howdy I'm new to Fish only tanks and thus pretty much new to angels although I have a bellus pair in my reef tank. I have a handful of reef tanks and have decided to put together a 375g Fish only with liverock. I was scoping out some of the angels at my fish store and asked one of the owners if its possible to keep multiple angels in a tank the size of mine, he said I could probably keep 3 or 4 even in a tank that size. Now I am one not to trust store owners when it comes to something they sell so I'm asking yall. The angel I've decided I definately want is the Atlantic blue angel, Holocanthus isabelita, not the Holocanthus bermudensis. I'll definately be stocking the tank with juvi fishs as I like to watch them grow but want to plan the tank out so that they'll be comfortable at their larger fuller size. Thought, opinions, questions, comments, and any good red neck jokes are welcome
can I keep multiple angels in a large tank??
- Thread starter jsl6v8
- Start date
I really like the queens, the blue face, and the blue ring (I like blue and yellow together could you tell). But I understand that with the Atlantic blue angel, Holocanthus isabelita, the one angel I'll definately be getting, that due to their being the relatively same shape and coloration that I'd be unable to keep one of them with the Atlantic blue angel. So I've been looking at other angels that I'd like to put with them. I'm thinking max I'd put in is 3, unless I get really tempted.
JazzZero
New member
I personally think you can keep multiple angelfish in one tank especially that the size of yours. You could possibly keep 5-7 angelfish but note the aggressiveness of an angelfish varies depending on genus such as Geni...(swallows) will be less aggressive than that of the Holo (queen, king and etc)... genuses. Also in the odd chance you may get a less aggressive angelfish that has known to be quite aggressive. Your biggest concern should be how and which to add first and last. It help pick the specific angelfish you want and make a list from the least to most aggressive and also take size into consideration. The reason why i say take size into conderation is because i have seen a large 7inch scribbled angelfish (one of the least aggressive IMO) bully a 4 inch Maculous (known to be one of the most aggressive IMO). Anyhow good luck with your tank.
ccampbell57
Premium Member
Hey JSL,
A 375 is a good size tank for multiple large angels. I am currently planning a min. 375g tank for my basement in which I will transplanting my 9+" emperor, 9" Blueface, and 6" queen (along with all my other fish in my signiture).
I am planning on adding a couple more angels in the mix as well once the tank is established for a few months and I get all the kinks out.
Key with adding multiple angels is the following:
- Different species is key. My emperor definitely pays more attention to the Blueface, but since they have been together for so long it is a grunt here and a grunt there.
- Different colors - many people add juvis because they are small. As you know, most all large angel juvies are similar in color and close in shape. IME, if you want different angels, add them at various stages of growth. I would say no larger than 5" (due to diet in the wild. Larger angels are harder to get to eat in home aquaria because of their feeding habits in the wild).
- Different sizes - along with the coloration difference, the sizes need to be different as well. When I added my blueface and my original french angel they were larger (by 2+") than my emperor. I did this due to the fact that I knew that the emperor was going to be the most aggressive. When I added my Queen. She was half the size of the emperor.
- Lots of hiding space - this is the key concept. When you add a new angel, it is advised to take the LR out and re-arrange so that the personal "spaces" of the established angels is disturbed.
- Feeding - make sure that your angels are eating EVERYTHING! Many times the larger of the angels will eat first (much like a male lion in a pride). If you add an angel that selectively eats or is timid to get in there and "fight" for thier meal, they will be in trouble.
- Food - you need to have a wide variety of food for your angels. Currently, my fish eat flake, pellets, frozen meaty and veggie cubes (sponge included), seaweed, silversides, and frozen krill. As a treat a few times a week I feed the tank PE M.Y.S.I.S. All my food is soaked in Vitachem and Garlic.
- Water quality - almost reef-like conditions. I have never had over 10ppm. I can quickly tell when the water needs changing because the emperor shows stress spots when something needs adjustment.
A 375 is a good size tank for multiple large angels. I am currently planning a min. 375g tank for my basement in which I will transplanting my 9+" emperor, 9" Blueface, and 6" queen (along with all my other fish in my signiture).
I am planning on adding a couple more angels in the mix as well once the tank is established for a few months and I get all the kinks out.
Key with adding multiple angels is the following:
- Different species is key. My emperor definitely pays more attention to the Blueface, but since they have been together for so long it is a grunt here and a grunt there.
- Different colors - many people add juvis because they are small. As you know, most all large angel juvies are similar in color and close in shape. IME, if you want different angels, add them at various stages of growth. I would say no larger than 5" (due to diet in the wild. Larger angels are harder to get to eat in home aquaria because of their feeding habits in the wild).
- Different sizes - along with the coloration difference, the sizes need to be different as well. When I added my blueface and my original french angel they were larger (by 2+") than my emperor. I did this due to the fact that I knew that the emperor was going to be the most aggressive. When I added my Queen. She was half the size of the emperor.
- Lots of hiding space - this is the key concept. When you add a new angel, it is advised to take the LR out and re-arrange so that the personal "spaces" of the established angels is disturbed.
- Feeding - make sure that your angels are eating EVERYTHING! Many times the larger of the angels will eat first (much like a male lion in a pride). If you add an angel that selectively eats or is timid to get in there and "fight" for thier meal, they will be in trouble.
- Food - you need to have a wide variety of food for your angels. Currently, my fish eat flake, pellets, frozen meaty and veggie cubes (sponge included), seaweed, silversides, and frozen krill. As a treat a few times a week I feed the tank PE M.Y.S.I.S. All my food is soaked in Vitachem and Garlic.
- Water quality - almost reef-like conditions. I have never had over 10ppm. I can quickly tell when the water needs changing because the emperor shows stress spots when something needs adjustment.
I want to keep to some of the less aggressive angels as I will be consolidating some of the fish from my old reef tanks into the fish only, including my bellus angel pair. I plan on doing daily 5g water changes to keep water quality to a premium. I was planning on adding the angels all at once, thus none of them having an established home and being a bit skittish due to them being in a new place, this is what I've seen people do before in the past with tangs but not sure if it will work with angels the same way. I'm having a hard time finding any sort of chart or guidelines as to which angels are more or less aggressive than others.
We plan on having a 2 or 3 island rock structures in the tank to provide hide places as there will be some smaller fishes in the tank, lyretail anthias, a mystery wrasse, a lawnmower blenny, but they are in the tank with a naso and a gold spot rabbit fish, a foxface, a powder brown, and another wrasse.
As for feeding due to my large varity of fish I already feed everything mentioned by ccampbell with the exception of silversides, I feed the M.Y.S.I.S nightly to my current fish.
Think that addressed everything...
if someone knows of an aggressive chart for angels that would be very helpful, based on what you've said I wonder if a Pomacanthus annularis, Pygoplites diacanthus, or Chaetodontoplus duboulayi would be ok with the Holocanthus isabelita. Or if any or all of them would be ok together if I did it right. Like I said I'll probably only be adding 3 but those are some that we've found that we like but we are pretty much set on the Holocanthus isabelita.
We plan on having a 2 or 3 island rock structures in the tank to provide hide places as there will be some smaller fishes in the tank, lyretail anthias, a mystery wrasse, a lawnmower blenny, but they are in the tank with a naso and a gold spot rabbit fish, a foxface, a powder brown, and another wrasse.
As for feeding due to my large varity of fish I already feed everything mentioned by ccampbell with the exception of silversides, I feed the M.Y.S.I.S nightly to my current fish.
Think that addressed everything...
if someone knows of an aggressive chart for angels that would be very helpful, based on what you've said I wonder if a Pomacanthus annularis, Pygoplites diacanthus, or Chaetodontoplus duboulayi would be ok with the Holocanthus isabelita. Or if any or all of them would be ok together if I did it right. Like I said I'll probably only be adding 3 but those are some that we've found that we like but we are pretty much set on the Holocanthus isabelita.
nureefer2008
In Memoriam
I have a 180 gal. and have an emperor with anularis angel. they both are about 6 inches. They do fight ocassionally but no injuries yet (knock on wood).
lesleybird
New member
Hi, I have a Majestic and a Scribbled angel in my 200 gallon. I had a Goldflake in there also but it never ate from day one so it died. I also have a Potter's pygme angel in there too.... the larger angels usually could care less about the pygme's as long as there is a notable size difference. You need to get this book that I have called Angelfishes & Butterfly fishes by Scott W. Michael as his book tells you how to go about mixing big angels and in what sizes and order etc. to have the best chance of them getting along. You can get a gently used one at amazon.com for a lot cheaper than new.
My Majestic was in there first and when I put the Scribbled in the Scribbled stayed kind of in the corner out of his way for the first week (they are both about 4 inches). After a week or so the Majestic only showed minor aggression toward it and now they can eat side by side. You might also want to throw in a couple of butterflies in the mix. I got this yellow Semilarvatus butterfly pair about the same size and they get along in there also. You can also throw a royal gramma and some colorful fairy wrasses in the mix without problems. Stay away from sixline wrasses because one that I had liked to kill other small fish and I have heard of other people complain of the same.
Get yourself a little cleaner goby (not wrasse), too as mine with the blue stripe likes to clean all my fish and eats all other foods also (unlike the cleaner wrasse that will starve). Unlike my cleaner shrimp, my goby never gets lazy about cleaning and my large angels seek him out when they have a need for his services. You can keep one pair of clowns in there also.
I don't do tangs as they get ich too easily and have that sharp thing on the back of their tail (although I think they are pretty too). I would get yourself a powerful UV and run a slow flow rate the keep the ich down. I have found that most of my large angelfish can fight off the ich fairly well if not in overcrowded or in poor water as they have fairly thick scales and the ich usually does not attach to them as readily as the softer skin on the tangs.
Good luck, and have fun with your new tank ! Lesley
My Majestic was in there first and when I put the Scribbled in the Scribbled stayed kind of in the corner out of his way for the first week (they are both about 4 inches). After a week or so the Majestic only showed minor aggression toward it and now they can eat side by side. You might also want to throw in a couple of butterflies in the mix. I got this yellow Semilarvatus butterfly pair about the same size and they get along in there also. You can also throw a royal gramma and some colorful fairy wrasses in the mix without problems. Stay away from sixline wrasses because one that I had liked to kill other small fish and I have heard of other people complain of the same.
Get yourself a little cleaner goby (not wrasse), too as mine with the blue stripe likes to clean all my fish and eats all other foods also (unlike the cleaner wrasse that will starve). Unlike my cleaner shrimp, my goby never gets lazy about cleaning and my large angels seek him out when they have a need for his services. You can keep one pair of clowns in there also.
I don't do tangs as they get ich too easily and have that sharp thing on the back of their tail (although I think they are pretty too). I would get yourself a powerful UV and run a slow flow rate the keep the ich down. I have found that most of my large angelfish can fight off the ich fairly well if not in overcrowded or in poor water as they have fairly thick scales and the ich usually does not attach to them as readily as the softer skin on the tangs.
Good luck, and have fun with your new tank ! Lesley
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I definately plan on getting some angels, and I have a couple wrasses that will be going into the tanks along with my female naso tang and my powder brown, I personally find peoples ich issues to be a lack of proper quarenteening or inspection of the store in which they purchased the tang. Six lines get a bad wrap I had one for years before the stupid thing jumped, he was really quite docile, order you push the fish in seems to make a big difference. I'll also have a small harem of lyretail anthias in the mix and some cleaners. I'm not a big fan of the UV as they have a tendency not only to kill bacteria but the good bacteria thats keeping your tank stable as well. I have an ozone generator though that I will run once a week or so to keep water quality up, only with my daily 5g water changes. I'll definately have to look into that book, does it give a list of the different angels and butterflys with their requirements and what not or is it just a generalization about all angels and butterflys.
lesleybird
New member
Answer to your question. The book goes in detail about the habits, size and character including the level of aggressiveness of the different angels and butterflies. Good luck, Lesley
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