Iron - Dosing

rich19020

New member
So here are my stats. 72 gallon bow front, 15 gallon refugium, around 25 gallon sump. I have a ReefOctopus 2000 extreme internal.

I have three SPS corals which 2 are bleaching out. So I started to search the forums for what people are dosing for in the tank. I have always done the basics; cal, mag and alk. Then I read that Randy doses Iron. So I tested my iron and it was zero. I dosed for iron yesterday and then tested again today. The reading today was also zero.

Here is my question is the protein skimmer removing all my trace elements? I do water changes every two weeks, I'm going to change to weekly. Is it really possible to deplete iron that quick?

By the way I dosed iron yesterday and my pavona sps started to have some green spots back on it. I'm figuring that this is from the iron dose yesterday.
 
What type of iron did you dose?

Iron generally should be undetectable with most kits, even when dosing, since they cannot read anywhere close to natural levels for the ocean.

I dose iron to spur macroalgae. I'm not sure it is otherwise useful, but it is easy enough to try and see what happens. I'm not convinced it impacts specific SPS colors.

I'd recommend the Fergon DIY:

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1807946
 
That was Red Sea Reef Colors Iron and Trace Elements?

That contains a lot of stuff, so if you see a result (good or bad), it might be due to any of the various ingredients (Iron, Manganese, Chromium, Copper, Nickel, Aluminium, Zinc, and Cobalt). :)
 
It was Red Sea Reef Colors Iron and Trace Elements.

If I test daily and keep getting zero would you keep dosing this stuff? I'm just happy to see that after 1 day of dosing I'm getting some of the green color back to 1 of my spa corals.
 
Randy, are you saying that the results from the test are most likely inaccurate? If so how do you determine how much to dose?
 
I'm saying that the amount of iron added to a reef tank need not be anywhere near enough to detect with a kit. Typical ocean surface concentrations are on the order of 0.000006 ppm. Even if you dose 10,000 times the natural level, you still won't be detectable with most kits, including yours.

So don't dose iron up to a measured value. :)
 
I don;'t think iron is ever worth measuring in a marine environment because it never needs to be high enough to detect. :)

I discuss iron dosing here:

First Iron Article: Macroalgae and Dosing Recommendations
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/aug2002/chem.htm

Second Iron Article: Iron: A Look at Organisms Other than Macroalgae
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/oct2002/chem.htm

from the first one:

Iron in Reef Tanks: How Much and What Form?
Deciding how much iron to add is fairly easy because, in my experience, it doesn't seem to matter too much. Presumably, once you add enough to eliminate iron as a limiting nutrient, extra iron does not apparently cause harm (at least that I've detected in my tanks or heard of from others). I selected a dose of about 0.1 to 0.3 mL of a solution containing 5 g of iron (as 25 g of ferrous sulfate heptahydrate) in 250 mL of water containing 50.7 g of sodium citrate dihydrate. This liquid is dosed 2-3 times per week to my system with a total water volume of about 250 gallons. This iron(II) citrate has turned brown and cloudy since I first made up the bottle years ago, suggesting that it is oxidizing to iron(III) and some is precipitating from solution, but I still use it. Over the past 4 years, I've dosed nearly all of the 5 grams of actual iron to my tank.

Now that may sound like a huge amount, and it is. It's enough to bring 800 million gallons of completely depleted seawater up to the 0.000006 ppm level that I mentioned earlier for natural sea surface water. Still, I've not noticed any problem, do not know the steady state concentration, do not know how high of a solution concentration is actually optimal for my tank, do not know how much is biologically available by the mechanisms mentioned below, do not know how fast it is removed by skimming and other mechanisms, and do not know what would happen if I cut it back by a factor of 1,000.

All that I know is that microalgae has never been a problem since starting the iron, and I've not noticed anything negative that I could attribute to the iron (nor have I heard of any from others doing similar dosing). Still, I don't keep all organisms available to the hobby, and if you do seem to get a negative reaction from something, I'd advise backing off on the dose or stopping completely.

Since many hobbyists do not have access to the chemicals required to make iron(II) citrate, I'd advise buying a commercial iron supplement. There are a number available that seem appropriate and are not very expensive. Some commercial supplements combine manganese with iron (such as Kent's product), presumably because the scientific literature has demonstrated that phytoplankton also scavenge manganese from the water column. I've not experimented with manganese, but it is probably fine to use if you cannot find a pure iron supplement.

I'd also advise using only iron supplements that have the iron chelated to an organic molecule. The iron sold for freshwater applications is sometimes not chelated because free iron is more soluble in the lower pH of freshwater tanks. I'd avoid those products for marine applications. It will likely still work (as many of the studies in the scientific literature use free iron in seawater), but probably not as well because it may precipitate before it has fully fortified the system with iron.

In many cases of iron intended for the marine hobby, the product may not tell you what the iron is chelated with, in order to protect proprietary formulations. I don't actually know if it matters too much. Very strong chelation by certain molecules will actually inhibit bioavailability by not permitting release of the iron without completely taking apart the chelating molecule, but I expect that manufacturers have avoided those molecules. EDTA and citrate, and some others, actually degrade photochemically, releasing small amounts of free iron continually. It is believed to be the free iron that is actually taken up by many organisms, and likely iron(II), though some organisms may be able to convert iron(III) to iron(II) before uptake (the detailed absorption mechanisms are generally not known). There is a more detailed discussion of this degradation and uptake in "Captive Seawater Fishes" by Stephen Spotte (1992).

So good luck with iron dosing, and happy reefing!
 
How about Iron and GFO, Randy? I've been dosing iron into my refugium for the macroalgae, and I'm wondering if I am just chasing my tail because I read that GFO extracts iron?
 
GFO doesn't extract iron that I know of, except in that it may bind some organic matter and some iron may be bound to organic matter (the effect would be even worse with GAC and skimming).

I expect GFO adds a little bit of soluble iron, but whether it is enough to not need to dose iron for things like macroalgae, I do not know. :)
 
From seawater, I expect that some iron bound to organics will be exported both by skimming and GAC, but if anything, that makes dosing more needed, not less. But growing photosynthetic organsims will also take up iron. :)
 
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