory and I know the infection may increase anyway so I'm trying my luck with Oodinex. Mainly because I only need to dose over 3 days (perfect!) and it means I don't have to QT them just yet, also because it says it treats a few different diseases which sounded good while I'm so uncertain of what's wrong. I'm not convinced it will work to cure the problem but I'm hoping it may buy me some time while I'm on holiday..... Then I can get down to the better treatments when I get back, by which time, hopefully my QT will be closer to being cycled.

A few hours after dosing the oodinex the fish seem even perkier!! I've been looking at lots of disease pics/descriptions/symptoms and it still seems like ich to me more than anything else. One of them has been showing these tiny spots for at least three days now, would it not be at deaths door if it was velvet or brook by now?

Thanks again for the advice, sorry for the novel I just wrote.... If you're still awake after reading it, I greatly appreciate your input!

 

[Mrscribbled]

Moving a fish to QT for proper treatment isn't stressful IMO, CP can be perscribed by a DMV or purchased on eBay as far as I'm aware. Any "reef safe" medication won't be effective against parasites.