Black Tang on death bed - please help

[eisaiasjr]

I put all my fish on copper as recommended. All my chromis except 1-2 are fine, my clown is fine...

However, I have my black tang on the floor of the aquarium breathing heavy. he still has some energy, tries to swing when I reach for him.

WHAT DO I DO?

Should I remove him from the tank? I have a 29 biocube that I can setup quickly and I can transfer some rock and water from my other tank that is decease free... any thoughts?

I really dont want to loose this fish!

Best Regards,

Estefano

 

[eisaiasjr]

I guess it was too late...

The next question is, what can I do so that this doesnt happen again? why was he on the floor like breathing heavy like that? was it because the water was full of ammonia? how can this be prevented next time?

Best Regards,

Estefano

 

[b0bab0ey]

I'm assuming you're treating w/Copper because of Ich? And the Black Tang has Ich?

Some thoughts:

- Have you tested your Copper level? It shouldn't be any higher than 0.5 mg/L.
- Your fish need more oxygen when treating w/Copper, so add an air stone or something.
- Have you tested your Ammonia, pH, etc.? Maybe one of your parameters is off.
- Copper is essentially poison, some fish just can't handle it. You might want to do a big WC, reduce your Copper level temporary and see if that helps.
- This could just be the late stages of Ich taking hold (or something else). If so, I don't see what else you can do but wait it out and hope the Copper does it's thing in time.

 

[spieszak]

Copper can put a sick fish over the edge. Its likely the stress of the catch and move along with the copper and the ich (assumption) just took its toll. Prevention for next time is to QT so as not to have to HT later...If possible, keep a sponge in your DT/sump so that you have seeding bacteria to throw in your HT if you have to do this again. (once its been in the HT its garbage...and a small sponge won't shouldn't be enough to become a nitrate sink)

 

[spieszak]

+1 on validating your copper level though... I made the assumption that you would have checked and double checked the "standard things...

 

[Definitive_Aqua]

yup this is why copper is a great treatment if you can get it in early enough... otherwise there are other options available that are no where near as stressful - ie sulfa drugs.

 

[scuzy]

yeah i use cupramine and check with the seachem test kits to keep at not full dose of 0.5mg/L but around 0.4Mg/l for 3 weeks. This will lessen the toll on the fish as well. I have currently 4 fish in QT right now and they're doing great. Only one i have lost was the male Flame but that was because he couldn't handle any of the copper treatment that well.

 

[Pyrrhus]

yup this is why copper is a great treatment if you can get it in early enough... otherwise there are other options available that are no where near as stressful - ie sulfa drugs.

I've never heard of using sulfas for external protozoan parasites, do you have a link to more info on this?

Metronidazole is recommended by some manufacturers as a treatement for protozoan parasites, but not advocated by any of the known disease experts.

Known effective remedy's are hypo, copper, formalin, and tank transfer.

It should also be noted that if Cupramine is used this product has specific attributes that can be lethal to fish if misapplied, UV, ozone and some ammonia/chlorine removers can instantly increase the toxicity of Cupramine.

 

[eisaiasjr]

I did not check the levels of copper however I followed instructions on the package and dosed 5ml for every 4 gallons of water. I measured the exact amount of gallons that went into the tank and dosed accordingly.

I guess I should have checked, I have never had to medicate any fish before...

Best Regards,

Estefano

 

[scuzy]

Your fish most likely died from high ammonia. Was the tank cycled ?

 

[MrTuskfish]

I've never heard of using sulfas for external protozoan parasites, do you have a link to more info on this?

Metronidazole is recommended by some manufacturers as a treatement for protozoan parasites, but not advocated by any of the known disease experts.

Known effective remedy's are hypo, copper, formalin, and tank transfer.

It should also be noted that if Cupramine is used this product has specific attributes that can be lethal to fish if misapplied, UV, ozone and some ammonia/chlorine removers can instantly increase the toxicity of Cupramine.

This is fairly new for me too. Quinine Sulfate has been discussed quite a bit on this forum, including some links to Bob Fenner's site: Wetwebmedia. QS is now the treatment of choice for Fenner. That says a lot, IMO. If you search this site and WWM, you'll find lots of info. I've used copper (and a de-wormer), as a prophylactic, in QT for years now and I'll continue. I haven't seen any parasites in my DTs since I started this procedure; but if I had to treat a fish with ich today--I'd probably use Quinine Sulfate. It really does sound like the real thing; not the useless "reef-safe' or simply anecdotal accounts. Here's a thread with lots of good links:http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1974075

 

[MrTuskfish]

Ich really likes a fish's gills and often attacks there first. Although most tangs really show the tell-tale spots. If I remember, wasn't this fish hiding quite a bit before you started treatment? If so, he may have been worse off than you realized. His behavior is typical of a fish with his gills full of parasites. Of course, all the above posts are real possibilities too.

 

[Definitive_Aqua]

Dont have any links per say just the way we use the meds and have been successful in our facility. QS will treat ich strains that are resistant to copper and protozoans - its also great for treating Hexamita if you mix it properly with Metronidazole

PS all these drugs I speak of you can probably order in raw format but API has the best mix and actually shows % in their products. I never recommend using a med that doesnt disclose EXACTLY whats in their products.

 

[Pyrrhus]

I am aware of the uses for Quinine Sulfate, the previous mention was for "sulfa drugs" not Quinine Sulfate, which caused the confusion.

 

[Definitive_Aqua]

sorry for the confusion i just kind of group TMP, Tripple and QS together after all these years. The other two sulfas are more for bacterial treatments and work really good for them