Best of the Best

[GetJoe]

I have about 10 years of experience with marine fish but, have been away from the hobby for about 15 years. I'm sure a lot has changed.

If you had an unrestricted budget, what equipment would you select for a 180-200 gallon tank/set-up. I grew up believing that the best, while generally being more expensive on the front end, may save me plenty of disappointment and money on the back end. While I will "tinker" with the system, I'm looking for it to be as automated as reasonable with today's technology.

Thanks,
Joe

 

[griss]

Yes, a lot had changed over the years. One thing you're going to be a bit shocked by (if you haven't already researched) is the price of livestock. For example, back in the late 90s/early 2000s you could get a softball size colony of Acropora for $40-50. Now, a 1-2" frag could cost you $20 up to hundreds of dollars (if not more).

Since you seem to want to automate, there are some good systems out there. I only have experience with Apex but, I only use it minimally since I'm a bit old school. That said, Apex, Hydros and Reef Pi all have good reputations.

For return pumps, there are a lot of great DC controllable pumps on the market.

Water movement, again, there are a lot of great controllable/variable speed controlled powerheads out there.

For skimmers, again, there's a lot of good ones on the market. I personally am using an OLD eShopps cone skimmer and have never had any issues with it.

Lighting, as I mentioned, I'm old school and still using Metal Halide with an actinic LED strip light. But, a lot of people like the today's LED systems as you can adjust the color to your liking, they us less energy and produce less heat. Some of the more popular LEDs are:
EcoTech Radions
AquaIllumination
Kessils
Red Sea
Reef Breeders

 

[GetJoe]

Thank you for your response

 

[griss]

Thank you for your response

You are very welcome. Since I am still using 2000s equipment for the most part (and I'm cheap) I don't have personal experience with some of the newer cutting edge equipment. I'm sure others will chime in as well to give a bit more detail. Let me tag a couple people who might provide better guidance @JCOLE @Reefing102 @shred5 @Timfish @wvned @kharmaguru @alton

 

[Timfish]

For automation I'd go with Hydros. I've seen too many problems with APEX to trust it. (The most egregious was an EB8 that had just three AC outlest fail, two for the return pumps and one for a closed loop while the outlet for an air pump that would turn on in case of power failure stayed powered.) For that matter I would always design at least some redundancy into a system so if anything fails there would still be at least water circulation.

Lighting - I'd use either Kessil or Popbloom. I'd avoid Ecotech.

I stopped using skimmers in the 90s and Ken Feldman at Penn State posted research showing they didn't do that much. But after what I've read about the importance of microbiomes I'd I would advise against skimmers, I don't see how it's possible to maintain healthy microbiomes when subsections are arbitrarily removed solely because they have hydrophobic qualities. Skimmers also cannot remove the sugars implicit in coral disease and death.

Sponges are essential recyclers for DOC so use wild or maricultureed liverock. They also the best source for a lot of organisms that can't be cultured and stuck in a bottle. Aquabiomics article shows how maricultured live rock helps reduce the "uglies".


DC pumps are nice but my goto are still Mag pumps.

Dosing and test kit stuff, whatever you find easiest to use to maintain water parameters, so network with local aquarists to see and evaluate what they use.

When you quit the research on PO4 was still being ignored (and stll is by many) so long story short if PO4 drops below .03 mg/l coral photpbiology can be significantly impacted, so keep it above .03. FWIW, upwelling exposes corals to .3 mg/l and there's research showing increased growth at .5. I'm happy with it anywhere between .1 and .5

This is a data bomb but here's some links

"Coral Reefs in the Microbial Seas " This video compliments Rohwer's book of the same title. Used copies are available on line and it may be free to read on Internet Archive. both deal with the conflicting roles of the different types of DOC (carbon dosing) in reef ecosystems and how it can alter coral microbiomes. While there is overlap bewteen his book and the video both have information not covered by the other and together give a broader view of the complex relationships found in reef ecosystems and are an excellent starting point to understand the conflicting roles of Dissolved Organic Carbon (DOC, aka "carbon dosing") in reef ecosystems.

Changing Seas - Mysterious Microbes

Microbial view of Coral Decline

Nitrogen cycling in hte coral holobiont

BActeria and Sponges

Maintenance of Coral Reef Health (refferences at the end)
- YouTube

Optical Feedback Loop in Colorful Coral Bleaching
- YouTube

DNA Sequencing and the Reef Tank Microbiome
- YouTube

Richard Ross What's up with phosphate"
- YouTube

To Save Corals in an Oahu Bay, First Vacuum up Invasive Algae, Then Apply Sea Urchins | response.restoration.noaa.gov

response.restoration.noaa.gov

 

[wvned]

I like my skimmer and the bigger the better.
I suppose though it depends what you want to keep and what you feed the tank. Feeding eels means I throw a handful of fishy chunks in the tank every few days. Could you do it without a skimmer, absolutely. Maybe probably. I assume you would have to have x amount of invert space per y amount of inches of fish or something like that. At this point I am stuck in a rut.

I dont think there has been any giant change in how tanks are kept. Decent equipment brands have changed. The biggest changes have been in DC speed controllable motors, LED lighting and Yes HYDROS then new controller system by Coralview....

The days of heat from large pumps with fractional horse motors are gone for most of us. I use a great many pumps in my system. It evolved over time and I added on as required. One big hot pump doesn't run it all. One pump leaking and breaking doesnt matter much and they are full submersible. Any size you could want from tiny to monsters.

MH or MH/T5 can be used still. I used 8 feet of them when I built my system. But the variety of light, ballasts and bulbs isnt there anymore.
LED isnt that hard. It is different. Basically 2 ways to go. you light each 2x2 box with a small light, how ever many that turns out to be. A few extra is a bit better.
Or you get something approximately the same length as the tank. Like a Reefbreeders Photon. There are others.
The problem that makes LEDs hard is they are dimmable. So you have to decide how much light the tank gets. Too much is bad as is too little.

I never had a controller. No use for Apex. Threads about Apex give me flashbacks from work. Now I have a HYDROs on a 75 gallon freshwater tank as well as my marine system. It keeps the tank full of water and runs the heaters. You can make them perform tasks for you to eliminate drudgery. A water change, make RODI water while timing to flush the membrane and turn the boost pump on, shut the skimmer off and tell you it's full. It actually will do a lot I have no interest in. Like control lighting and flow pumps. Control heaters, leak detectors, automated testing.
You get remote monitoring and event notification too.
The last big change is cost. A largish tank will cost a lot, similar to a decent used car.
Animals are very expensive and around here it all has to be done though the mail. All the petshops are gone and we have Petcos where you might get a few tiny things.

Perhaps a bit of a gripe. There are many people, maybe even most that start with a dead sterile tank. Like a goldfish in a bowl with glass pebbles. Dry live rock. It's not live. Unless you are near the ocean the hardest thing to get are the little things that make up the food chain in a marine tank. Worms shrimps algae nems.
You can get live rock that is actually the same rock (mined) as the dead white stuff. Then the threw it overboard from a ship and left it for a while. It became live rock and no one had to dynamite a reef. Well as you can imaging shipping wet rocks overnight air freight so all the stuff gets to you alive isnt cheap. The trick is to use 50/50 or 60/40 dead rock to live.

 

[ClarkiiClownfish]

Hi Joe, Here is my build thread.

Coming back after 15 years...

Hello RC, It's been a minute. I have the wife talked in to spending the money for a new reef tank! That's like 75% of the battle, right? 🤣 It looks like things have changed just a tad bit from 30 years ago! I've been out 15 years, but I set up my first tank 15 years prior to that. I'd like...

forums.reefcentral.com

I went with Innovative Marine. Definitely not "the best of the best" but a great tank & I think a very good value. It was a package, low-iron glass tank, mesh lid, sump, stand, fuge light, return pump, all the needed plumbing, upgraded 5 year warranty, tax & shipping into my garage for $5,125.00.

I looked high & low for evidence of an Innovative Marine seam failure for months. Couldn't find a single one! So that helped drive my decision too. But you'll see if you read my build thread that I did eventually find one. There is a video link to it. It was literally posted one day after the tank was delivered to my garage Hopefully that is not a bad omen. IM did send him a new tank, but man, what a hassle that would be.

I really wanted a rimless Cade peninsula tank, but it was about 3 grand more for basically the same thing. My Innovative Marine does have a euro-brace which I really didn't want when I decided to get back into the hobby & started researching tanks. But reading about the possibility of rimless tanks leaking, I am more than OK with it now. Plus it provides a very convenient spot to set your frozen food cup when feeding.

By comparison, I was quoted $8000.00 from Planet to do a same size peninsula tank with low-iron glass, TANK ONLY. No stand, no sump, no shipping, no nothing else included. While they are definitely considered one of the "best of the best", I just didn't want to have $12K-$15K into my build before buying all the peripherals like, stand, lights, return/flow pumps, skimmer, UV, RO/DI, plumbing, etc. Glasscages quote was a tad less, but still more than I wanted to spend on tank only.

Both IM & Cade are made in China, as is Red Sea & most (if not all others), except a custom tank builder like Planet, or Glasscages and others. Those are made in the USA. I just didn't have the budget for a USA made 200g Peninsula.

I started by curing out my rock in a 55g barrel months before it went in the tank. Tank was basically cycled instantly because all the rock was fully cured beforehand. Haven't seen an "ugly phase" yet. Knock on wood, hopefully never will. If you are local to StL you are more than welcome to come have a look at my tank if you think it's something you'd be interested in.

 

[wvned]

Recently there have been some amazing deals on here. New still wrapped 300 gallon 8 foot tank I think went for $300. Get it out.
Thank goodness none is ever near me.