New to This All!! Advice is much appreciated!

[mfink08]

Alright..well like the title says I'm new to the hobby, as well as the forum.

I'm going to be honest, when i was first told that we were going to be given our friend's brand new tank and all the "fixings" to go in it (including the fish). I was not very excited about it! But the tank was set up and in went the fish and they started to grow on me. Here's a list of what was given to us:
1. 75 gal tank (new, never been used)
2. live sand (unopened, new bag)
3. live rock (was used in different tank)
4. Fluval FX6 filter (used in different tank)
5. Other random misc. equipment such as a protein skimmer (no sump so this has yet to be set up), some supplements and etc.
Fish:
1. 2 clown fish (paired)
2. 1 yellow tang
3. 1 lawnmower blenny
4. 1 chocolate chip starfish (was on his way out before we got him)

I'll make this as short as possible! So with not many other options, we set up the new tank and mixed the water/salt, put the sand/rock in and in went the fish! As time went on I started to totally fall in love with the fish. The tang was my favorite due to his silly behavior and restless swimming habits! My daughter loved it too, so we got her a fish. A vlamingi tang. Her and the Y.T had some issues at first, but they seemed to grow fond of eachother after a few days. (They had a love/hate relationship).

So we've had the fish in the tank for a few months now and everything seemed to be okay. We got some snails and crabs for clean up. Noticed the pods and thought something was TERRIBLY wrong! Quickly learned they are beneficial and watched the population grow. (Still could do without them though). Still have no sump set up so we're doing weekly water changed and siphoning the sand out to help with clean up. 2 weeks ago I noticed a long brown worm against the glass a few layers down in the sand. Then 2 days ago saw my first bristle worm in the tank. I've tried to get on some type of feeding schedule, but wasn't able to get it down. (Advice on that would be helpful.)

Anyways, this weekend we went to the fish store to look for sand, and an RO/DI filter, etc. And for some reason came home w a spotted manderin goby. (I know, probably shouldnt have done that). We are in the process of setting up our sump/skimmer. The gobys been in there since Sunday and seemed fine. Last night though, i noticed the tangs were breathing harder/more rapidly than normal, but figured they were having one of their "bad days" where they swim around bumping into eachother. Fed them (everyone ate fine) and went to sleep. Well we woke up this A.M to the Vlamingi Tang dead and the Yellow Tang laying in the sand next to her barely breathing. He darted to the top corner of tank when we went in w the net to get the V.T out. but then was back in the sand on his side. so we took him out too since he seemed to be suffering. : ( The clownfish and blenny are breathing rapidly and all are pretty faded in color.

We set up a small tank w new water and put the goby in it...but what do we do now???

Help please!! Suggestions, advice, any help at all would be great! So I get all new sand and rock and start over? But what do i do with the fish (if they make it) during the cycling process??

Sorry for being so long here...Just trying to explain as much as possible so maybe i could get some good advice. I asked my boyfriend to test the water so we could see if the loss was caused by a spike in PH or amonia which i wouldn't be surprised if it was the cause. So i dont have numbers for you guys...sorry. It'd be nice to know the cause to learn from it and not make the same mistake, but i guess im more or less looking for advice on what to do next.... : (

 

[Clowny88]

Check ammonia numbers and report back. It doesn't sound like you started off properly cycling your tank. But no, you shouldn't have to start with new rock/sand.

 

[mfink08]

Alright. I'm at work so I cant check anything until later. But I do agree that the tank did not under go the right cycling process. We didnt really see another option at the time since we already had the fish too! And thought maybe since the rock and fish were already in a tank it would be as necessary... : (

 

[MondoBongo]

it's not a goby, it's a dragonet.

please take it back. it will die in a bare tank. they feed almost exclusively on small zooplankton and are constant grazers.

the vlamingi tang was not even close to being an appropriate stocking choice. they get very large, and even the yellow tang in a 75 gallon really is far from ideal. sorry for your losses with them, but they were not good stock options.

you need a quarantine system to house new additions, and you also need to look in to the nitrogen cycle. obviously too late now, but you can't set up a tank in a day and just dump fish in. live rock or not.

determining any cause would be pure speculation. you will need to post at the very least a basic set of tank parameters.

salinity, temperature, ammonia, nitrite, nitrate. that's the bare minimum.

other than the heavy breathing, are you noticing any other external signs on the fish? anything that looks like it may by ich, or other signs of disease or parasites?

 

[ColinAbi]

it's not a goby, it's a dragonet.

please take it back. it will die in a bare tank. they feed almost exclusively on small zooplankton and are constant grazers.

the vlamingi tang was not even close to being an appropriate stocking choice. they get very large, and even the yellow tang in a 75 gallon really is far from ideal. sorry for your losses with them, but they were not good stock options.

you need a quarantine system to house new additions, and you also need to look in to the nitrogen cycle. obviously too late now, but you can't set up a tank in a day and just dump fish in. live rock or not.

determining any cause would be pure speculation. you will need to post at the very least a basic set of tank parameters.

salinity, temperature, ammonia, nitrite, nitrate. that's the bare minimum.

other than the heavy breathing, are you noticing any other external signs on the fish? anything that looks like it may by ich, or other signs of disease or parasites?

+1
Please read this http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2495138

 

[mfink08]

Thank you for the clarification Mondo. You might want to write google as well and correct them too! : )

I am aware that they need to have a constant, large food source. There's not much I can do until after work as far as returning the fish, do you think it will be okay until then? Is there anything i can run n get at Petco or anywhere else local to feed it until then?

Before we bought the Vlamingi, we told the fish store owner our tank size and he sold us the fish anyways. We were told of its growth patterns and planned on "growing with it" i guess. : (

I wasnt planning on simply setting up a new tank and "dumping" the fish in. I would like to do it the correct way and not run into this problem again, hence the thread asking for some advice. I'd like to figure out a suitable option for housing the fish i have now during the cycling process.

No other symptoms other than the breathing and the faint coloring as of 8am this morning! No spots/cysts, no stringy poops, no scale issues...nothing external that i could see.

 

[mfink08]

Colin, i actually did read that thread a few weeks ago when i saw a picture of a manderin and wanted one.

Our DRAGONET eats brine shrimp as well, FYI.

 

[MondoBongo]

Thank you for the clarification Mondo. You might want to write google as well and correct them too! : )

I am aware that they need to have a constant, large food source. There's not much I can do until after work as far as returning the fish, do you think it will be okay until then? Is there anything i can run n get at Petco or anywhere else local to feed it until then?

Before we bought the Vlamingi, we told the fish store owner our tank size and he sold us the fish anyways. We were told of its growth patterns and planned on "growing with it" i guess. : (

I wasnt planning on simply setting up a new tank and "dumping" the fish in. I would like to do it the correct way and not run into this problem again, hence the thread asking for some advice. I'd like to figure out a suitable option for housing the fish i have now during the cycling process.

No other symptoms other than the breathing and the faint coloring as of 8am this morning! No spots/cysts, no stringy poops, no scale issues...nothing external that i could see.

google has it right, i would suggest in the future possibly checking with google first.

Colin, i actually did read that thread a few weeks ago when i saw a picture of a manderin and wanted one.

Our DRAGONET eats brine shrimp as well, FYI.

you can get sarcastic/irreverent as much as you want, but you're essentially watching your tank implode, so you may want to watch that chip on your shoulder, it's not going to be helpful.

which brings me back to your water parameters. a crucial piece of the puzzle. what are they?

 

[ColinAbi]

Colin, i actually did read that thread a few weeks ago when i saw a picture of a manderin and wanted one.

Our DRAGONET eats brine shrimp as well, FYI.

Ok, I just wanted you to see the sticky

 

[mfink08]

Mondo, you got me worried bout the dragonet being in a bare tank for a day! But as I was thinking about taking her back i remembered that she was in a bare tank when i bought her...

 

[MondoBongo]

Mondo, you got me worried bout the dragonet being in a bare tank for a day! But as I was thinking about taking her back i remembered that she was in a bare tank when i bought her...

i would highly suggest finding a new fish store.

these people are obviously folks that shouldn't be dealt with.

 

[mfink08]

Sarcasm, yes (in my response to your post). Chip on shoulder, no. Simply looking for some FRIENDLY, helpful advice from a community with more experience than me! So i guess you're "negative" response wasn't was I was hoping for.

Colin, I was not responding to your post with any hint of sarcasm i hope you know! I was simply including a side note about my Manderin eating shrimp.

I've mentioned a few times now that i don't have the water parameters at the moment since I'm at work. I know they are a necessary part of information when posting on here. But i will do my best to post later today.

 

[mfink08]

Well I will not return there then. But that makes taking the fish back a not so good idea as well, right?

If there's a way to keep the fish safe and well fed i would like to look into that option.

 

[tzylak]

Most fish in a LFS reside in a bare tank. Kind of like new cars are out on an open parking lot at the dealership. LFS put sand in the tank to look good, like dealerships put cute flags around their parking lot. Well, the sand is useless to the fish as it has not food in it. The fish will be "fine" for a week or two but the damage is happening.
Whatever I did in my 50g tank and whatever I tried to feed my Mandi did not work. It died within 4 months. I thought I could beat the RC commentaries, I thought I knew better.
Now I see you in a similar predicament. . . .
Good luck.

 

[ericarenee]

Sarcasm, yes (in my response to your post). Chip on shoulder, no. Simply looking for some FRIENDLY, helpful advice from a community with more experience than me! So i guess you're "negative" response wasn't was I was hoping for.

Colin, I was not responding to your post with any hint of sarcasm i hope you know! I was simply including a side note about my Manderin eating shrimp.

I've mentioned a few times now that i don't have the water parameters at the moment since I'm at work. I know they are a necessary part of information when posting on here. But i will do my best to post later today.

I know what is up with my water out of my head even last week and can prob tell you that in the morning my ph will 8,0 not 8.3 but after i dose alk it will be 8.1 to 8.2 and that i know the reason for the swing and working to remedy this... Taking care of the water and the rest is easy...

 

[MondoBongo]

what about water movement? you mentioned that your skimmer isn't set up yet, the only other thing i see on that list is a canister filter.

are you running any power heads or anything else to move water and help aid in oxygenation?

any chance your daughter decided to help feed the fish and dumped a whole can of fish food? sounds silly, but it has happened before, and can cause big problems and an ammonia spike.

first aid in these situations is typically always the same if you don't have readings on your levels, or everything appears normal:

prepare as large a water change as you can, as quickly as you can, and run a large amount of carbon, just in case.

do you burn any candles, incense, done any recent painting, fumigating, harsh cleaners?

have you felt any stray voltage when you've had your hands in the tank?

anything else changes recently aside from the fish addition?

 

[ColinAbi]

Sarcasm, yes (in my response to your post). Chip on shoulder, no. Simply looking for some FRIENDLY, helpful advice from a community with more experience than me! So i guess you're "negative" response wasn't was I was hoping for.

Colin, I was not responding to your post with any hint of sarcasm i hope you know! I was simply including a side note about my Manderin eating shrimp.

I've mentioned a few times now that i don't have the water parameters at the moment since I'm at work. I know they are a necessary part of information when posting on here. But i will do my best to post later today.

Yes I didn't think there was sarcasm

 

[mfink08]

Okay..This is exactly why i was hesitant to post on here in the first place!!

TZYLAK....I understand that the "damage is happening" THATS WHY I WROTE THE POST IN THE FIRST PLACE, TO ASK FOR SOME HELP AND ADVICE! But all i got from your post was that you see me in a similar situation....?

And ERICA...I hope to get to know my tank the way you know yours...but as of right now I DONT! Thats very obvious and I am not trying to pretend that I know otherwise. My whole point of posting on here was to learn from the mistake and not repeat it, continue the hobby with a little more insight and knowledge. But all ive gotten is negativity and unhelpful responses.... : (

 

[heathlindner25]

what about water movement? you mentioned that your skimmer isn't set up yet, the only other thing i see on that list is a canister filter.

are you running any power heads or anything else to move water and help aid in oxygenation?

any chance your daughter decided to help feed the fish and dumped a whole can of fish food? sounds silly, but it has happened before, and can cause big problems and an ammonia spike.

first aid in these situations is typically always the same if you don't have readings on your levels, or everything appears normal:

prepare as large a water change as you can, as quickly as you can, and run a large amount of carbon, just in case.

do you burn any candles, incense, done any recent painting, fumigating, harsh cleaners?

have you felt any stray voltage when you've had your hands in the tank?

anything else changes recently aside from the fish addition?

this is all good information

 

[mmittlesteadt]

Okay..This is exactly why i was hesitant to post on here in the first place!!

TZYLAK....I understand that the "damage is happening" THATS WHY I WROTE THE POST IN THE FIRST PLACE, TO ASK FOR SOME HELP AND ADVICE! But all i got from your post was that you see me in a similar situation....?

And ERICA...I hope to get to know my tank the way you know yours...but as of right now I DONT! Thats very obvious and I am not trying to pretend that I know otherwise. My whole point of posting on here was to learn from the mistake and not repeat it, continue the hobby with a little more insight and knowledge. But all ive gotten is negativity and unhelpful responses.... : (

It's really easy for many experienced posters to find fault with people new to the hobby and respond with some of the negativity you've encountered. Just know that most of that comes from just really not wanting people to jump into the hobby without researching first because we care about the living creatures you want to keep. Experience with the hobby doesn't mean they are also experienced in personal dealings with others.

Just ignore the emotions that may come with some advice and look for that which will help you (even within those emotional posts). It is fairly typical (for those who haven't done their homework before even putting water in their tank and then coming on here and crying "HELP!" to get chastised in some manner.

At least you are trying to rectify the situation. Some people don't even do that and continue to ignore advice. Try not to take any of it personally. Best of luck, welcome to RC and read, read, read before you do anything with your tank. The Advanced Search function will bring you a wealth of posts relevant to any topic you want to learn about.