Aquascaping Wet Liverock vs. Dry

[ginoandres]

Hey folks,

I am in the planning stages of my very first SW tank, a custom built 40g breeder with external coast-to-coast Herbie overflow box and 29 gallon sump. I live in Taiwan, which offers certain challenges as far as obtaining the supplies necessary to get everything going.

The custom aquarium builder I'm working with has offered me real liverock at a very good price, and from what I understand it's kept wet and submerged in water although he assures me it is free of pests like bristleworms, crabs, etc. I've been planning on using him as a source, but aquascaping seems like it may prove difficult with wet rock.

First of all, I can't easily saw, chisel, epoxy or secure wet rock to build steady structures... this is a drawback to me because A) I would really enjoy this process and B) I live in earthquake country. The idea of a quake bringing down a liverock tower and crushing the inhabitants of my tank is not very pleasing to me...

That being said, any pointers on aquascaping wet liverock? Has anyone done it? Is it tough to do, relatively easy or a horrible idea? Aesthetics are very important to me so I dread just throwing something together haphazardly the day the guys come to install the system... especially since I'll be looking at it every day for years to come. The builder suggested me picking up the rocks a day early, and then designing the layout at home to be implemented when they show up the next day to install. They will set everything up, help me mix the saltwater and get it going right away.

I thought about maybe buying some dry rock at my LFS and designing most of my layout with that, and then using maybe a few hunks of wet rock to seed them. Would that work? I will also be using dry sand and seeding that with some Red Sea Reef Base and Bio-Spira.

Thoughts? Advice? Suggestions?

 

[hotelbravo]

if i could start over and do it all again i would use dry rock so i can have as much time to play around with it and come up with some neat aquascapes. i vote go with dry rock. besides after a while the dry rock will be the same as the liverock. by the way bristleworms are not pests they are a very important part of a healthy system. crabs however are a pest usually.

 

[ginoandres]

if i could start over and do it all again i would use dry rock so i can have as much time to play around with it and come up with some neat aquascapes. i vote go with dry rock. besides after a while the dry rock will be the same as the liverock. by the way bristleworms are not pests they are a very important part of a healthy system. crabs however are a pest usually.

Yeah, I forgot to mention that sources of dry rock are limited here... I've seen some but not very much. I could look into finding more if it's worth it.

So you set yours up wet? Got any pics or advice?

 

[CarrieB]

I set mine up wet, because I bought it with the tank. My tank is 30" deep, so I made 50g of saltwater in the tank and then placed the biggest rocks in the bottom. I was fortunate enough to have a number of large rocks and was able to place them such that they felt very solid. I did the sand next and filled up the rest of the water before doing the top half of the scape. The smaller rocks on top were definitely more of a challenge, and I ended up leaning some against the back glass to get them as stable as I wanted.

Having said all that, I'm not sure I could swear that they would stay in an earthquake. I used to live in CA, but they aren't so frequent in VA where I am now, so I'm probably okay.) However, your tank isn't as deep, so if the rocks were good size, you might not need too many layers.

I would suggest that you try getting relatively big rocks and see what happens. Until you put other stuff in the tank, you can take your time rearranging the rocks to get something that works and that you like to look at.

 

[CuzzA]

I think it depends on the quality of live rock you're using. If this rock is essentially nothing more than bacteria and coralline algae you can work with it similar to dry rock, but keep the rock wet as you saw, drill, etc. A spray bottle with seawater would work along with an occasional dunk. If the rock is of high quality loaded with life I would be hesitant to start cutting it up as you will most likely have a good amount of die off by removing it from the water for long periods of time. Certain sponges could most certainly be effected if exposed to air. Nevertheless you can still epoxy rock while submerged in your tank. So if it's really good rock I would probably go that route rather than risk a substantial die off.

Lastly, since it sounds like you don't have access to dry rock you could just acid wash the live rock (use caution, research how to safely do this) and let it dry and you'll have dry rock, free of most organics that would later decompose in your system. This would allow you unlimited time to do whatever you want with the aquascape as you would not have any time constraints.

 

[ginoandres]

Great points, thanks guys. My friend also suggested curing the rock and doing an acid wash, followed my drying, but I really don't want to wait another month for this process (as it's already been several months in planning). I know good things don't come fast in this hobby, but a guy has his limits

The die off is not an issue for me as I'll be setting up a new tank and this will contribute to the cycling from what I understand. I guess I'll go into the shop and scope out the quality of the liverock and this may help me to make the final decision. If it's ugly, or poor quality, I may just go on a quest to find dry rock somewhere. In a place like Taiwan, that would be an adventure in and of itself...

 

[The_Reef_Keeper]

I live in Taipei. Which LFS do you use?

 

[psidriven]

Since scape is important to you I'd recommend the dry rock method and get the scape perfect. Just invest in a cheap drill, rods and zip ties.

Plenty of people start dry and seed with a few pieces of live rock or bacteria starter. You can even just use nsw since 高雄 is right on the water, it'll be pretty fresh.

If your Chinese is decent just go on ph84. Plenty of free live rock. I got a pretty decent deal on some choice shelf pieces from a reefer shutting down his tank.

Let me know if you need some help. My Chinese reading is basic but enough to get the gist.

We should start a Taiwan reefers with poor Chinese skills club, haha. Help each other out with the language/culture barrier.

 

[psidriven]

Another thing. Fyi the ball valves used on tanks here sometimes are metal inside the plastic case. Imo I'd avoid all those.

 

[ginoandres]

I live in Taipei. Which LFS do you use?

I have visited a couple in Kaohsiung, but mainly North Kaohsiung Aquarium. Seeing as I'm just starting out, I'm still in the planning and equipment acquisition phase... which has proved a bit challenging here in Taiwan. I'm managing with a friend's help, though, as he lives in Hsinchu and has been reefing since he was a kid.

 

[ginoandres]

Plenty of people start dry and seed with a few pieces of live rock or bacteria starter. You can even just use nsw since 高雄 is right on the water, it'll be pretty fresh.

If your Chinese is decent just go on ph84. Plenty of free live rock. I got a pretty decent deal on some choice shelf pieces from a reefer shutting down his tank.

Let me know if you need some help. My Chinese reading is basic but enough to get the gist.

We should start a Taiwan reefers with poor Chinese skills club, haha. Help each other out with the language/culture barrier.

I've thought about doing NSW as it's readily available but this won't cover my needs for pure top-off water and I'd have to pick up like 10 gallons per month minimally at my LFS (a hassle on a scooter). For these reasons I'm thinking of investing in a RO/DI unit so I can make my own.

I do navigate ph84 regularly with the aid of Google translate as I cannot read Chinese. When I'm really stuck, I ask my wife (who's Taiwanese) for help deciphering the characters. Overall I've bitten off a lot taking up this hobby all alone in Taiwan!

I think I may have sent you a PM a few weeks back looking for some Taiwan-specific pointers on the hobby. I think some kind of group would be GREAT!

 

[ginoandres]

Hey guys, if I started a Taiwan Reefers group on Facebook, is that something you would join? It would be open to everyone but primarily expats and English-speakers living in Taiwan while fumblling along in the hobby...

 

[psidriven]

I'd join. The more people fumbling in the dark the better chance of hitting the light switch.

I do the same thing with my wife, but somethings just don't translate to the non hobbyist.

 

[ginoandres]

I'd join. The more people fumbling in the dark the better chance of hitting the light switch.

I do the same thing with my wife, but somethings just don't translate to the non hobbyist.

LOL!

Taiwan Reefers has been created. Please invite people you know, as right now it's just me and a friend living in Hsinchu.