Too many conflicting IDs
- Thread starter Rav-65
- Start date
undertai
Active member
Post in here the guy from reefermadness has helped a lot of people with iding of corals. Also look at some of the older pages to see if it has been ided already.
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=751667&perpage=25&pagenumber=14
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=751667&perpage=25&pagenumber=14
RichConley
New member
The problem is, at this point, there aren't even clear documented differences in the species. Even scientists can't tell if they dont know the location the frag was collected. Add in the fact that flow can change morphology, and you have a situation where there is NO WAY to accurately ID an acroporid.
Scientists are at this point trying to decide whether there should be about 8 species of acropora, or 800. They can't tell whether things are unique, or just regional variations, or different growth forms of the same organism.
Reefermadness is good, but hes doing nothing more than guessing there.
Stoney Mahony
New member
I disagree. For having been in the buisness, he knows his stuff.
RichConley
New member
I'm not saying he doesnt.
I'm saying that theres not a scientific consensus on what actually constitutes each species.
I went to a presentation by Rob Toonen, who works closely with Charles Delbeek, both doing reasearch in the area.
Delbeek at this point refuses to ID anything thats been kept in captivity. He also refuses to ID anything without knowing where the collection location is. The problem is, so much of species ID is based on growth patterns, and tanks completely change the growth patterns of corals.
Also, any time species can't be differentiated except by collection location, you've got two species that are about to be combined.
ReeferMadnessUS
In Memoriam
It is true all I am doing is guessing. But that is all that we can do. We can't say Acropora spp. all the time. We also can't give every coral that comes in a fancy name depending on who is growing it out. So we have to try and break down the differences between the species (or subspecies) the best we can. From the tens of thousands of corals that I see every month you can see the definite similarities between the species. I try to do the best I can and make an ID from the literature that I have access to (i.e Veron and a few others, Wallace, etc). Some are quite easy to diferentiate but others are very difficult because they have similarities with several other species. I do not have a PHD in coral identification, and I do not say that my ID's are definite. I always try to communicate that "I believe or I guess or this might be" so on and so forth. But I always do my research before I make a "guess". I am not sure they are educated "guesses" but I do give it my all.
I am not sure that this makes anything better but I thought I should voice my opinion on why I do it in the first place.
Chris @ RM
P.S. Rav-65 this looks to me like it might be A. caroliniana. They aren't all that common but they can be a very beautiful tabletop when they grow out.
I am not sure that this makes anything better but I thought I should voice my opinion on why I do it in the first place.
Chris @ RM
P.S. Rav-65 this looks to me like it might be A. caroliniana. They aren't all that common but they can be a very beautiful tabletop when they grow out.
wentreefgirl
New member
So chris, whats your guess on this one. Im with maximus.
RichConley
New member
Chris, I wasnt trying to take a shot at you or anything, just trying to illuminate people on the state of things. As far as IDs go, you're about as good as it CAN get.
Your stuff is gorgeous by the way. Unfortunately I lost most of the frags I had in the recent move
Will be ordering stuff again most likely as soon as the tank gets back to stable
Your stuff is gorgeous by the way. Unfortunately I lost most of the frags I had in the recent move
Will be ordering stuff again most likely as soon as the tank gets back to stableAmphiprion
Premium Member
It is all true. You can only attempt to ID these corals. I agree that Chris probably is one of the best at identifying these corals. In all honesty, I don't even attempt it.
ReeferMadnessUS
In Memoriam
RichConley,
Oh no I didn't think you were ripping me in the least. I just wanted to clarify why I do what I do.
I agree with you completely in the sense that even the experts won't try in some cases to ID corals. Some Acropora can completely change due to higher or lower light, higher or lower water flow, etc... It is a crap shoot a lot of the time, but I have seen so many corals over the years that I start to see a lot of similarities that most folks might not notice. I am not a expert, but I do have a fat head and I always come on here to have the balloon deflated a bit . No I'm just kidding, but I just hate (I HATE) to call stuff sp. I feel like I have failed myself and all the years of schooling (Aquaculture, Mariculture and Ichthyology) that I have had.
I'm only here to Muddy the waters.
Chris @ RM
P.S. I hope to hear from you soon about those frags. Moves and Vacations suck for Reefers. If you ever are going to lose something it always happens during one or both of those endeavors.
Oh no I didn't think you were ripping me in the least. I just wanted to clarify why I do what I do.
I agree with you completely in the sense that even the experts won't try in some cases to ID corals. Some Acropora can completely change due to higher or lower light, higher or lower water flow, etc... It is a crap shoot a lot of the time, but I have seen so many corals over the years that I start to see a lot of similarities that most folks might not notice. I am not a expert, but I do have a fat head and I always come on here to have the balloon deflated a bit
. No I'm just kidding, but I just hate (I HATE) to call stuff sp. I feel like I have failed myself and all the years of schooling (Aquaculture, Mariculture and Ichthyology) that I have had. I'm only here to Muddy the waters.
Chris @ RM
P.S. I hope to hear from you soon about those frags. Moves and Vacations suck for Reefers. If you ever are going to lose something it always happens during one or both of those endeavors.
ReeferMadnessUS
In Memoriam
Wentreefgirl,
Yes I agree with Maximus as well....
P.S. Rav-65 this looks to me like it might be A. caroliniana. They aren't all that common but they can be a very beautiful tabletop when they grow out.
Yes I agree with Maximus as well....
P.S. Rav-65 this looks to me like it might be A. caroliniana. They aren't all that common but they can be a very beautiful tabletop when they grow out.
wentreefgirl
New member
Thanks to you and Veron im getting good at this game, <img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/wentreefgirl/Blinkies%20and%20siggies/grinhuge.gif">
LFS_worker
'ignoramus maximus'
If it grows into a bushy style or caesptiose(sp) it may fall closely to a a. Lokani which personally is what I think that it is. but they are extremely close to caroliniana.
Brian
Brian
UPSCALES REEF
New member
Looks like a multiacuta, Bali has been shipping a few of these.
But since Chris ID-ed it as a Caroliniana, it's gonna be a Coraliniana to me until someone can come up with something more concrete!! 
