phosphate help

[saleencobra]

I set this system up almost 2 years ago. I got tired of testing for phosphates because they were always zero and not a problem. Corals started looking not so happy so I started testing everything as we do looking for the problem. Much to my surprise phosphates were way high. I installed a phos reactor and filled with rowaphos and put several bags of different brands of phos remover in the sump. They are not dropping and corals are dying. My makeup water has 0 phos according to a salifert kit. tap water does have them. Is it possible for my makeup water to let an undetectable amount into the water and build up as other nutrients do if not removed? I haven't replaced the ro membrane in awhile ,is this where I should start? Please give me a direction to go. Thanks Mike

 

[lfjewett]

Hey, here is what I've picked up so far. It is possible that your RO water could be letting some phosphates into your tank, a TDS meter is a good indication of your water quality. You should get a Zero reading from your RODI water ( or near zero ).

excessive flake food, or a large dead fish that has gone unseen are also causes of high phosphates.

Once you get a large ammount of phos in the water it's going to get absorbed by the rocks/sand so you will not see the level decrease quickly. The ROWAphos will remove the phosphate but only so much before it is full. I suggest you test the water coming out of your reactor, it should not have any phosphate in it. If it does your media might need to be replaced.

Macro Algea is also a good way to remove both Nitrate and Phosphate from a system. Do you happen to have a refugium setup? Also what other kinds of filters are you running? wet/dry etc?

 

[tack-msv]

lfjewet makes good points.

Saleencobra, you did not say anything about algea being a problem. If there are nutrients (PO4), algea will thrive.

Speaking from experience, Rowaphos is pretty powerful and should not be added in large quantities. It will definitely shock the corals even though Deltec insists that it won't. You should gradually increase the amount in the reactor. The Rowa will reduce the phos levels, it just takes a little while due to the live rock that has absorbed the phos and is now leaching it back into the water column.

Salifert tests on the whole are the best IMO, however the phosphate test does not detect below 1ppm. Therfor you probably still had phosphate, but the test was incapable of showing the scale. You need a "low level" phosphate test kit. Unfortunately, these are in the neighborhood of $80.

I say get rid of the "other" phos removers from the sump and take about half of the Rowa out of the reactor. Keep what you take out moist, so that you can add some of it back into the reactor about every 5 days until full again. Also, you didn't mention if you had made any water changes or added carbon. I would do both, again only adding a little carbon and increasing it every few days for awhile. After a month you could probably stop using the carbon, but I would run the Rowa for the rest of the time you have your tank up. It just keeps things from creeping up on you (not only the PO4, but nuisance algae as well.)

 

[saleencobra]

I do have 2 refugiums one of witch did not grow the macro very well but now they are thriving. No wet/dry just 2 skimmers. I also posted this in reef discussion and someone suggested unrinsed mysis being the problem, what do you think. I also read that the giant clams help remove phos also,do you agree? I will test someone thanks for the replies...

 

[Billybeau1]

I disagree that the Salifert does not test below 1 ppm. Mine does.

I recently had high PO4 issues and used a new product called Phosar. Took my PO4 from 1 ppm to 0 in a week.

Phosphates likely coming from food.

 

[tack-msv]

Billybeau1, your $18 Salifert Kit tests down below 1ppm? Wow, I need to find out what store you bought that at so I can get a kit or two! My Salifert always showed no PO4, but when I got tired of still having hair algae, I took my water to be tested at the LFS (Atlantis Aquarium-Richmond VA). I told the owner of my situation and although he sells only Salifert kits, he emphatically told me that the Salifert PO4 kit could not properly show levels below 1ppm. He whipped out his personal Deltec Low Level PO4 kit and it immediatley showed .8ppm., he then gave me the whole shpiel about Rowaphos (basically what I posted earlier). Three weeks later, no hair algae. If I had relied on the Salifert test, I would still be frustrated. Again I think that on the whole Salifert is the best value for several reasons, I just know from experience that the PO4 kit is not accurate below 1ppm.

Never had the chance to use any other PO4 removers other than Rowa and Seachem's Phosguard. Stay away from the "white" PO4 removers as they tend to leach PO4 back into the water column after they are full. The Phosguard was white, and I used it in my FOWLR tank. Never did much at all for the PO4 levels, they stayed around 1.5ppm (with the Salifert kit). After the Rowa experience in my Reef tank, I started running Rowa in the FOWLR. Man, did the coraline take off. As I am not as concerned with getting the PO4 levels in that tank down to 0, I have stopped testing. The proof is in the results. I am sure there are other PO4 removers that work very well. Phosar is probably one of them. Most likely Ferric Hydroxide based as that what Phosban and Rowa are made of

 

[Billybeau1]

tack, I saw with my own eyes the blue color getting lighter and lighter day by day. The faintest color on the scale being .03

Of course the $300 units are better. Randy uses a Hach-19. But for 18 bucks, I'll take the Salifert anyday. I now have no blue tint whatsoever and no more algae.

I suppose it is possible something else in your tank could have been scewing the results.

And yes, Phosar is no different in composition than Rowa or most other GFO's. Its the construction of the pellets that allow greater flow around the media for PO4 absorption.