Newcomer - Question on Ich

[Mare100]

Hi...

I'm hoping someone can give me some advice. My husband and I have a 55 gallon saltwater fish-only tank. Up until last night, we had a clown fish and a moon wrasse in the tank. Last night, we added a scooter blenny and a copper banded butterfly. Yesterday, the butterfly seemed to be acclimating nicely to the tank. Today....I noticed little white spots on her. One on her tail fin and the other on her dorsal fin (at the very tips).

Could this be Ich? How would I know for sure before stressing her out and pulling her out to medicate her? If it is Ich....since she's only been in the tank 1 day......are the other now at risk?

Any help or suggestions would be really appreciated!

Thanks,
Marilee

 

[WinkeyWoneye]

Heya,
I wouldnt get all worried YET. When I first got my yellow tang, a couple days after adding him to the tank I noticed the same thing. Couple spots here and there. Tangs/CBB's are very suseptable(sp?) to ich and other marine disease. If they are stressed it can show up on them very quickly. Some fish, including the CBB, I believe are too fragile for a QT. I have heard more stories of people losing tangs/CBB's to a QT, rather than curing them, some of which are right here on RC. Just keep a very watchful eye on the fish, and try to make sure your water params stay in check to keep the fish comfortable in the tank.
Also feeding frozen foods (mysis are best IMO) soaked in garlic guard or garlic elixir has been known to help fight off ich. Selcon, a liquid vitamin is also good to soak food in. Aggressivly feed the fish in question, when possible target feed them to ensure they are eating the garlic/selcon soaked foods. Just try to keep em as happy as you can and pumped up with garlic and selcon soaked foods. This should help raise the fish's immune system, making it easier for it to fight the ich off on its own. HTH and Good Luck with the fish, keep us posted.

P.S. Also UV sterilizer's are known to help fight off and kill ich. They can be very expensive though and MUST be setup w/ the proper flow and wattage for the size of your tank.

 

[Mare100]

Thanks so much for the quick reply, WW.

For now we will just keep an eye on him/her (?) Right now we are feeding a flaked food special mixture from the aquarium shop we deal with, frozen brine shrimp, and frozen mysis shrimp. I'm a little nervous because I've read that the Copper Banded Butterflies are not easy to keep because they are difficult to feed. So far, she hasn't eaten too much, but I attributed that to her adapting to her new home.

If we do soak the food in the garlic or the Selcon...would that be okay for the other fish in the tank?

Thanks again!

Marilee

 

[WinkeyWoneye]

Yep, soak all your fish foods in selcon AND garlic...its good for all the fish. Garlic is said to have a theraputic (sp?) effect on fish, as it does with humans. Plus it supposedly entices fish to eat. Selcon is a concentrate of essential fatty acids, marine lipids, vit C stablilized, and vit B 12, all of which are important elements in marine fish diets.
I on average soak my food every other night, and feed dry on the off nights... just because I'm lazy. You can soak your foods daily if you like, which you should for now to entice the CBB to eat and help it get rid of the ich. The other fish will love you for it too.

 

[WinkeyWoneye]

If you cant find Selcon locally, its available online. As time is somewhat of the essence for you... if selcon isnt available, look for Kent Marine "Zoecon". It is a very similiar product, but I've heard the selcon contains more essential vitamins than the Kent version.

 

[Mare100]

Great!

Thanks again for the info! I just found both the Selcon and Garlic at Drs. Foster & Smith. We needed to order some other stuff from them anyway, so I think we're going to just order it and see if we can get an express shipment on it.

I'll keep you posted! Besides, I'm sure I'll be back here with a million more questions! LOL!

Marilee

 

[Mare100]

I can't believe it

I can't believe it

Our CBB is gone.

Not too long after I posted my last message.....she just swam over to the corner of the tank....and laid herself down on the bottom of the tank....and she passed.

I can't believe it happened so quickly. She looked so healthy at the shop. I don't understand what could cause her to go so quickly unless she was not right to begin with.

Maybe I should have known better. At the shop where we got her....there was another fish that didn't look right. I asked the guy about him and he said that that fish looked like it was suffering as a result of being caught with cyanide? I can't believe they use this to catch fish! I wonder if my CBB was caught the same way and the move from the shop to our tank just was too much for her?

Anyway.....WW....thanks so much for the advice and I am still going to do the garlic & selcon soaking for the rest of the guys.

Marilee

 

[WinkeyWoneye]

Very sorry to hear that :sad2:
I replied to your PM also btw. Any other questions just ask away.
Cyanide poisoning is a possible culprit. It is pretty sad that they practically kill a fish just to get it into a store. Thats not even considering how many of them actually do die on the way to the fish stores due to poisoning. Could try another LFS, and hopefully they dont have the same suppliers. Not all divers/suppliers use cyanide as a means of capturing fish.

 

[zuzecawi]

Copper bands are delicate species for even highly experienced reefers. Really, they shouldn't be purchased unless you have a large (125+ gal) and well established reef tank with plenty of live rock. It's a shame that so many of the most beautiful marine fish are also the most delicate! Don't beat yourself up too bad over the fish passing over, you probably couldn't of done anything different except not buy it. Take it easy, break yourself into the hobby slowly, and you'll find that the long run brings more success than you thought possible.
Just a question, how were you acclimating the fish from the pet store to your home aquarium? Often, acclimation can be a touchy time, and rushing it can add to the fish's stress. Newly imported specimens are notoriously unstable at the best of days, usually it's better to watch a fish at your LFS for several weeks to see if you can observe it actually eating prepared food there, rather than just snatch it up the day it hits port. Acclimation is ultra important, I suggest running some air tubing from your main tank into a bucket where you have your newly purchased fish, with a knot tied in it to regulate the speed of flow. This is called drip acclimation, and over several hours, it brings the chemistry of the two different waters into equilibrium so that the fish can be introduced to your tank with a minimum of stress. Simply net the fish out of the bucket after the water volume has increased at least 3 x's the original amount of fish store water, and add it to your quarantine tank. then discard the water in the bucket, and refill your tank with clean, properly mixed saltwater to make up for the water lost in acclimation.
Hope this helps and best of luck.

 

[WinkeyWoneye]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8924622#post8924622 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zuzecawi
Simply net the fish out of the bucket after the water volume has increased at least 3 x's the original amount of fish store water, and add it to your quarantine tank.

Netting a fish is not good practice, it can damage a fishes eyes, scales, and on clowns in can break there gill bones (which would be fatal). Your best bet is one of those small plastic containers that you see the fish stores using to get fish out.
Also I have heard more stories of losing CBB's and tangs to a QT than curing them. IMO the delicate fish are ones you just haveta chance putting in your main tank, unless you have a HUGE QT tank for them to be happy in. Kinda like these ones at NEAQ - New England Aquarium (Boston, Ma)

[/URL][/IMG]

On a side note, I was thinking a 55g may be a touch too small for a CBB also. I am not the tang police by any means, and I have seen MUCH worse than a CBB in a 55. Try a monster blue hippo is a 35 cube... now that is evil. If you got a small CBB, it could be happy in your tank for a while. But for long term happiness they do need a bigger tank, atleast a 72-75g tank. I think saying 125 as a minimum is a bit extreme. Funny I just read a "tang police" thread and someone recommends tangs to not be in a tank any smaller than a 90.... My question is this... whats the diffrence between a 90 bowfront or a 72 bowfront??? They are the same dimensions except the 90 is a touch taller.... my tang never goes above the rock work into open waters anways so I HIGHLY DOUBT there is any diffrence.
I dont think your tank size had anything to do with this though, as said in my PM it was most likely already ill when you got it. If it wasnt acclimated properly that could be the cause also. Drip acclimation, as mentioned above is the best way to ensure the least stressful intoduction into your tank. Good luck with all future additions and dont beat yourself up over the death...it happens even to the best of em. Sometimes with no good explination either

 

[Mare100]

Hi Everybody....

And thank you all for your words of support. I know some people will say "aww...it's just a fish"....but you still get attached to the little buggers......even in such a short time.

I never knew that they did such a terrible thing as using cyanide to catch the fish until I started getting this tank together. I can't believe it. If I were a shop owner and knew these methods were used....I would definitely not get fish from that supplier. I still cannot believe how cruel people can be to animals and just think nothing of it.

Anyway....Zuzecawi....I agree that we probably should not have even had a Copper Banded at this point. I guess we went about it all wrong. We were very anxious to get some "new guys" for our tank (as our nitrite cycle FINALLY finished). My husband was performing water readings twice a day and made sure conditions were great. We went to a very reputable store. We had been there before and were very impressed with how nicely the fish were kept. Anyway....we thought this little guy was so beautiful and decided to take him. After we got home, we did a little reading up on him and saw lots of reports that this species was not an easy keeper for a beginner. Sad lesson learned.....find out all you can about a species BEFORE you bring him home.

We acclimated him via the method you suggested....using a tube from our tank tied in knot to regulate the drip. We did the acclimation for about 1-1/2 hours....then put him directly into our tank.

Today, we are going to go out and purchase a small 10 gallon tank to use as a quarantine tank. I think from now on....we will acclimate any new guys to that tank....for about a week (?)....then move him into the big tank.

WW....you are right....the Boston Aquarium is AWESOME. We live in Western Mass and have visited there this summer.

Well....thanks again for all the advice everybody. You guys have been so very helpful. I'm so thankful that I found this forum with such great people to offer advice and support.

I will definitely be here alot with lots of questions and updates!

Marilee

 

[WinkeyWoneye]

That pic came from a behind the scenes tour I was lucky enough to be able to attend. The display side of the aquarium is awesome, those pics are from Oct, 06. A few members of our local club put together a behind the scenes tour w/ one of the aquariums directors. It was one of the most amazing things I have ever seen. Filtration, filtration and MORE filtration, plus propagation and QT tanks. I would love to do this again sometime in the near future to snap some more kick arse photos.