Clam help

[Volcano1]

Loosing my mature clams. All been in the same tank 4-5 years. Started with the smallest , moving to the largest.Smallest 4-5" largest so far 7". These have all beeen crocea, maxima's. My large derasea not looking good, around 9".
Have a 9" squamaosa and 18" gigas left.
Water parameters
1.026 sg
alk 3.5
cal 420
phos less than .03
nitrate 0
temp 78.5
orp 430
These are in a 600 gallon system with 3x 250 14k phoenix and 2 x 150 14 k phoenix.
No clams have been moved.
Only fish I ever see around clams has been a small cleaner wrasse.
This started around 6 months ago, and has been continuing.
I have been using alittle more gfo, as I got a larger reactor. Been slowly increasing gfo. This is the only change and possible cause.
Corals look better, clams look worse.

Any help would be great.
Thanks,

Todd

 

[Mentat]

Re: Clam help

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14573463#post14573463 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Volcano1
...This started around 6 months ago, and has been continuing.
I have been using alittle more gfo, as I got a larger reactor. Been slowly increasing gfo. This is the only change and possible cause.
Corals look better, clams look worse...

Sorry about your Clams, can you post any pictures of the ailing ones? Does it looks like pinched mantle? if so, recommend read this thread: http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1577621&highlight=pinched+mantle .

 

[Volcano1]

No, doesn't look like pinched mantle. They just start recessing slowly, until they don't come out at all.

 

[a4twenty]

can you post your fish / invert list??

and please post a few pics of the remaining clams.

 

[Volcano1]

Assorted snails,1 yellow cuke,cleaner shirmp.
Blue hippo , purple ,nasso tangs.
One spot fox face rabbit.
lyretail anthias.
Radiant and cleaner wrasse.
pseduchromis fredmani
2 clowns
maderian goby
Think I got em all.
Try and get pics later when lights come on.

 

[Volcano1]

Missed a six line wrasse on above list.
Closer observation looks like the blue hippo might have been nipping on gigas mantle.First I ever saw.Trying to relocate him, half the reef tore apart, no having much luck.
Anybody have any trouble with hippos and clams?
Been together since day 1, 7 plus years.

 

[Volcano1]

Clam pics

Squammy don't look to good, might not make it.

 

[Volcano1]

Old pic, other clams I had where in top center, hard to see.

 

[a4twenty]

tangs can sometimes be a problem.........try to keep an eye on him.

did this all start with the addition of the larger reactor??

do you run AC? if not you may want to start.

have you had any problems with the DSBs??

any problems with your Alk? ( spikes / reactor problems )

check them for pyramid snails? look an hour or two after lights out. ( not likely considering how long you've had the clams ).

 

[12gallonbaby]

i would check for pyramid snails! i had the same symptoms with my clams and I lost my crocea and derasa before finding them on my last clam. I clean him every night and he is slowly looking more normal. good luck

 

[Volcano1]

Started around 6 months ago.Been keeping an eye out for snails, checking alk.
Do run ac, usually change out every 2 weeks.
All reactors flow in to skimmer feed pump intake, hopefully to resolve any excess gfo. Switched to the pellets also to help cut down on any residue.
Do have a remote DSB in half of one of the 2, 100 gallon sumps.
I'll clean the sand bed there.
Have a nitrate reactor also, but will recheck nitrate levels.
Seemed to start with smallest and move to largest clams.
All the ones on the top of the tank were effected and the ones on the sand bed were fine.
Once those were gone, progessed to the sand bed and larger clams.
Seemed like small ones would start fully expanding, then large.
Guessing large have more reserves to draw from for energy vs small.

Thanks for everyones help so far.

 

[a4twenty]

i'm just sorry i haven't been able to be more help , it's very frustrating not knowing why and having to just sit there and watch. ( i just went through this with a S. gigantea anemone )

don't disturb the DSB, i was just wondering if it had been disturbed and possibly released something into the water column.

when did you switch to pellets?? ( what brand? )

i'm trying to find anything that has changed from about a month or two before the symptoms appeared. i agree, the larger clams will be more resilient but that also leads me back to a water / lighting / conditions problem.

the only thing i can suggest is to double check your params and have a stakeout to look for a predator. though the predator seems unlikely because of the apparent order of demise.

 

[Volcano1]

Went from bulk reef supply high capacity granules to pellets. Pellets definately alot less mess. Rechecked all water again, everything seems fine. Did loose the squamy. Plan on a water change today and see if that helps.Skimming a little wetter. Posted on reef chemistry forum. suggested that maybe phosphate droped too fast, by increasing some GFO.Nothing elese is stressed in the tank, just the opposite.Guessing something that clams are very sensitive to.dEbating trying to temp house last two, but one is massive and don't know if it would stress them more or not.

One thing I did notice, when I added phyto, clams seemed to close more.??

 

[a4twenty]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14593588#post14593588 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Volcano1
Posted on reef chemistry forum. suggested that maybe phosphate droped too fast, by increasing some GFO.

is a possibility, there is no doubt that clams ( or the zoox. more specifically in this case ) need nitrogen and phosphorous but they can take it directly from the water. ( in the form of NH3,NO3 and PO4 ). i find it hard to believe that the GFO could pull all the PO4 before some got to the clams......

for example

we test our tanks for NH3 and get a reading of 0. does this mean there is no NH3 being produced??? of course not, it's just being processed. same for the PO4, it's being produced and would have to get to the reactor without touching or being filtered by the clam.

i think it's worth a try to shut off the reactor for a while and see what happens, we're running low on other options.

good luck and let us know how it goes.

PS: are you target feeding or dosing the tank with phyto?

 

[Volcano1]

More target type I guess,Put it in the water downstream, let it drift to the clams.Have never taken them out and placed them in a bowl with phyto. Haven't blown phyto right in front of there opening.

 

[allhobbs]

Hi,
I wanted to let you know that about 8 months ago my Hippo Tang went on a rampage and killed 5 of my clams before I could catch her with a fish trap. She was taking big bites out of the mantle. I had 13 clams, but buy the time I finally caught her, she had killed 5 and the others had lots of bites out of their mantle. When it first started, I noticed that they weren't opening as much and it was less each day 'till they finally died. I didn't notice her biting them at first. I finally saw her doing it one day and borrowed a trap. It took almost 2 weeks for her to finally go in the trap. My clams have been happy since I removed her. The mantles healed and you would never know they had so many bites missing. Please keep an eye on your Hippo tang.
Thanks,
Mary

 

[Volcano1]

Thanks Mary,
I only noticed her do it on one occassion. I rearranges some corals near her"cave", and it left a slightly smaller opening.The offended clam was directly in front. Made the opening bigger, hope this wasn't an issue as well. I'll keep an eye out. Posted in the reef fish forum also , asking about hippo behavior. Someone said that they ahd an issue with thiers nipping when it wasn't well fedd. Feeding a little more to her now also. She is the biggest pig by far.Thank you for the info.

 

[a4twenty]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14596630#post14596630 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Volcano1
More target type I guess,Put it in the water downstream, let it drift to the clams.Have never taken them out and placed them in a bowl with phyto. Haven't blown phyto right in front of there opening.

it's actually better to dose the tank. clams filter water 24 / 7 for respiration and giving them to much phyto at one time can actually clog their gills.

 

[brentj]

I hope you figure it out. I found this thread because I'm having the same problem (sounds like similar at least). After a week, I think I have some suspicion that the cleaner wrasse is har-wrassing them into staying closed. They actually open a little more at night when he's asleep somewhere.

I'm looking for snails but only see a few little round ones and tiny starfish.

How long do these clams take to die after this starts? I'm going to trap my cleaner and see if there's improvement....