Large Reef Tanks: going acrylic or glass ??

[Roberto1977]

I've seen many magnificent reef tanks in the "Large Reef Tanks" forum. Most of them are unvelievable... Right now we have an architect designing our new house, and I'll have a 800 + gallons tank. What's best for a tank this size? Acrylic, or Glass? Why you decided going for one or the other? Right now my tank is a tiny 50 g. acrylic. If you have additional suggestions, I'll really appreciate them... Thanks all for your info and help...

Roberto

 

[Lightsluvr]

Both?

Both?

Hi Roberto -

You will receive many opinions, I am certain.

Acrylic is popular because it weighs less than glass. However, as you probably know, acrylic will scratch easily.

Many large tanks are made with starphire (starfire) glass, because it is so clear.

I have a "hybrid" tank, with starphire front and sides, acrylic back and eurobracing, and a PVC bottom.

There are so many choices.

LL

 

[Roberto1977]

Thanks Lightsluvr, never tought about an "hybrid" tank. My main concern with acrylic are the scratches that with time can appear (a grain of sand in the magnets while cleaning is the most typical) Starphyre glass seems to be a nice option because of clarity, at least for the front glass.

Roberto

 

[wmilas]

Its simple. You'll hear 1001 opinions. It breaks down to:

Acrylic scratches easily
Acrylic is clearer than starphire (refraction angle closer to saltwater)
Acrylic is more durable. Glass seams WILL give way. Might be 1 year or 100 years.
Acrylic takes more maintenance.
Acrylic cannot be built on site without special ventilation for really large tanks. Glass can be done on site with less equipment.
Glass, once scratched, is a royal PITA to fix. If its on the inside the tank needs to be drained. If its on the outside, think multiple hours for one small scratch. Acrylic scratches can be fixed in minutes both inside and outside while tank is full.

Basicly, Acrylic is the way to go if you are worried about long term durability. The tank maintenance on acrylic is a large issue however. If you want to be able to use a razor scraper then acrylic is not for you.

In large tank (when I say large, i'm talking 1000 gallons +) settings where its impractical to drain the tank when a seam starts to let go its hard to come up with arguments not to use acrylic.

For tanks in the 250 range its six of one half dozen of another. The tank can easily be torn down if the seam lets go, and the maintenance issue may call for a glass tank.

One thing to be said about acrylic though is the clarity. Before you pick one or the other (for a smaller tank, for a l;arge tank I don't see that there is a choice) do yourself a favor and look at a starphire tank next to an acrylic. You may still pick the starphire because of maintenance... but man, the clarity is night and day.

 

[serpentman]

I love the clarity and structural durability of acrylic. However, the ease of maintenance of glass is what sold me.

Although glass seams can and will fail, I have seen several acrylic tanks pop over time as well. Therefore, either way you go, make sure you purchase from a quality manufacturer that has a proven track record and offers a decent warranty.

Like wmilas mentioned, everyone will have an opinion so it ultimately comes down to your personal preferences and maintenance habits.

 

[Lightsluvr]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15287302#post15287302 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by wmilas
Its simple. You'll hear 1001 opinions. It breaks down to:

Acrylic scratches easily
Acrylic is clearer than starphire (refraction angle closer to saltwater)
Acrylic is more durable. Glass seams WILL give way. Might be 1 year or 100 years.
Acrylic takes more maintenance.
Acrylic cannot be built on site without special ventilation for really large tanks. Glass can be done on site with less equipment.
Glass, once scratched, is a royal PITA to fix. If its on the inside the tank needs to be drained. If its on the outside, think multiple hours for one small scratch. Acrylic scratches can be fixed in minutes both inside and outside while tank is full.

Basicly, Acrylic is the way to go if you are worried about long term durability. The tank maintenance on acrylic is a large issue however. If you want to be able to use a razor scraper then acrylic is not for you.

In large tank (when I say large, i'm talking 1000 gallons +) settings where its impractical to drain the tank when a seam starts to let go its hard to come up with arguments not to use acrylic.

For tanks in the 250 range its six of one half dozen of another. The tank can easily be torn down if the seam lets go, and the maintenance issue may call for a glass tank.

One thing to be said about acrylic though is the clarity. Before you pick one or the other (for a smaller tank, for a l;arge tank I don't see that there is a choice) do yourself a favor and look at a starphire tank next to an acrylic. You may still pick the starphire because of maintenance... but man, the clarity is night and day.

Very good analysis - I agree almost completely. However, as Serpentman said, large acrylic tanks do split at the seams... been there, seen that.

And while acrylic may outshine the starphire's clarity when the tank is new...it pales after a few hundred micro-scratches appear on the acrylic surface. And yes, acrylic can be polished, but it's not quite as easy as "just minutes"...unless acrylic users I know don't know the secret...

LL

 

[Jar*Head]

IMO, Acrylic isn't too bad. I just finish setting up my 480g 96x48x24 with 1" acrylic all around. I was nervous when i clean the tank but after 2 months i kind of get used to it. My Crosshatch pair put approx 10 scratches on the panels but i was removed very easily...

 

[sunsetSPS]

Steve: What method you used to remove scratches on your tank?

 

[porthios]

when melev see's this thread he'll post a good list of the pros/cons for each. the list really ought to be a sticky as this comes up all the time. as does the 'how do i remove scratches from acrylic?' follow up.

fwiw, i'm very happy with my acrylic tank.

 

[Jar*Head]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15288802#post15288802 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by sunsetSPS
Steve: What method you used to remove scratches on your tank?

I am using Mighty Magnet scratch removing kit... Work great for me so far....

 

[robexcoral]

ill go glass im havein problems with stress cracks

 

[jmaccvols]

http://www.mrclean.com/en_US/magic-eraser.do

I have used credit cards, plastic scrapers and magnets, but none clean my acrylic tank better than Mr Clean's magic erasers. Leaves my tank looking like when it was new. I take one pad, stand it on edge then take a knife and cut it into three thinner pads. Put one under the magnet and it cleans the tank beautifully. I take another thin piece, wrap it over the end of the long scraper and tie it off with a rubber band to firmly hold it in place to get to those hard to reach spots.

Once I had green algae growing down low where I could not reach it, my arms are to short to reach the bottom of my 36" deep tank. The algae was stuck to the side like glue and the scraper and magnet did not remove it very well. Yet when I found out about the magic erasers, I put one under the magnet and it removed the algae very easily, does not leave any scratches at all. Just make sure you do not get any sand particles between the pad and acrylic.

I have a few light scratches that are virtually invisible. I really believe if I had known about the magic erasers back when I first got my tank, I would have no scratches at all. I cannot attest to how well it removes coralline for I go over my tank regularly never giving the coralline a chance to grow on the panels. I think it would remove coralline, just make sure to keep the coralline cleaned out from between the pad and acrylic panel so the dislodged coralline will not have a chance to scratch the acrylic.

At work, I have a glass tank that has scratches with green algae growing in the scratches. The magnet I use on that tank would not get the green algae out of the scratches, but the magic erasers removes it easily.

I have had my 450 acrylic (Envision) tank for about two years, it is my first acrylic tank, and as far as things are going now, I would not go back to glass. The magic erasers have made it soooooo much easier to keep clean.

 

[Untamed12]

My 400 gallon is Envision built from 1" think acrylic. My tank is heavily scratched on the inside, but inside scratches are not really noticeable. Any particularly bad ones have been easily polished out. I've never scratched the outside.

The point I would like to emphasize is that all of my scratches have been made by the fish and urchins...not by cleaning with magnets. (I use the Great White Magnets)

So...it isn't just a matter of being careful. If you go acrylic you have to accept that the critters inside will cause a lot of damage on their own.

I chose acrylic for the clarity. Above a certain size, you end up with pretty thick or laminated glass which I didn't prefer.

 

[skanderson]

i have a 300 gal starphire cube. i was big on the glass because of the scratching issue. in less then 2 months i put 2 noticable scratches in the starphire due to getting a grain of sand inside the cleaner pad. not sure what i would do with a 800, but i wouldnt trust a silicone bond at that size.

 

[jmaccvols]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15288376#post15288376 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Lightsluvr
Very good analysis - I agree almost completely. However, as Serpentman said, large acrylic tanks do split at the seams... been there, seen that.

And while acrylic may outshine the starphire's clarity when the tank is new...it pales after a few hundred micro-scratches appear on the acrylic surface. And yes, acrylic can be polished, but it's not quite as easy as "just minutes"...unless acrylic users I know don't know the secret...

LL

I maybe wrong, but it was always my understanding that acrylic tanks are seamless. They are welded together all the way down at the molecular level, so an acrylic tank is virtually just one piece of acrylic and the area where the acrylic panels were bonded together are actually the strongest areas of the tank. If one "split at the seams" I would hazard the guess that it was not properly bonded together correctly by the manufacturer.

 

[Shane Hoffman]

Jmac,


You use magic erasers I see....it appears from your post you use them on the inside. I know they have chemicals in them. Have you ever had any issues. They look and feel dry but when water hits them I would guess the chemical could seep out. I have seen warnings on the box that say keep out of reach of children.....

Have you ever had any issues...I assume not since you continue to use it. I would just be leary of this on a small tank with low total system volume...

 

[jmaccvols]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15312556#post15312556 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Shane Hoffman
Jmac,


You use magic erasers I see....it appears from your post you use them on the inside. I know they have chemicals in them. Have you ever had any issues. They look and feel dry but when water hits them I would guess the chemical could seep out. I have seen warnings on the box that say keep out of reach of children.....

Have you ever had any issues...I assume not since you continue to use it. I would just be leary of this on a small tank with low total system volume...

http://www.snopes.com/medical/toxins/eraser.asp


From the above link, there were rumors the pads contained toxins, but as far as I know it just contains tiny fibers. I have had no ill effects from its use.

On the box it says "CAUTION: keep out of reach of children and pets to avoid accidental ingestion. If they contained any type of toxins/chemicals they would be required by law possibly listed on the box.


EDIT:
From P&G website:

http://www.pg.com/content/pdf/01_ab.../hard_surface_cleaners/Mr_Clean_Magic_Eraser_(_Original,_Duo,_Extra,_Auto).pdf

 

[GoToSleep]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15312522#post15312522 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jmaccvols
I maybe wrong, but it was always my understanding that acrylic tanks are seamless. They are welded together all the way down at the molecular level, so an acrylic tank is virtually just one piece of acrylic and the area where the acrylic panels were bonded together are actually the strongest areas of the tank. If one "split at the seams" I would hazard the guess that it was not properly bonded together correctly by the manufacturer.

This may be true but I have seen a 600g acrylic tank that split out a whole seam. Very sad indeed, the tank belongs to a reef central and Richmond Reef Club member-- Vince. The theoretical advantages of welded acrylic 'seams' are small consolation if you wind up with a bad tank.

I chose glass for my 550g because I didn't want to deal with the inevitabel scratches inside the tank. It's worth noting that Starphire glass is softer than regular glass and Starphire will scratch if you get a grit of sand between the magnet and the glass. I checked out regular tanks side-by-side with Starphire and decided to go the durable route with regular glass.

 

[LauraCline]

I prefer glass over acrylic because I've never seen an acrylic tank without scratches and eventually they all seem to end up looking milky/crazed.

 

[screenguy]

Starphire is the way IMO .