Seeding Dry Rock With Live Rock

J

Jakers88

Member
Saw this post from today:http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2201890


And this one from the other day:
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2198074&highlight=seed+dry+rock

mikehaase1norse said:
Well, this is the last thing i need to do for my next build but i wanna make sure i do this right so any input would be awesome

I plan on getting brs dry rock.
adding it to a brute can with ro/di water and soaking if for about a week.
then following week i plan to drain all the water and replace it with fresh saltwater. using a heater to keep it around 80 degrees, a power head to stir.
then i plan an adding around a half cube of frozen food to the water every couple days, then steping up to daily (too much food?) to help cycle. Once i switch to saltwater in the brute can should i seed with a chunk of live rock? do i have to or does it just help speed it up that much?
during all this time i plan on around 20 percent weekly water changes.
hoping this will cure and cycle my rock in 2-3 months.

that sound like a good game plan? am i missing anything? I plan on buying 50-125 pounds.

one last question, out of the three brs rocks
pukani $ 3.49 per pound, reef saver $2.39 and fiji at $2.69 whats the best bang for the buck? pros cons to any of them? If youve used more then one if the past what did you prefer?
eco seems super easy to scape with, fiji sounds like its lighter (less dense) then eco, so buy size its cheaper, correct? is this true with fiji vrs pukani?

Thanks again!
Click to expand...

I'm going to be setting up a 120g reef within the next 6 months and was thinking of doing this same process. Figured I would start to cycle/seed the dry rock with a few lbs of live rock from the LFS. Is a light needed for this? Seems most of what I am finding is that this is normally done in tank with everything running but seeing as how this will be outside of the tank not sure if a light is necessary, what I have read is that coralline algae prefers actinic lights over white light, so should I buy a small actinic light for this setup? As with the temperature being at 80F how important is that for cycling/seeding the DR with the LR? I live in Arizona and plan on doing this in the garage, currently it's 109F outside so the garage can get well above 80F. Now when I start this process (~3 months away) it will be cooling down and will be winter time so the temperature will drop a bit but just for cuisosity sakes is 80F a hard set temp for this process?

Overall Plan For Seeding The DR:
1. Order from BRS (bulk of rock) 80+lbs and MacroRocks (pillars/shelves) 40+lbs
2. Live rock from LFS - 5-10lbs (will use to seed DR and keep in sump/fuge once tank is setup.
3. Clean/wash dry rock, let dry. Aquascape into a few sections (use mortar to hold design).
4. Fill Brute/equivulent can with SW
5. Add DR on bottom and LR on top, add heater set to 80F, add powerhead.
6. Check chemical levels/monthly water changes/add ammonia/food (if neccessary)
7. Cycle/seed for 3months the add to tank.
8. Win?


Didn't want this to be one of those posts that just keeps repeating but I didn't want to steal/take over someone elses thread ( :fun2: )

Anways thanks in advance for the help. Really looking forward to getting my first tank setup!! :fun4:
 
Jakers88,

Thought I'd post some pics to give you an idea of what the Macro looks like without anything on it. The first few pics are cloudy. I just put the rock in Friday night. I took the clear pics just a few minutes ago.

If you'll notice in the cloudy pic, I left a rock on top to show the one that I couldn't fit in the tank. And I think I'll wind up taking out more down the road. It just takes up so much room. I have a 38g tank.

I ordered 25 lbs of Macro pre-cured, plus 10 lbs. of their prime cut. Then I bought 4 lbs of live rock and placed it in different areas. There are two palm sized pieces in the back of the tank that aren't visible from the front.

I think it really is true that when you buy dry rock, you get more surface area because you're not paying for the water weight.

Also, I didn't realize we were supposed to keep the temp at 80 when cycling. Is this true? I have it at 72. Guess I'll start bumping it.

Rock3.jpg


Rock1.jpg


TankCleared1.jpg


Live.jpg


Live2.jpg
 
I seeded 50lbs of dry rock from reefrocks.net with about 15lbs of Fiji LR from my LFS. No problems. Took my about 3 weeks to cycle my tank then added my CUC. Waiting on a pair of clowns to finish 2 more weeks of QT. Then my tank will finally have some fish in it.
 
Okay this is going to be long but I will try to cover everything in detail as to what I did on my last tank to seed my LR while I was waiting for my 400 Gallon to arrive.

1) I went out and bought a 200 Gallon stock tank (they are mainly for feeding animals) and here is what they look like:

http://www.tractorsupply.com/stock-...ral-foam-stock-tanks-150-gal-capacity-2229919

2) I put my Pukani LR (that I bought from Bulk Reef Supply) in, filled it with RO/DI water and got the salinity up to around 1.025.

3) When I was ready to add LR to seed all my 'deadrock' I placed my skimmer, a couple powerheads and used the same lighting I was going to use when my tank arrived (I placed two 400W pendants over the 'seed tank'. To answer your question regarding lighting, you are very capable of having a tank cycle without any light. That being said, there are certain beneficial bacteria that require light to survive and for this reason you will see people run their lights 3-4 hours a day during a cycle. If you were asking me, I would say to run the lights 3-4 hours a day until the 'seed tank' has cycled but that is only my personal preference and there are still many people who end up with successful tanks that do not run the lights during the cycle.

4) Your 'seed tank' on average will take around 4-6 weeks to complete the initial cycle. This obviously fluctuates depending on the amount of LR you add, whether that LR is cycled or not, etc. You are correct that some initial cycles can last up to 3 months, however in my experience 4-6 weeks is the average time however it will take much longer than the cycle time for your tank to fully seed (upwards of 6 months to a year).

5) Temperature is always a problem, do you plan to buy a chiller when your tank is ready? I would suggest that if you are going to buy a chiller when your tank is ready, buy it now and use it to keep the temperatures down. My 200 gallon 'seed tank' with just two metal halide lights and a skimmer pump very quickly brought the temperatures over 85 degrees and I was forced to hook up my aquarium chiller just to keep the temperature in check.

6) When your tank is cycled, you will more likely than not, see an algae bloom. This is normal and at this point, do a 30-40% water change and add a clean-up crew. You do not change the water before the tank has cycled, and once it has, its safe to add a CUC. After a couple weeks, add a little fish (small Clownfish). It will give you something to look at and enjoy until your tank gets here. Just remember though, by this time (approx. 2 months into your adventure) your tank is nowhere close to being fully seeded so take it slow. Adding too much food or fish will cause a crash and you will be right back at square one.

Note: If you are planning to purchase 'Pukani Live Rock' from BRS I would advise you to place a single piece of it inside a bucket of water from the 'seed tank' and wait a few days and test for PO4. Some batches of their Pukani have been known to leach PO4 into the water which cause outbreaks in hair algae for up to 6 months (or until all the PO4) has been leached from the rock. There is a simple solution to getting rid of the PO4 before you place the Pukani in your 'seed tank'. There is a link to that thread.

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2049855&page=13

Anyways this is a good start I think, you will more likely than not have questions, but this should get you going (Y)
 
^Thanks for the info, I didn't think about the feeder tank from Rubbermaid, I like that idea better than the trash cans. Ya I have been readling alot about the PO4 spikes from BRS with the pukani rock, I was going to go with mostly reef saver, wanted pukani at first but read about some of the issues, with this being my first tank I figured I would try and stray away from as many issues that I could. Do you think a chiller will be necessary? I was hoping I wouldn't need one, I keep the house at 78F and plan on using LED fixtures as my light source and running some fans across the DT and the sump/fuge but maybe that wont be enough to cool it?
 
Jakers88 said:
^Thanks for the info, I didn't think about the feeder tank from Rubbermaid, I like that idea better than the trash cans. Ya I have been readling alot about the PO4 spikes from BRS with the pukani rock, I was going to go with mostly reef saver, wanted pukani at first but read about some of the issues, with this being my first tank I figured I would try and stray away from as many issues that I could. Do you think a chiller will be necessary? I was hoping I wouldn't need one, I keep the house at 78F and plan on using LED fixtures as my light source and running some fans across the DT and the sump/fuge but maybe that wont be enough to cool it?
Click to expand...

To be honest, your tank temperature will have a lot to do with what you have running in your tank, and how hot it is outside.

To keep temperature as low as possible buy a return pump that is a little bit more powerful than just for bringing water back to the display tank. This way, you can not only use it to bring water back to your display, but also to supply water to your calcium reactor, carbon reactor, chiller (if you need one), etc. The less pumps you have in your system the cooler it will run and pumps for inside the display tank like Tunze or Vortech although pricy are very efficient and run cooler then the 'cheaper' pumps.

LED for lighting is also another great choice. Personally I love Halide lighting which is why I went with that for my tank, but I also love how with LED you can ramp up and down intensity, create night effects, thunderstorms, etc. which is why I recently added them as well. LED's output far less heat in comparison to metal halide lights so that is also another great way to try and keep temperatures down.

That being said, sometimes where you live plays the biggest role in tank temperature. Don't forget that your skimmer is going to be continuously drawing in outside air, your tank will be completely surrounded by the outside air temperature and sometimes just having your tank near a window exposed to sunlight is enough to have spikes in temperature.

How large of a tank are you planning to have? You can find some pretty reasonably used chillers on this forum that would keep your worrying down.
 
Jakers88 said:
Overall Plan For Seeding The DR:
1. Order from BRS (bulk of rock) 80+lbs and MacroRocks (pillars/shelves) 40+lbs
2. Live rock from LFS - 5-10lbs (will use to seed DR and keep in sump/fuge once tank is setup.
3. Clean/wash dry rock, let dry. Aquascape into a few sections (use mortar to hold design).
4. Fill Brute/equivulent can with SW
5. Add DR on bottom and LR on top, add heater set to 80F, add powerhead.
6. Check chemical levels/monthly water changes/add ammonia/food (if neccessary)
7. Cycle/seed for 3months the add to tank.
8. Win?
Click to expand...

No reason to use live rock since you have time on your side - and I'd use the brute cans in the garage since they have lids vs using the stock tanks. You are growing bacteria during the cycle. You won't need lights, and given your location I wouldn't worry about the temp right now. pumps are nice, gives the cans that "lived in" look. Add ammonia to the water, 1-2ppm, test and repeat.
 
shaginwagon13 said:
To be honest, your tank temperature will have a lot to do with what you have running in your tank, and how hot it is outside.

To keep temperature as low as possible buy a return pump that is a little bit more powerful than just for bringing water back to the display tank. This way, you can not only use it to bring water back to your display, but also to supply water to your calcium reactor, carbon reactor, chiller (if you need one), etc. The less pumps you have in your system the cooler it will run and pumps for inside the display tank like Tunze or Vortech although pricy are very efficient and run cooler then the 'cheaper' pumps.

LED for lighting is also another great choice. Personally I love Halide lighting which is why I went with that for my tank, but I also love how with LED you can ramp up and down intensity, create night effects, thunderstorms, etc. which is why I recently added them as well. LED's output far less heat in comparison to metal halide lights so that is also another great way to try and keep temperatures down.

That being said, sometimes where you live plays the biggest role in tank temperature. Don't forget that your skimmer is going to be continuously drawing in outside air, your tank will be completely surrounded by the outside air temperature and sometimes just having your tank near a window exposed to sunlight is enough to have spikes in temperature.

How large of a tank are you planning to have? You can find some pretty reasonably used chillers on this forum that would keep your worrying down.
Click to expand...

Ya I didn't think about all the pumps running... Maybe a chiller isn't such a bad idea. Tank will ne 120g with a 38g sump/fuge. It will be on an outside wall which I'm assuming will add a little heat, and a sliding glass door will be near as well so that will add some more heat... I guess a chiller sounds like a must now lol. Might have to build a bigger stand/add on stand to accomidate everything lol...
 
Jakers88 said:
Ya I didn't think about all the pumps running... Maybe a chiller isn't such a bad idea. Tank will ne 120g with a 38g sump/fuge. It will be on an outside wall which I'm assuming will add a little heat, and a sliding glass door will be near as well so that will add some more heat... I guess a chiller sounds like a must now lol. Might have to build a bigger stand/add on stand to accomidate everything lol...
Click to expand...

Ya I would recommend getting one and you can find a used one used on this forum for a very decent price. Its also good to let fresh outside air into the room with the tank (it will help raise PH) so having a chiller will allow you to do this while keeping your temperature in check.
 
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