Need advice on a solid, energy efficient return pump for our little build..

[bvysochin]

Hi. Just thought I'd make a new thread for ease. The plan is to pick up our new tanks tomorrow for our build (http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2557611). I need to start ordering plumbing supplies and return pumps.

What's a good solid, energy efficient, external pump? I'd like something that's readily available on the shelf at marinedepot or bulkreef, or somewhere else.. Something that I don't have to special order parts from Europe. I'll need 4 of them, and an extra, to have on-hand.

Pump 1 will run 3x 90 gallon tanks, 9' head, 6' head, 3' head
Pump 2 will run 3x 110 gallon tanks, 9' head, 6' head, 3' head
Pump 3 will run 3x 125 gallon tanks, 9' head, 6' head, 3' head
Pump 4 will run 3x 205 gallon tanks, 9' head, 6' head, 3' head

The tanks are all right above each other, so not 100% sure how to calculate head psi on that.

Don't care about noise too much. Need good reliability, availability of parts, and power consumption. Would like to use the same model pump for all systems.

I'm leaning towards Reeflo but don't have much experience with the different models. Pool pump? Help?

Here's what the stands currently look like..

 

[laverda]

I had a 3000 GPH 1/3 Hp spa pump the MD used to sell for 15 years. It was used when I got it and very reliable and only used 138 watts. It never gave me any problems and I sold it with the tank. I donot see it listed on mD any longer but they carried them for a long time. The manufacturers name was an Asian persons name from what I remember. (LM something) I was surprised to find out it was made in the LA area, as I went there to get a seal set when I rebuilt it years ago. I will probably remember the name as soon as I post this.

I would just figure head height for the upper tank. Feed it directly then feed the lower tanks via the over flow. If you use a full syphon you will not get bubbles and create flow in the lower tanks with only one smaller pump. I had 3 60 gallon tanks set up this way and it worked well. Of course I had other flow in the tanks as well. It is much more efficient to use flow pumps then to pump from the sump to each tank.

I have a New in the box ReeFlo Manta Ray 1HP external aquarium, pool, spa & pond pump with pre-filter & 1 1/2" inlet and output unions. 5000GPH 55' max head. I would take $250 for it.

 

[bvysochin]

Thanks for the reply. Interesting idea with the overflow feed. Considered it doing this way but wanted the ability to shut off certain tanks at certain times. I plan to have at least 4x mp40's in each tank for flow anyways, so I'm not too concerned about turn over rate. I'm happy with 1x or 2x / hour. I think at this point, I'd love to get a decent pump that would run at 150 watts or so. If you remember the name, let me know. At this point I'm strongly considering the dart/snapper models. With a pump that uses 150 watts vs 250 watts x 4 pumps running 24/7, I'd save roughly 288 kwh per month, which at $.30/kw (can't remember what the going rate is nowdays) comes out to roughly $87/month.. big diff.

That manta ray looks like a serious pump. Wonder what the watt usage is like when it's turned way down. Maybe i can use that pump for the largest system. Let me call Reeflo on monday and ask and I'll get back to you.

 

[Mr. Brooks]

I'm not a fan of reeflo. The problem with them is their seals. I had a seal go bad on a Dart without noticing it. It leached rust into my saltwater mixing tank for over a year. I couldn't keep coral alive for the life of me. It took me forever to find the culprit. After much expense and exasperation, it was a triton test that finally pointed me in the right direction. Off the charts iron. I could've repaired the pump and sold it but I decided to throw it in the trash instead. I didn't want someone else to go through the same nightmare.

If you go with reeflo, just know that you can't get away with not replacing the seals at least once a year. If you don't, they will fail without question.

My story isn't even all that bad. There was a guy in Santa Monica who drywalled a stand around two reeflo closed loop pumps with crawl space access from his garage. The seal on one of the pumps failed catastrophically and drained most of his tank.

If you're ok with changing seals once a year at a minimum, then go for it.

Personally, I swore off any and all external pumps that utilize shaft seals forever.

I use a vectra L1 now and couldn't be happier.

 

[Mr. Brooks]

Btw, I have a bunch of leftover unused plumbing fittings and high quality valves from my builds. Let me know if you'd like to take a look. I'm happy to trade for coral =)

 

[Mr. Brooks]

One more thing on reeflo pumps, the threads are notoriously difficult to seal. The only thing I found that sealed them up for good was silicone.

 

[pciscott]

I like to have a sealed pump for the same reason, a leak in a closed loop can be catastrophic. I like the Red Dragon 230, but they are expensive. My second choice would be Vectra. Both of these pumps are sealed and easy to change in comparison to a reeflo. Silicone is the only way to keep a Reeflo from leaking and they always look dirty, rusty, and not a clean look for your beautiful build. Both the pumps I mention above have O ring unions and one spare on the shelf would be easy to swap if you do have problem.

 

[Mr. Brooks]

i like to have a sealed pump for the same reason, a leak in a closed loop can be catastrophic. I like the red dragon 230, but they are expensive. My second choice would be vectra. Both of these pumps are sealed and easy to change in comparison to a reeflo. Silicone is the only way to keep a reeflo from leaking and they always look dirty, rusty, and not a clean look for your beautiful build. Both the pumps i mention above have o ring unions and one spare on the shelf would be easy to swap if you do have problem.

+1

 

[loc01]

Check out the Laguna pump Max flow it's around 80watts, powerful and quiet too. I believe it's the same body block as the red dragon pump.

Loc

 

[Mr. Brooks]

Check out the Laguna pump Max flow it's around 80watts, powerful and quiet too. I believe it's the same body block as the red dragon pump.

Loc

This pump isn't external.

 

[bvysochin]

Guys, thanks for all the replies. Great info.

Chad, I wasn't even aware of the inherent leaks with the reeflo pumps--shows you how much research I did on them. I did google for hours and see exactly what you were talking about. I guess it wouldnt be the end of the world to have to change seals, but i dont know if i want to add pump maintenance to our routine.. that sucks. I'll shoot you a text about the fittings, I'm definitely interested. As soon as I can decide on pumps and sumps, itll be plumbing time.

Scott, thanks for the recommendations. I think the red dragons are a bit out of budget for this particular build. Maybe the DT, but not the rest of the tanks. I hadn't considered ecotech's pump but maybe I should.

Which brings me to the next thought... I guess we don't HAVE to go with an external pump. Currently, in one of our systems, we have a shared sump with multiple drop in pumps, one per tank. Every thing has been good and reliable. From the few reviews I read about the vectra, the flow charts are considerably overstated. Which is fine, but I'm guessing, realistically I would need more than one per rack of tanks.. I suppose I could run them either internally or externally. Our only experience so far with DC pumps has been the jebao dc12000, which has been utter crap. I believe 4/5 didn't make it to the one year mark. Are the ecotech pumps reliable so far?

Loc, thanks for the recommendations about the Laguna. Ive heard great things about them and considered them briefly. Maybe if we go with a drop in pump, I should give then more consideration.

More and more I think about it, I think were at the point where we need to decide on a sump design and layout. Picked up the tanks yesterday and got a few set in place.

Thanks for all the replies guys, keep them coming. They are extremely helpful.

 

[Breadman03]

The only negative that I've heard about the Vectra pumps is when they are run external and near max output, they report an overheating condition.

 

[enjetek]

I have been looking this week, and doing research the past couple weeks, and decided to give the new eflux pump a try. I love my old bubble blaster 10000 since it did like 2100 gph at 125 watts. The eflux 6011 does 3100 gph at 80 watts and is controllable. They are newerish on the market but current USA has been around a while so hopefully the pump is good. If you find pics online the blue controller is actually a black metal box that has a blue silicone skin cover that is used to close off all the ports (USB, power, data). Hopefully it doesn't run hot which it most likely won't being a newer DC type pump. The price was great too when looking at cost versus what it could produce.


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[bvysochin]

Thanks for the feedback guys. Still weighing out the options. I can pretty much say for certain that I'm no longer interested in the Reeflo pumps due to the seal issues.

Any one use Dolphin pumps?

http://www.dolphinpumps.com/pumps-and-seals-caeb

Their Amp master type-4 pump is advertised as "A non-fail, lifetime seal." 2400 gpm @ 9' head psi @ 143 watts.

Also considering Laguna max-flo, and Fluval SP pumps..

 

[acesq]

The laguna max flo pond pumps are fairly efficient, quiet and bulletproof when used submerged. They are flow pumps and not pressure rated so the MaxFlo 2900 is 130 watts and gives you around 1900 gph at 9' of head.

I have a spare Maxflo 2900 if you want to borrow it to see how it works for you. I also have a spare Vectra L1 you're welcome to try. I've had them both hooked up to my system and even though the Vectra is higher wattage and higher flow and no head, the Laguna handles pressure a bit better.

 

[bobafet1]

are you trying to be a wholesaler now? LOL ....crazy build! You want to sell that smaller bobcat? S70?? I'm looking for one.