Help please with Zoas

[Tmabry]

Hi all!

I am new to the forums but have been reading seems like forever. I just started my new reeftank two months ago. I purchased some Zoas from a LFS. The first couple days they opened and looked lovely! For over a month now they have not opened at all.

Here are some of the things I have done bbased on reading here and advice from the LFS. I used Coral RX to dip them. I have done a R/O water dip twice. I found a hitchhiker (decorator crab) near them and removed him. I added a timer to my lights that comes on at 4:30 and goes off at 10:30EST. LFS thought I was giving them to much light. I have moved them from the top of the tank, to middle and finally on the sandbed and back again.

Here is a little info about my tank. I have a new Biocube 29g with the bioballs removed with Bio Pellets in the second chamber. I have a nano protien skimmer in the first chamber. The lighting is stock Corallife lighting. I did add the 4 additional blue LEDS to the extra sockets. Water has been fine every Tuesday I have them check it for me. Temp stays around 78-79, Salinity has been consistant at 1.023. I use Brightwell A&B for water balance. There is no fish in the tank currently. I have some snails, a Blood Shrimp, emeral crab, few hermits and 2 peppermint shrimp. I have 30lbs of live rock and sand subsrate which was about a 1lb.

Also, I have frogspawn, Red and green war coral, Green Star polyp, Green/Blue Mushroom and Heteroxenia in the same tank all doing amazing.

If I left anything out please forgive me. I attached pictures. The first is about 2 days after tank introduction. The second is about 2 weeks and the third is roughly 2 days ago.

Thanks for any help and suggestions.

 

[10sojs]

What is you water parameter?(Especially Alk) What is the type of peppermint shrimp? How many zoa do you have? Are they all closed?

 

[Tmabry]

My alkalinity is around 120. pH is roughly 7.8. I didn't know there were deferent peppermint shrimp so Ill post some pics

 

[A. Grandis]

Assuming the tank is already perfectly cycled...

I don't recommend bio pellets. They aren't necessary.
Neither the bio balls, so that part is done, once you already removed them.
If you want to take the bio pellets from the tank do it slowly through couple of weeks or a month, depending on how much do you have in there. Make sure you know what you're doing with the bio pellets. Ask yourself why you've got them in the first place and do a search about it.

With the Corallife HOT5 fixture you don't need LED supplementation at all. Just get the best bulb combination for your system and be happy. I'm guessing you've got the surface area of your tank pretty much covered by the Corallife fixture. The LEDs will add some blue to the system and the shimmering. If you like that there is no problem at all to keep them there.

Alkalinity is 120??? That's wrong.
Please make sure you have an alkalinity test and that the test is still ok to be used.
It should be kept between 2.5 - 3.5 meq/L or 7 - 10dKH.
So 120 is just impossible.

pH of 7.8 is very low!! You pH should be around 8.2 during day time with lights on.
Water changes for that!! A good salt is Instant Ocean.

Begin doing some water changes and forget the 2 part from Brightwell's for now.
10% of the total volume and wait 2 or 3 days to check alkalinity, salinity and other params. You've got to buy the tests (phosphate, alkalinity, calcium, magnesium, nitrate...).

The water changes will help you lots.
Just trust me on that!!
Do it slow and make sure you keep salinity stable with an ATO system, if you can.

There are many variables in keeping zoanthids and the more stable the system is, with the right values, the better for them.

Good luck!

Grandis.

 

[Reefer54]

^ +1

 

[Tmabry]

Hey Thank you Grandis for the feedback.


I added the Bio Pellets because the LFS told me that my Nitrates were getting up there. The older guy there said that eventually I would have to remove the Bioballs because they would do more harm than good. I added the Biopellets he recommended (the entire bag) and removed the Bioballs all at once based on what he said. That caused a huge issue and the tank basically cycled again. It was also real cloudy for a few days. I did have one fish in it then as you can figure he didnt make it.

I went back to the LFS and talk to a younger guy that does their servicing. I could read the "oh crap" look on his face when I explained things. He told me to take out all but a third of the Biopellets and add a small protein skimmer in the back first chamber. He actually gave me the skimmer for the bad advice and the loss of the lone fish I had in there. So three weeks later here I am without the Bioballs and a nano skimmer in the back.

Also, the water changes I do about once a month. I use premixed Nutri-seawater. Is this good? Should I mix my own water? Sorry for all the questions, just very new to this and want to make sure I am doing things correctly. I have been doing about 2-3 gallon water changes per month which is around 10%. Im guessing there is roughly 22-25 gallons of actual water in the tank, hence the 2-3 gallon changes. Should I increase this? If so how much?


I had the water tested again today and here are the results

Salinity 1.022
pH is 7.8
Alkalinity is 10
Calcium is 440 ppm
Phosphate is 0ppm
Nitrate is 40ppm
Nitrite is .5 ppm

Again, thank you for the help. So much info out there. I appreciate all the help.

 

[A. Grandis]

Sorry to hear about that crazy advice!

Also, on their site, the Nutri-Seawater says:
"NO WAITING... JUST ADD FISH!®"
"100% Natural Live Ocean Saltwater -"Simply The Best""
"(BRAND) Natural Live Marine Bacteria"

http://www.nutriseawater.com

They even got their "®" sign there!! LOL!

The truth is that any natural sea water will have bacteria in it and they are simply natural occurring bacteria. Natural sea water will normally have good and bad bacteria, by the way. Their bacteria has a "QX-23®" mark, which is a "patented methodology to preserve live bacteria in the marine environment". Probably chemicals added to the water.
They act like their bacteria is somehow very special, planktonic. That's a marketing strategy to me! Even if it's planktonic, and preserved by their methodology product, doesn't mean that's a great addition to a reef system in any special way.

When bacteria settles on substrate and act with the nitrification/denitrification processes they won't need to be added nor boosted! Period! They are in the system and work with the system without problems for years and years, when proper maintenance is done. Live rocks and live sand are good ways to introduce such bacteria to your system.

The use of natural sea water is perfectly fine, but it needs to follow the natural qualities of reef water. When you do water changes and your pH is 7.8 it isn't right!
Their claim is that pH of their water is 8.3, and specific gravity is 1.027.
How can yours show 7.8 and 1.022 respectively?
Perhaps you should measure their water before adding to the tank.

Just add fish? Really? Things don't work like that, unfortunately.
Any tank needs proper cycling! The fact you have natural sea water doesn't mean that you can just add fish right a way!! That's false, I'm sorry!

Your pH is low. The saltwater they've got is probably from a source that does that!
Perhaps the NSW they sold to you was defective? LOL!!

Natural sea water pH has to be around 8.2!!!
Plus, they probably add those "magic portions" and possibly some bacteria to the water (?), which could affect the chemistry of that water.

My suggestion, after all this, is to get a relatively good salt mix and an DI/RO unit to filter your tap water.
That's what people normally do and that way you'll have H2O from your tap and the salt you bought. Instant Ocean is ok and has been in the market for long time. I've also used Red Sea salt. No problems with that too. Mix to 1.023 - 1.024.

If you have enough live rock you won't need bio pellets.

Hopefully your skimmer is good enough too. Some of the skimmers do nothing for the system. Do a search on yours to see what people say about it.

Your nitrite shows the cycle isn't done.
What happen do the Nutriseawater statement????
I though would be easy, just add fish, right?!?!
Unfortunately we just can't trust on that.

Your nitrates are high!!! Water changes with proper salt mix and DI/RO water will help with that.

Salinity of NSW isn't normally 1.022 either...
NSW has a 1.023 - 1.026 SG, sometimes a bit higher, depending where you collect the water.

Perhaps you need to get together with your local reef club, if there is one there. Posting your location help others to offer personal free help through the local clubs in your area.

I wouldn't even argue nor ask for any advice from the LFS anymore. When you go there please just avoid asking questions, 'cause if they don't know about tank cycling that shows how much they know about the other subjects.
We don't want to know what store that is.
To expose them won't normally change their attitude and it normally does more harm then good. They need to learn from the local reef club too!! Call the LFS's owner to the meetings, after you meet the reef club. That way you'll help them too!
Good luck!

Grandis.