What do I need from here?

[jnguyen4007]

All,

My plan is to start a reef aquarium. I purchased a 90 gal tank with a built in overflow in the center of the tank, a stand for it, and a 48" Orbit light with two 150 w HQI and actinic. I do have a question about the actinic light and I know that it will sound dumb, but I don't mind admitting that I'm clueless on it, what exactly is it for? Is it to make the water look bluer? I'm also getting a 40 gal sump filter and a reef ready rc 135 protein skimmer.

My next question is what do I need from here? I see all sorts of sand and rocks and what not online and they all beginning to look very confusing. What type of sand do I need, the type of rock? Is the Fiji stuff better than other stuff?

I also want to establish a refugium in my sump, what kind of stuff do I need to have in it?

For now, I will buy my RO water from a local aquarium store. I will eventually need an RO unit. Do I need to be plumber to hook one up? What kind do you recommend?

James

 

[Mariner]

Actinic lighting does give everything a bluer tint, but it also brings out the fluorescent colors of many corals and fish. While not absolutely necessary for most corals to survive and grow, many do use actinic light and it does benefit them.
The Sand and Live Rock you get has a lot to do with your personal preferences ... what appeals to you aesthetically, etc.
Sand for a reef tank should be aragonite (although a few use silicate sand, I don't recommend it). Finer grain sand is preferable for a deep sand bed. If you're planning a shallower sand bed, I'd use a little larger grain size.
Fiji rock is usually excellent rock, very light and porous and full of life. I got my original batch from Marine Depot, but there are many other good suppliers (check the RC sponsors page), and other sources of rock.
I like some Live Rock rubble and Chaetomorpha macro algae in my fuge; the Chaeto is good for nutrient/waste export and the LR rubble provides extra bio-filtering and homes for pods.
HTH,
Mariner

 

[papagimp]

The Actinic lighting is definatly on the blue side of the color spectrum. When you look at a natural reef, the blue color spectrum is what penetrates deeper into the water, so alot of corals require this color spectrum to flourish properly. Others, it just adds to the coloration of the corals. Some don't use actinic supplements but I prefer the way the overall coloration of lighting looks with them.

As for sand and rock, alot of the is going to be all personal preferences. As long as it's an aragonite based sand, should be fine. I would avoid the larger coarser grain sizes, go for something small to fine sized. I personally use the indopacific black sand, by caribsea, cause I like the black and white look. For another tank in my house I have just straight pulverized limestone from home depot in there. And another tank, just plain araganite white sand, nothing special. Same for rock, alot if jsut persoanl preference. I would say get the most porous rock that you can find though, makes for a better biological filter than none porous base rock. But also find stuff that you can "aqascape" according to your liking. coralline and coloring on the rock won't really matter much, since it's going to adapt to you tank, lighting, system in general given time.
Refugium, just some sand, 1-2" sandbed, more if you want it, some rubble rock. And some form of macro algae, I prefer Cheato, but I have cheato in one fuge, and I have caulepra in another, both work fabulously.
As for RO units, do not need to be a plumber. Just have the intellegence of a 4 year old and you can figure it out.
(no offense to anyone who had trouble hooking theres up!)

 

[jnguyen4007]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9455714#post9455714 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Mariner
Actinic lighting does give everything a bluer tint, but it also brings out the fluorescent colors of many corals and fish. While not absolutely necessary for most corals to survive and grow, many do use actinic light and it does benefit them.
The Sand and Live Rock you get has a lot to do with your personal preferences ... what appeals to you aesthetically, etc.
Sand for a reef tank should be aragonite (although a few use silicate sand, I don't recommend it). Finer grain sand is preferable for a deep sand bed. If you're planning a shallower sand bed, I'd use a little larger grain size.
Fiji rock is usually excellent rock, very light and porous and full of life. I got my original batch from Marine Depot, but there are many other good suppliers (check the RC sponsors page), and other sources of rock.
I like some Live Rock rubble and Chaetomorpha macro algae in my fuge; the Chaeto is good for nutrient/waste export and the LR rubble provides extra bio-filtering and homes for pods.
HTH,
Mariner

Mariner,

Thanks so much for your help. How deep of a sand bed do I need to have it to be? As far as rock goes, do I use dead rock on the bottom and live rock above it or do I use all live rocks? As for the refugium, I see store online that sell something that looks like sand that they claim is great for a refugium? Is that needed? Do I even need sand in a refugium?

James

 

[Scuba_Steve]

We were all clueless at one time. That is the great thing about this forum. Ok first of all, you havent mentioned a protein skimmer. Depending on your budget, Id get the best one you can afford. For a med priced good quality one, I would recommend an ASM g3, or an octopus 200. Actinic lights, are for the blue coloration which brings fish and coral colors out alot, and it also helps provide a light spectrum needed by coral. They are not neccesary, but mostly visually appealing. Sand, just make sure its an argonite based sand. You can get mostly dead sand and a few pounds of live sand to "active" the dead. In a few months it will all be live. Sand from a local reefer, or from a place that collects it from the ocean is betterthan arag alive and similar bagged live sand. Live rock comes in many types. Figi is one, and is great rock. Marshall island is the best looking, and also the most expensive. Also, you can buy dead rock and 25-50% live to seed the dead, but i prefer to get all live rock. For a refugium, you need a seperate space in your sump, or a seperate drilled tank. You put a small compact flourecent light on it, some put a nice deep sand bed in it, some cheato, some rubble. Buying your own ro/di will save you somemoney, and ensure that you really have 0 tds water. Sometimes lfs water isnt totally pure. I recommend the typhoon 3. It is a bit more expensive, but has alot of bells and whistles, and is a great quality ro/di. I forget the site to get it though, so ask around! Good luck and keep us posted!

 

[Scuba_Steve]

A deep sand bed is 4" or deeper. It helps break down nitrates. You do not need sand in your fuge. Miricle mud also works well, the stuff you see at the store. Look at premium aquatics for your rock and sand, they are a great dealer, and an rc sponsor. Look at there rock pool crud, or whatever they call it. It is great in a refugium!

 

[Shagsbeard]

He did mention a skimmer, and a sump. Good way to go.

Don't buy live sand... it's pretty much a waste of money. Your live rock will have sufficient life in it to cycle on it's own... sand, water and rock is all you need in the tank for the first month or so. Give your tank time like this for many reasons. The life in the rock needs time to flourish in the absence of preditors. The bacteria in the rock needs to adjust to the different levels of waste processing. Don't rush this step... you will regret it. I'd give it at least a month, possibly two.

Once you have one week with zero ammonia and nitrite, you could add a clean up crew. I like hermits, but there are those that hate them. Snails are pretty much a must have... they don't typically cause the problems they do in fresh water. There's too much in the tank that eats young snails. You wont see them breeding.

 

[Scuba_Steve]

i see the skimmer now, good skimmer! As for the sand, to each his own, but yes the lr will seed the sand. Personally, I think a few pounds of ls will cause it to seed much faster, and Im all about adding new sources for diversity. Im not talking like 40lbs or anything, Just 1-5lbs.

 

[jnguyen4007]

The owner of the LFS said that i need to add the sand and rock then add regular tap-dechlorinated water into the aquarium for a couple of weeks, as things start to die off, I can do my partial water change and gradually add RO water from there. That doesn't sound quite right to me. What is your take on that?

Adam, I take no offense to your comment about someone with a 4 year old intelligence can install an RO unit. I have a 19 months old daughter, who at times seem to outsmart me and I'm at that age where I call myself and old fart and laugh at it. LOL. I feel better knowing that I can install the thing myself so I will add it to my list of things I want to get.

James

 

[Mariner]

A Deep Sand Bed (DSB) needs to be at least 4" Personally, I run shallow sand beds in both my tanks, mainly for looks. It's easy to suck out the sand and replace it when it gets to looking funky. Some people have no sand at all (bare bottom).
You can use dead rock as a base, but IME it will never equal the qaulity of good natural live rock. The greater the percentage of your rock that is natural LR, the better off you'll be, IMO.
You do not need sand in a refugium. Unless your refugium is very large, a DSB will not function properly anyway. The refugium muds and such that are sold online are expensive and of limited value, IMO, although I'm sure someone will chime in to say that they've had great success with them.
HTH,
Mariner

 

[Mariner]

Starting with tapwater is a BAD idea, IMO. It can contain all sorts of things (e.g. copper, heavy metals) that can be absorbed by your LR and remain in your tank. Starting with RO is a little more expensive, but worth it, IMO.
Mariner

 

[dkh0331]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9455945#post9455945 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jnguyen4007
The owner of the LFS said that i need to add the sand and rock then add regular tap-dechlorinated water into the aquarium for a couple of weeks, as things start to die off, I can do my partial water change and gradually add RO water from there. That doesn't sound quite right to me. What is your take on that?

James,
I wouldn't do that. RO/DI from day one.

David

 

[jnguyen4007]

I figure as much. I know that with all rock, I need to cure it first. I have a 35 gal drum that I can use to put the rocks, fill it up with tap water, add conditioner to it to remove chlorine and chloramine, put an airstone into it and a submersible pump and let it cure that way for a few days. Is that the way to do it? Or shall I put everything into the aquarium and fill it up with RO water and go that route?

James

 

[Mariner]

I'd put it all in the aquarium -- in fact, that's what I did when I first started my 75g 4 years ago. Unless the drum is made of food grade plastic, it's probably not suitable. Even when tap water is dechlorinated and conditioned, it can still contain (potentially at least) an incredible amount of heavy metals. Your LR is very "absorbent" and will take up these metals. I know some people use tap water with success, but I also have known some that have had troubles. The only way I'd use even conditioned tap water is if I tested it with a TDS (total dissolved solids) meter first, and the reading was at least below 20-30.
FWIW,
Mariner

 

[Mariner]

Uhhh... to be clear, you need to put the RO water in the aquarium (either mix in the salt right before you put it in or right after). Adjust the water's temp and salinity to appropriate levels and let it all run for at least a few hours BEFORE you put in the LR. If your LR is shipped, you might want to take it out and scrub off the dead and dying things on it using saltwater before putting it in the tank.
HTH,
Mariner

 

[Scuba_Steve]

yes, you only want to do the drum if you are adding more rock to an existing, already cycled reef. And never use tap for anything! Starting new, just put it all in the tank, and watch they cycle begin! Glad to see your not taking advise from the lfs. They dont always have the best knowledge.

 

[Scuba_Steve]

and also to clarify what was said above, never mix saltwater in the tank after your rock is in, always pre mix. Its ok to do with an empty tank, but let it sit with pumps running for more than a few hours to make sure everything is disolved, and you salinity is stable.

 

[dkh0331]

RO/DI for everything, including curing your LR.

If you are getting uncured LR, you may want to cure it in a separate vessel, like a drum if your tank is in a living space. The process will create an very unpleasant aroma (IT STINKS!!).

David

 

[jnguyen4007]

The plastic drum that I'm looking at using is a drum that was used by the pepsi bottling plant. I use the 55 gal one to age my fresh water for my fresh water.

Even if I buy cured LR, there will still be lots of dead critters in it, so I will need to cure it again won't I? From what I gathered, it sounds like for a brand new tank, I need to add sand, then add premix salt and RO water. Add my LR and let it cured for a few days. Is that correct? During this time, do I need to have the protein skimmer running?

 

[Scuba_Steve]

prob more than a few days, the curing process can take up to a few months sometimes. Yes, skim away! When pouring the water in, put a new plastic bowl in the tank to catch the water so you dont start with a sand storm. Not necessary, just a bit of advise. Depending on where you get the rock, will determine how long your cure will take. Online cured rock will have to cure again for a while because stuff will die in shipping, uncured will take longer. Fully cured rock from the lfs will take little time, but that is assuming the rock is fully cured, which it usually isnt. I wouldnt trust rock from a place that told you to cure it in tap anyways, thats what they are surely doing!