HELP!!! Reef Crisis!

SYS7EMATIC

New member
Ok, so last night my girlfriend and I got back to the house a little late. We decided to feed the fish/corals etc before going to bed. My girlfriend did the feeding. In my opinion, she fed them way too much. Our water quality is usually perfect though so I figured maybe it would give some of our night owls a chance to do some extra scavenging. At this time, the corals and everybody were all in great shape. Our fire shrimp likes to come out of his hiding spot and reach his hands inside the turkey baster to pull food out. He did that as normal.

When I woke up in the morning, the water was cloudy and all of the corals were shrunken, and oozing. The fire shrimp was dead, all of our snails had come out of the sand and were in some kind of comatose state (not actually dead suprisingly, but certainly not their usual selves.) I immediately tested the water. Everything seemed to be fine (ammonia, nitrate, nitrite...ph was the only thing off, it was around 8.0 perhaps a bit lower). I performed a 20-25% water change immediately and added buffer until the ph stabilized around 8.3. I figured that although it sucked losing the fire shrimp, I had done all that I could do and that after a couple of hours everything would settle down and return to normal. It's been almost all day, and things are only getting worse.


Now I'm afraid that my corals have died. Despite the water change, corals are looking worse, and now ammonia is up to .25 ppm. Should I perform another water change in such a short amount of time? How will I know if a coral has actually died and isnt just stunned, or stressed out? All of the fish seem to be doing fine. For the most part, everything has been accounted for. I'm having trouble finding our fire goby, but that isnt anything new.

Any ideas as to what might have sparked all of this? Could one round or excessive feeding cause this in such a short amount of time (8 hours?) More importantly, what should I do now to restore things back to normal. If corals have died, should I take the rocks out so that the water isnt spoiled even further? The tank has always been very very healthy. Everything is quite literally covered in zooanthids and what not. If the corals have died, I cant imagine how bad the water could become when they start to decay.

oh, and the temperature was fine. 78.4 degrees.

Specs are as follows:

technical: 29g biocube with at least 40 lbs of live rock, refugium mod with chaeto under fluorescent lighting. Two koralia pumps (not sure how many gph it is, flow seems to be quite good in the tank though.) on a wave maker system. 20 lbs of live sand. 2 36 watt pc lamps (10,000k and actinic). I forgot what type of heater, but it's nice and consistent.

livestock: A bazillion zooanthids...I couldnt even give you a rough estimate, but theres alot, everything is virtually covered in various zooanthids. Clove polyps, green star polyps, galaxea, a green senularis (spelling?), gbta, a bunch of frogspawn, pipe organ, and probably 10-12 ricordia

Had a fire shrimp, probably 15 nacarius snails, 15 blue legged hermit crabs, red starfish, six line wrasse, black and white clown fish, small yellow tang (yes I know, it was in there temporarily until my 72 gallon tank was done cycling.) lawnmower blenny, a fire fish, and a flame angel. All of the fish are still juveniles. It's a fairly heavy bioload I know, but up until this point, we've never ever had any problem with water quality at all. The tank has been amazingly healthy.

I wish I could upload pictures and show you. It's so sad though, I really hope this is a situation we can remedy. I've been quite proud of this setup and have invested alot of time and money into it. I would hate to see everythign die.

Advice would be greatly appreciated.
 
Plenty of time for speculating and finding answers... but first, you should seriously consider a large water change ASAP. I'd also suggest running some carbon.

Have you inspected all your equipment? Is everything runing normally? (just to rule out a mechanical cause)
 
yeah I did a 25% change as soon as I saw something was up. To my knowledge, everything is working fine. Lights, heater, pumps are all functioning fine.

Should I perform another water change?
 
Is this the type of thing that is going to get worse before it gets better? I'm really really worried that some of the coral has died. How will I know if it has actually died as opposed to just looking stressed out?
 
Water change. Water change. Water change.

Think 50% or more. It might be too late but fight it hard.

IMO its very unlikely it was the feeding.
 
Also, look for equipment failures. Broken pumps, broken heaters, whatever. If something has stopped working, assume its the problem until you can prove it otherwise.
 
I agree the above line water changes, largest you can handle, fresh carbon, and do not dose anything, at least until everything is back to normal. Good luck and hang in there.
 
Should I do another 25% change tonight? (I performed the first one at about 12pm today).My gf had checked the water quality before, and had apparently left the ammonia tube sitting for like 10 minutes which is why I thought there was .25 ppm of ammonia. But now that I keep testing it (i've confirmed the results with two different test kits) ammonia, nitrates, and nitrites are all at 0ppm.

Salinity is at .023 right where it should be. The ONLY thing that I can tell that is out of whack is the ph. It's at about 8.0. I cant imagine that would be enough to cause all of this. Aside from that, the water has a white hue to it. I think it probably has more to do with the fact that the corals are all oozing.


Once again, is there any definitive way to know when a coral has died?

What startles me most is how the snails are reacting to the situation. They're in some sort of...suspended animation. Normally, the vast majority of them hide under the sand. They are all out in the open now just sitting there. Some of them turned over looking like they are dead. When I pick them up or turn them around, they move. So obviously they're still alive.

My little starfish is all contorted and shriveled up. The corals are all oozing and shrivled. I've seen corals do this sort of thing before when they become stressed, but never have I seen all of them do it at the same time and never have I seen them do it and not recover after a couple of hours. The frogspawn especially makes me worry.

I've checked, and checked again. All of the equipment seems to be fine.
 
Oh, and also, if there arent any registerable amounts of toxins in the water, will performing water changes still help things? or would it simply add more stress to the inhabitants?
 
Never do more then a 33 % water change. If all was fine then a one time overfeeding wouldnt hurt unless it was a extreme amount.

I would think your tank was on the verge of this and the overfeeding was the trigger point.

Wave maker do nother for water movement and are only for fun and affect.You still need addtional water flow sources on top of this. This could cause more problems then i care to list. Take powerheads off the wave makers and keep with the weekly 25% water changes useing RO or RO/DI source.Stop adding stuff to the water. Monitor water readings and if they drop then adjust water change amount by this.
While your waiting for water quality to improve do a little research. Here are a few sites that can help,GL..

http://saltaquarium.about.com/od/startinganaquarium/tp/topmistakes.htm

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2007/1/aafeature/view

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/water4maruse.htm

http://www.asira.org/caresheets
 
How did she feed them? Did she dip her hand or fingers in the water to dunk the food under the surface? I was just curious if she may have had perfume/hand lotion, etc on her hands that affected the water.
 
I had a similar situation like that in my reef. I lost all my corals and fish basicly over night. All my water parameters were perfect. I did exactly what you did, lots of water changes and still was losing stuff. After everything had died I went to my LFS and they said it might be a short in a pump/heater. They were right, I borrowed a voltmeter from a friend and there was a 4.6 voltage going threw my tank. Might be the same thing, I feel your pain.

I now have grounded tank.
 
Any older Rio/Taam pumps in the tank? Have you checked the heater really well (cracked, etc)? What kind of food did she feed? If she dumped in a whole can of flake, it could cause the problems listed IMO.

Dennis
 
So I should do away with the wave maker?

It's been almost 12 hours since I found out that something was wrong. I've seen nothing thus far to give me any hope that things are getting better.

All of the zooanthids are tightly packed away, the clove polyps are shriveled and look like hell, the anemone is shriveled, his mouth is gaping open...but still apparently clinging on to life (he moves his body on occasion etc.) All of the frogspawns look like they may be dead already (not sure though.) The snails are still suffering from what looks like some sort of paralysis. I havent even seen the star polyps since all of this. The ricordia are slightly shriveled, but look to be the lease affected by all of this. The starfish still looks dead (although it's still alive apparently.)

I've checked, and checked, and checked. The equipment is all in good working condition. Water quality still looks for the most part perfect except for the ph which again is at 8.0.

The fish are swimming around as though nothing ever happened. Should I feed them?? This is so frustrating/sickening. I cant even bear to look at the tank now.

Nevermind the fact that I love all the animals in there, but I've easily got over $1000 invested in everything.

It's sad to say, but I cant imagine getting back into the hobby if things are indeed as bad as I think they may be.

Once again, how will I know if the coral have actually died? Also, what should I do in the case that they have?

Any and all advice would be greatly appreciated.
 
as for the blending, no, I dont think so. I've accounted for almost everything. The only thing I know for a fact has died is the fire shrimp. The fire goby is still missing, but once again, thats pretty normal.

However, if the fire goby did die, and is sitting in there, could that be the cause of all of this? The main thing that is throwing me off though is the fact that water parameters seem to be fine...

I've been checking ammonia every 20-30 minutes or so expecting it to go up if things have died. It hasnt gone up.

Also, if the source of the problem was in fact some sort of electrical short, is there any reason that it would affect the corals/inverts but not the fish??

Last thing, why is the water still cloudy? Despite changing the filter cartridge, adding carbon, and adding "clarity" (the chemical that is supposed to make your water clearer by bonding to particulates in the water) the water remains cloudy... Would it have anything to do with the ooze coming out of the corals?
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11932838#post11932838 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by gman0526
Why not? Nothing wrong with taht as long as the basic chem parameters are matched to the tank's.

If your tank is in great shape from readings to no algea to not overstocking or over feeding and proper flow with nothing wrong basicly. Then theres no need for anything that high anyway.

Changing more then 33% to solve an out of control problem may only increase this problem.Removing mature water base and benifictial bacteria will cause your system to work harder to replace adding unwanted stress.
Then if your water source is the problem then it will never help and only increase again.
Like with any problem theres no one way to fix it. Water changes will help but wont solve.Increasing amount changed will only make worse . FIx the main problem and all other things will fall in palce.
 
SYS7EMATIC....
Sorry to hear your problems. Try adding a polyfilter as well as the carbon. Polyfilters have done wonders for me in the past. Give Kevin or Tasha a call over at Down Under Saltwater in Garner at (919) 662-8820 to see if they can help. They have always had great advice and info for me. Hope all becomes well.

Jim
 
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