setting up my 180 - too much flow?

[reefkeeperrut]

I'm in the set up process of my new 180. It will be a BB with mostly SPS. 100g rubbermaid for sump.

Flow consists of:
- PanWorld 150PS (return)
- 2 x Tunze 6100 on multicontroller
- Tunze Wavebox
- Sequence Dart on Oceans Motions for closed loop

In my planning stage I thought this would be a good amount but lately have read a couple of threads re: too much flow leading to poor polyp extension.

I really appreciate any feedback.

Thanks,

Brian

 

[hansnfrans]

Figure out your gph rating of all those pumps combined, then subtract the necessary gph due to the plumbing scheme. Divide that by 180 and you SHOULD be somewhere in the ballpark of 10 to 20 times turnover rate of the tank. It also depends alot upon what you inted to keep in the tank. This sounds like it should be an SPS dominated tank w/ all that flow.

 

[BreadmanMike]

Brian,

You will be fine and can add much more if you wanted to since you are BB.

 

[Doubledown]

hansnfrans - the 2x6100 and Dart closed loop alone equate to almost 10,000 gph or roughly 55x turnover.

Brian -

Personally I would choose either the contolable streams or the Dart closed loop. I think that both would be overkill even on a bare bottom SPS tank. Save the cash for the closed loop and buy a really nice skimmer or a really nice Ca Reactor setup, money will be much better spent there.

To go further, I would take the controlable Tunzes over a closed loop. Power consumption is the same and flow is not only controlable, but twice that of the loop for a similar price (once you factor the cost for the OM, Dart and plumbing).

I wanted to do the Wavebox with 2x6100s on my 180, but was cautioned by the tank manufacturer against the wavebox in an acrylic tank. If I had a glass tank I would have the wavebox in it.

 

[Edward Smith]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7809865#post7809865 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Doubledown
hansnfrans - the 2x6100 and Dart closed loop alone equate to almost 10,000 gph or roughly 55x turnover.

Brian -

Personally I would choose either the contolable streams or the Dart closed loop. I think that both would be overkill even on a bare bottom SPS tank. Save the cash for the closed loop and buy a really nice skimmer or a really nice Ca Reactor setup, money will be much better spent there.

To go further, I would take the controlable Tunzes over a closed loop. Power consumption is the same and flow is not only controlable, but twice that of the loop for a similar price (once you factor the cost for the OM, Dart and plumbing).

I wanted to do the Wavebox with 2x6100s on my 180, but was cautioned by the tank manufacturer against the wavebox in an acrylic tank. If I had a glass tank I would have the wavebox in it.

I agree with Doubledown. I don't know if you get any greater results with such excessive flow.

Sorry to highjack the thread....but

I thought glass aquariums were not compatable with the waveboxes? Does anyone know for sure?

 

[RobTop]

Wave box...
Not that I know for sure, but I thought the acrylic seams where stronger than glass seams. Which would mean not a good idea in glass. Don't really know for sure though

 

[hansnfrans]

Whatever you decide to do here, make sure that the currents of your pump and Tunzes converge. 55x turnover rate in the form of laminar flow wouldn't be very good for any coral. Might be good amount of power for powerwashing concrete though . Didn't know it was a BB tank, so this will necessitate more flow but I'd tune down the 6100's a bit. Just my opinion though.

 

[Doubledown]

Continued hijack -

The theory on the wavebox with glass tanks is that it will shorten the average lifespan of the tank 15 - 20% (from typical 15 years to 12 or so). Many people replace their tanks by then anyway.

As for acrylic - I was notified by the manufacturer of my tank that they would recommend against putting a wavebox in any acrylic tank with walls thinner than 3/4". Something to do with acrylic being more flexible than glass and the uneven pressures delivered by the wave-like pattern generated by the wavebox causing the potential instability of the tank seams and panes. Since my 180 is 1/2" acrylic - I did not want to take the chance. Mhurley here on CMAS has a wavebox in his 300 gallon Tenecor without issue, but that tank has 3/4" thick panes.

All that said, the wavebox is still too new and not enough extensive testing on timelines to say for sure. It is mostly just speculative now.

Hijack off.

 

[Doubledown]

Brian -

What I meant to say is that I would have both the Wavebox and the 2x6100s in my 180 if it were glass.

Since you are looking to go bare bottom, I would run your return lines all the way to the bottom (within 2 inches or so) and use the flow from thereturn pump to push the detritus toward the front/into the water column. I learned this little trick from Matt at ShoTank and use it with my shallow sandbed - it has blown all of the sand from behing the rocks up toward the front and keeps stuff from settling back there.

 

[Rod Buehler]

Its a lot more (constant) flow than I like to see, but I am one of those guys that likes sand bed and cats . Dont get me wrong.. I think a lot of flow is important,but maybe not quite so consistantly. Some corals may like it strong all the time, some may never like it strong, some may like it random.. Its a crap shot just like with lighting.. some corals will grow/look/do better under 20KK, and some better under 10KK. The ocean is huge and all of the corals arent collected from the same area. One of the main reasons I like surge tanks so much, is because it seems to be an "inbetween" for everything.. When the surges blast (especially the 2" models) its hard to match that wide open flow, but inbetween surges, the flow is greatly reduced.


Re: wave boxes vs acrylic. I can comment on the wave box, but I have had surges blow out the seams on an acrlic tank, but never a glass tank. 0% fatality on glass tanks (20+ tanks with surges), and 50% with acrylic tanks. (2 with surges and one has failed)

 

[reefkeeperrut]

thanks all-

I already own all the equipment so if I don't use it I will sell it I guess.

I've seen the wavebox in action on a All Glass 180. Looks to me to be no problem but I have also heard it will shorten the lifespan of the tank; something I am willing to live with .

I was planning on running 2 channels of the OM to seperate spray bars and the other two pointed somewhat towards the tunze's flow (powered by a Dart.)

So if I were to use all the flow devices I currently have should I turn down the 6100's to say 50%? And with a 100g sump will the Panworld provide enough flow through the sump?

Thanks everyone for the help. And Rod I would definitely do a surge if it wasn't for the back splash and noise. When you develop the noiseless/splashless surge I'm all over that!

 

[BreadmanMike]

I run all 5 of my streams at 20%/100% for 3 second intervals on pulse. It creates a very diverse and random flow. It also allows things to get a short break.

 

[reefkeeperrut]

So do all the streams hit 20% and 100% at the same time or are they on different 3 second intervals? I have not yet set up the Tunzes and don't know all of their capabilities yet. Thanks.

 

[BreadmanMike]

They will all do the same thing at the same time. If you were looking to do them seperately, you would run interval 2 which will keep them running at all times. The difference here is you can have one set going from say 80 to 20 while the other set is doing the opposite. You can also change their max/min accordingly. It's hard to explain, but you'll see once you set it up. The controller is what makes the streams so great. It allows you to to many different things with the streams.

 

[reefkeeperrut]

all right then. I can't wait to get them running! I didn't realize they could be configured to that degree.