Pop Eye on my Raccoon Butterfly

[Pigpen17]

Hello all!

I am new to the board, but I have been a reader from time to time.

I have a Raccoon Butterfly fish that has really had a bad time so far. It's been in my tank for a few weeks now. It just got over a case of ich, and now this morning I see it has pop eye in both eyes. Plus it is hiding a lot, which is very unusual behavior for this fish. I did a water change this morning, even though it seemed like everything was fine. Advice? Specifically, what kind of medication? Vitamins? Do I need to quarantine? Is there medication I can add to the tank without hurting my bio?

My tank is a 30 cube FOWLR, with the Butterfly fish, Neon goby, Cleaner shrimp, Emerald Crab, Hermits and sails.

We love this fish. Please help.
Thank you.

 

[HumbleFish]

The pop eye is likely a secondary infection from Ich, which is still active in your tank BTW. You need to QT the Butterfly (and goby too), and treat with a copper remedy such as Cupramine. Add to this a broad range antibiotic, such as Furan-2 or Erythromycin, to treat the pop eye.

Leave the DT fallow for 72 days to starve out the remaining Ich. Corals/inverts can remain in the DT, but all fish need to be QT & treated as outlined above.

 

[Pigpen17]

I was afraid of that. Catching the goby is going to prove.......difficult.

Thanks.

 

[Pigpen17]

Also, I am feeding it chopped clam. That should be fine? or do you have to be careful with store bought, uncooked seafood?

 

[Pigpen17]

The pop eye is likely a secondary infection from Ich, which is still active in your tank BTW. You need to QT the Butterfly (and goby too), and treat with a copper remedy such as Cupramine. Add to this a broad range antibiotic, such as Furan-2 or Erythromycin, to treat the pop eye.

Leave the DT fallow for 72 days to starve out the remaining Ich. Corals/inverts can remain in the DT, but all fish need to be QT & treated as outlined above.

Sorry. I am going to have a lot of questions with this one.

Read the HT set up. Very informative. I have a glass 10g that should do the trick. Read the catching fish. Also good.

Keeping the fish out of my tank for 2 1/2 months. Can I keep them in the Hospital tank? That seems like it would not be a suitable environment for that lenght of time. You would have to change the water every day? Do you keep treating the entire time?

 

[HumbleFish]

Sorry. I am going to have a lot of questions with this one.

Read the HT set up. Very informative. I have a glass 10g that should do the trick. Read the catching fish. Also good.

Keeping the fish out of my tank for 2 1/2 months. Can I keep them in the Hospital tank? That seems like it would not be a suitable environment for that lenght of time. You would have to change the water every day? Do you keep treating the entire time?

Buy one of these: http://www.seachem.com/Products/product_pages/AmmoniaAlert.html

That will give you a rough idea of the intervals in which you will need to do WCs to keep the ammonia at bay. My guess is every 2 or 3 days with that bio-load in a 10 gal QT. So, you might wanna consider buying a larger QT. A 20 gal, for example, would work much better. DO NOT use any ammonia neutralizers when using Cupramine, as those will turn the copper toxic. Also, remember to treat any replacement water with Cupramine (but not top-off). You treat w/Cupramine for 30 days, and then go into "observation mode" until the 72 day fallow period is up on the DT.

Another option for you is tank transfer method. Read thru the sticky below and see what you think. It is a chemical-less solution to your Ich problem, but you'd still need to treat w/antibiotics while doing TT. You would also need to buy another 10 gal tank, and still have to wait until the fallow period was up to move the fish back into the DT.

Tank transfer sticky: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1996525

 

[Pigpen17]

Buy one of these: http://www.seachem.com/Products/product_pages/AmmoniaAlert.html

That will give you a rough idea of the intervals in which you will need to do WCs to keep the ammonia at bay. My guess is every 2 or 3 days with that bio-load in a 10 gal QT. So, you might wanna consider buying a larger QT. A 20 gal, for example, would work much better. DO NOT use any ammonia neutralizers when using Cupramine, as those will turn the copper toxic. Also, remember to treat any replacement water with Cupramine (but not top-off). You treat w/Cupramine for 30 days, and then go into "observation mode" until the 72 day fallow period is up on the DT.

Another option for you is tank transfer method. Read thru the sticky below and see what you think. It is a chemical-less solution to your Ich problem, but you'd still need to treat w/antibiotics while doing TT. You would also need to buy another 10 gal tank, and still have to wait until the fallow period was up to move the fish back into the DT.

Tank transfer sticky: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1996525

Huh. The Tank transfer stuff is very interesting. Thanks.

I will take your advice. Went shopping today and got what I need, including an ammonia alarm. I have a 29 tank in th garage. After reading your post, I think will use that one, although getting a skimmer in it may prove challenging. I got some PVC for hiding, and I am going to take this fish free time in my DT to change over the sandbed. I have had that sand for a long time though a lot of stuff. I got 40 lbs of live sand today.

Update too, the swelling has gone down a bunch just naturaly, and it seems like both eyes still have sight. Hope we are though the worst of it.

 

[HumbleFish]

Huh. The Tank transfer stuff is very interesting. Thanks.

I will take your advice. Went shopping today and got what I need, including an ammonia alarm. I have a 29 tank in th garage. After reading your post, I think will use that one, although getting a skimmer in it may prove challenging. I got some PVC for hiding, and I am going to take this fish free time in my DT to change over the sandbed. I have had that sand for a long time though a lot of stuff. I got 40 lbs of live sand today.

Update too, the swelling has gone down a bunch just naturaly, and it seems like both eyes still have sight. Hope we are though the worst of it.

FWIW; you don't need to run a skimmer in QT. Just a heater, powerhead (or even airstone) for circulation/gas exchange. No sand/rock, as both absorb copper. You can use PVC fittings for hiding places.

I'm not going to lie to you, it's possible your fish may survive this incident and make a fully recovery w/o any treatment. But so long as Ich is in the tank, it's going to just keep happening again & again. QT all future fish purchases after this and you won't have to go thru this ever again. I learned that the hard way.

 

[Pigpen17]

FWIW; you don't need to run a skimmer in QT. Just a heater, powerhead (or even airstone) for circulation/gas exchange. No sand/rock, as both absorb copper. You can use PVC fittings for hiding places.

I'm not going to lie to you, it's possible your fish may survive this incident and make a fully recovery w/o any treatment. But so long as Ich is in the tank, it's going to just keep happening again & again. QT all future fish purchases after this and you won't have to go thru this ever again. I learned that the hard way.

29 gal QT it is then.


I am with you 100% on this. Thank you so much for your help. I am actually exited to get the fishes out of my tank, replace the sand bed, and start again Ich free. If my fish survives or not, you have pointed me in a good direction.

Thanks.

 

[reeferstace]

Good luck with nursing your fish back to health. Ick can be beaten but it takes time and dedication.

A 30g tank is really an unsuitable home for a butterfly of any species. Liveaquaria lists the minimum tank size for a raccoon as 125 gallons.

 

[Pigpen17]

Good luck with nursing your fish back to health. Ick can be beaten but it takes time and dedication.

A 30g tank is really an unsuitable home for a butterfly of any species. Liveaquaria lists the minimum tank size for a raccoon as 125 gallons.

Thank You.


Yeah, I know I am pushing it. It's only about 3" long right now, so although it obviously was not a great choice, it had potential to work out. The idea was to upgrade my tank at the end of the year. I stayed away from tangs because I knew my swim track was too short. This guy though doesn't seem to be acting crowded. It has room to swim and spends a lot of time picking at my rocks or dancing in my power head stream. I feed smaller amounts 3 times a day to keep it from getting board. All in all, I would say it was doing well, but of course it's not because it heath has dropped off fast.

I had high hopes at first, but it may just not work out. I am not sure if disease vulnerability is the problem or over crowding or both, but it may not make a difference. Something has to change. I feel obligated to nurse this fish back to health though.

 

[Pigpen17]

Happy Update!

I got home today from work, and the pop eye is gone! It was feeding well also, not missing the food like it was when it was swollen so I think there is no blindness. It is swimming and playing, and happy! I am still treating for Ich and doing everything we talked about above, because it will come back due to my tank being infested, but I think death is now avoided. Thank you all for your advice and this space to vent my troubles.

As well, this illness has got my wife thinking that a bigger tank might be in order. We all do love this fish! Victory!

 

[Deinonych]

Glad to hear he is doing better!

 

[HumbleFish]

Happy Update!

I got home today from work, and the pop eye is gone! It was feeding well also, not missing the food like it was when it was swollen so I think there is no blindness. It is swimming and playing, and happy! I am still treating for Ich and doing everything we talked about above, because it will come back due to my tank being infested, but I think death is now avoided. Thank you all for your advice and this space to vent my troubles.

As well, this illness has got my wife thinking that a bigger tank might be in order. We all do love this fish! Victory!

Sounds like his natural immune system beat the infection, so you can nix the antibiotics. Focus instead on copper (Cupramine) treatment for Ich. That his natural immune system can never 100% defeat.

 

[reeferstace]

Congratulations on beating popeye! Keep us updated on the cupramine therapy.

 

[Pigpen17]

Will do! It's gonna be a long haul, but I feel confident that it will all work out well.