20 Gallon Build
- Thread starter skippy23
- Start date
aural
New member
the next step is deciding what you want to keep in the tank. different reef types require different specifications. lighting should be your first thought after you have decided what you are looking to keep in the tank. after that you need to think about your filtration/skimming choices. (to skim or not to skim. THAT is the question) are you looking to use an overflow so that you can sump the system or are you wanting to keep it self contained?
there is MUCH to concider and a lot of it depends on your budget. It can be as simple or as complex as your wallet allows.
there is MUCH to concider and a lot of it depends on your budget. It can be as simple or as complex as your wallet allows.
i am on a bugdet, and honestly i want a nice set up so i have no problem saving up and getting what i want instead of short spending and getting something that kinda well sucks lol, well being this is my first reed i want to keep maybe 2 fish of course a clean up crew, ( snails, sexy shrimp, hermit crabs) and again since this is my first tank some hardy soft corals
so i guess i better get a good filtration system
what do u guys suggest
also what is the pro and con of having a skimmer or not having a skimmer
like i said im a noobie, VERY noobie so be patient i see blonde moments in my future lol
thanks alot
so i guess i better get a good filtration system
what do u guys suggest
also what is the pro and con of having a skimmer or not having a skimmer
like i said im a noobie, VERY noobie so be patient i see blonde moments in my future lol
thanks alot
gfk
New member
get a skimmer.
i didnt have one on my 20h and the water clarity wasnt that great... got a bak pak2 and it was awesome after that.
id get the coral life skimmer that can be hang on, or insump if you decide to go that route later on.
Besides a skimmer, i ahve a hob filter that i run carbon in and use for surface movement.
dont get anything with a bio wheel.
and then youll need a couple powerheads, i have maxi jet 400's but i wish i had 600's in stead
i didnt have one on my 20h and the water clarity wasnt that great... got a bak pak2 and it was awesome after that.
id get the coral life skimmer that can be hang on, or insump if you decide to go that route later on.
Besides a skimmer, i ahve a hob filter that i run carbon in and use for surface movement.
dont get anything with a bio wheel.
and then youll need a couple powerheads, i have maxi jet 400's but i wish i had 600's in stead
dantodd
New member
Since you have said you are looking to go reef I'll try to give you as much info as I can. I usually prefer a 20L for a reef because the light penetrates better. But you can do a lot with a 20R. The first thing you have to know is that you can't run a reef with standard lighting.
If I were you I'd start by ordering (or buying at your lfs) the following:
2 or 3 powerheads. My 20L uses 2 aquaclear 201 powerheads (126 gallon/hour each) plus a very small via aqua to cover a small dead spot. This is plenty for a mixed reef.
If you want to go barebottom and specialize in SPS then you could go with slightly larger powerheads with a hydor.
A small HOB (hang on back) filter for running carbon or other filtration when needed.
Get a 250w or larfer heater too. Always better to go too large rather than too small.
Assuming you aren't going barebottom with all SPS I'd also get a bunch of "sugar fine" grain sand start with 20 pounds and see if that's enough for you.
Next I'd fill the tank with water, sand, the powerheads, heater and filter. Use the biofiltration Then drop in half a raw cocktail shrimp to start the cycle.
Start thinking about the type of lighting you are going to invest in. For my 20L I went with power compacts. You can pick up a powerhorse 7 ballast for less than $40 if you look around. Then build a simple canopy and get the most PC you can under the canopy. I'd avoid Metal Halides at this point as they are really hot and you'll have to manage that heat.
Now, while you are waiting for the tank to fully cycle start looking for rock. For a tank your shape I'd think you would probably want to build a cliff up the back. You can find lots of cool Live rock with zoanthids etc. Put things on hold or just keep looking and planning so that you can acquire them once your tank completes the cycle.
When the tank is fully cycled add the live rock a little at a time. There will likely be some die off on the first couple pieces even if the tank is fully cycled. If the tank is not adequately cycled then you'll have a lot of die off. This is also when you'll have to add your lighting if the live rock has anything like zoanthids on it.
Hope that helps you get started. Post any questions you have, I'm sure you'll get lots of replies.
If I were you I'd start by ordering (or buying at your lfs) the following:
2 or 3 powerheads. My 20L uses 2 aquaclear 201 powerheads (126 gallon/hour each) plus a very small via aqua to cover a small dead spot. This is plenty for a mixed reef.
If you want to go barebottom and specialize in SPS then you could go with slightly larger powerheads with a hydor.
A small HOB (hang on back) filter for running carbon or other filtration when needed.
Get a 250w or larfer heater too. Always better to go too large rather than too small.
Assuming you aren't going barebottom with all SPS I'd also get a bunch of "sugar fine" grain sand start with 20 pounds and see if that's enough for you.
Next I'd fill the tank with water, sand, the powerheads, heater and filter. Use the biofiltration Then drop in half a raw cocktail shrimp to start the cycle.
Start thinking about the type of lighting you are going to invest in. For my 20L I went with power compacts. You can pick up a powerhorse 7 ballast for less than $40 if you look around. Then build a simple canopy and get the most PC you can under the canopy. I'd avoid Metal Halides at this point as they are really hot and you'll have to manage that heat.
Now, while you are waiting for the tank to fully cycle start looking for rock. For a tank your shape I'd think you would probably want to build a cliff up the back. You can find lots of cool Live rock with zoanthids etc. Put things on hold or just keep looking and planning so that you can acquire them once your tank completes the cycle.
When the tank is fully cycled add the live rock a little at a time. There will likely be some die off on the first couple pieces even if the tank is fully cycled. If the tank is not adequately cycled then you'll have a lot of die off. This is also when you'll have to add your lighting if the live rock has anything like zoanthids on it.
Hope that helps you get started. Post any questions you have, I'm sure you'll get lots of replies.
you guys are great, thanks so much
i was actually thinking about doin a fuge for my filtrating, what do u guys think?
i mean would that be the wallet friendly way to go
i want something thats goin to make the tank nice and clear and of course healthy for the fish, but unfortunatelly i cant by the best on the market so i need something thats goin to be really nice but not overly expensive
and the more i look at refugium set ups the more i like em ( really neat IMO)
but im not completely set on going that route
i was actually thinking about doin a fuge for my filtrating, what do u guys think?
i mean would that be the wallet friendly way to go
i want something thats goin to make the tank nice and clear and of course healthy for the fish, but unfortunatelly i cant by the best on the market so i need something thats goin to be really nice but not overly expensive
and the more i look at refugium set ups the more i like em ( really neat IMO)
but im not completely set on going that route
dantodd
New member
Unless you're planning on having your tank drilled you'll need to have an overflow hanging off the back of the tank to feed the refugium.
That being said, you can always drill your tank and then put a 10g refugium under the tank and hang your HOB filter on that, you'll still want the HOB because you will almost certainly want/need the ability to run some form of chemical filtration on occasion. This is more likely to happen early in the set up. So, a refugium can be built fairly inexpensively but it won't save you any money anywhere else.
One other option is to paint the back of the tank (on the outside of course) blue or black and use a bigger HOB filter as your refugium wich will also give you a place to run your chemical filtration when needed. Search on the site for HOB refugium, a lot of people have made them.
That being said, you can always drill your tank and then put a 10g refugium under the tank and hang your HOB filter on that, you'll still want the HOB because you will almost certainly want/need the ability to run some form of chemical filtration on occasion. This is more likely to happen early in the set up. So, a refugium can be built fairly inexpensively but it won't save you any money anywhere else.
One other option is to paint the back of the tank (on the outside of course) blue or black and use a bigger HOB filter as your refugium wich will also give you a place to run your chemical filtration when needed. Search on the site for HOB refugium, a lot of people have made them.
OKAY
what do u guys think, i want to eventually have a mixed reef. (ok possibly a dumb question) im wondering would it be benificial and worth doing a 10 gallon sump, refugium, skimmer combo. and if so i need some step by step DIY directions
as well as equipment suggestions
if u guys know or think of anything better let me know
thanks again
what do u guys think, i want to eventually have a mixed reef. (ok possibly a dumb question) im wondering would it be benificial and worth doing a 10 gallon sump, refugium, skimmer combo. and if so i need some step by step DIY directions
as well as equipment suggestionsif u guys know or think of anything better let me know
thanks again
midknight
New member
Hey Skippy,
2 major benifits of a refugium is ...
1 - Keeps all the extra things out of your main tank
2 - Draning from the main tank help keep the film that builds out and restricks oxagin intake.
Another site with great DIY sumps is this... http://www.melevsreef.com/
I am using his styls on a couple that I am building.
And as for being on a budget just watch for my post I am working on. I am working on fixing up my 33 gallon and my 10 gallon with "left overs". Or ... what to do with a cracked 7 gallon tank.
2 major benifits of a refugium is ...
1 - Keeps all the extra things out of your main tank
2 - Draning from the main tank help keep the film that builds out and restricks oxagin intake.
Another site with great DIY sumps is this... http://www.melevsreef.com/
I am using his styls on a couple that I am building.
And as for being on a budget just watch for my post I am working on. I am working on fixing up my 33 gallon and my 10 gallon with "left overs". Or ... what to do with a cracked 7 gallon tank.
dantodd
New member
Anything that increases your total volume makes for a more stable tank. However; maintaining an overflow does add some maintenance and running any kind of syphon always increases chances of a catastrophic failure. Running a sump is fairly easy, you should be able to pick up a 10gal AGA for less than $10 and a decent overflow will run you about $70. Of course you could always drill the tank and then build your own overflow for around $10 in parts etc.
I would probably not bother for a 20. If you want most of the advantages consider the following.
Paint the back of the tank to hide a HOB skimmer and use a canister filter as a refugium. You can search here for details on modifying a canister filter to hold an LED light for macro growth and even retrofit your heater into the unit. I believe that the person who did this also left the top tray of the canister open for chemical filtration duties so you could do away with the HOB filter in favor of the skimmer. I have a seaclone and a nano fission. I wouldn't recommend either of these. I've heard great things about the Coralife Super Skimmer (often called CSS on the forums) and would probably get one of those if I were in your shoes. A skimmer can usually wait until your tank is stocked with fish though.
The first thing to do is get your tank cycling. The longer it has to cycle with just a heater, sand and circulation the more stable it will be when you add Live Rock (LR) cleaner crew etc.
I would probably not bother for a 20. If you want most of the advantages consider the following.
Paint the back of the tank to hide a HOB skimmer and use a canister filter as a refugium. You can search here for details on modifying a canister filter to hold an LED light for macro growth and even retrofit your heater into the unit. I believe that the person who did this also left the top tray of the canister open for chemical filtration duties so you could do away with the HOB filter in favor of the skimmer. I have a seaclone and a nano fission. I wouldn't recommend either of these. I've heard great things about the Coralife Super Skimmer (often called CSS on the forums) and would probably get one of those if I were in your shoes. A skimmer can usually wait until your tank is stocked with fish though.
The first thing to do is get your tank cycling. The longer it has to cycle with just a heater, sand and circulation the more stable it will be when you add Live Rock (LR) cleaner crew etc.
aural
New member
i'd use 20 lbs.
did you paint the back of your tank yet? you definitely want to. once you get it wet you are left with using a plastic backing... paint is so much better. do yourself a favor and go to home depot and pick up some black krylon spraypaint and black out the back. it makes all the difference in the world.
did you paint the back of your tank yet? you definitely want to. once you get it wet you are left with using a plastic backing... paint is so much better. do yourself a favor and go to home depot and pick up some black krylon spraypaint and black out the back. it makes all the difference in the world.
annetate
Premium Member
id suggest putting the rock in now instead of waiting.. let it cycle with the tank, it will help speed up the whole process and you should be able to add stuff within a month or so. did you ever tell us what lighting you have? let us know what steps you have taken so we can help you more.. i.e. did you drill? ect.
dantodd
New member
Congrats skippy.
If you choose to put in live rock before your cycle completes be sure to NOT get fully cured live rock. Lots of the good stuff will take a big hit with a lot of die off and that of course would defeat the purpose of spending lots of money on cured live rock.
The only other time I'd recommend cycling your tank with the LR in it is if you are mail ordering your LR, you'll have considerable die off during shipping and it WILL set your cycle back a couple weeks if you add it later so many will go ahead and cycle with the LR in. Of course, it does mean there will be further die off but it will save you a couple weeks of waiting for the mini-cycle to complete. It all depends on your priorities, getting the most out of the LR or minimizing the cycle time.
If you choose to put in live rock before your cycle completes be sure to NOT get fully cured live rock. Lots of the good stuff will take a big hit with a lot of die off and that of course would defeat the purpose of spending lots of money on cured live rock.
The only other time I'd recommend cycling your tank with the LR in it is if you are mail ordering your LR, you'll have considerable die off during shipping and it WILL set your cycle back a couple weeks if you add it later so many will go ahead and cycle with the LR in. Of course, it does mean there will be further die off but it will save you a couple weeks of waiting for the mini-cycle to complete. It all depends on your priorities, getting the most out of the LR or minimizing the cycle time.
heres my step by step thus far
**NOTE** everything ive dun has been explicit to the instructions given by LFS (which im starting to doubt)
bought me tank
yay!
few days later i went and picked up
sand
salt (*instant ocean)
hydrometer (*instant ocean)
protien skimmer (*Sea Clone 100)
another form of filtration (*fluval 3plus [underwater filter])
**i also bought carbon filter pads for this filter**
brand new buckets
(thanks to dollar general kick *** place might i add)
areator (small pump, line, and air stone)
mag-float
NovAqua+Plus water conditioner
new light bulb (reef*sun 50/50)
and i think that was it
after i got home with all that I.............
1ST poured some water (duh) i put my water conditioner in and put my little pump and air stone in and let it set over nite (16-18hrs) i put my sand in and then checked the salinity of my salt, it was on target so i though the sand and water in and waited a day or two till the water calmed down and then hooked my skimmer and underwater filter i had to go away for a day so it was just left alone doin its thing for a day when i got back it was beautiful, crystal clear and awsome.
im now sitting infront of it on my lab top writing to you guys confused and upset
my LFS told me i didnt need to put any LR in yet and after it cleared up to come back and get some thats already cured (he has LR thats cured and has some mushrooms and a clam 2 fish in with it) he said in a couple days i could just get a couple pounds drop it in and in another week drop in some fish, and told me to wait on clean up crew (im very confused and very upset) ive been doin some reading on here for the last 4 months i wanted a SW tank for a while and decided to take the plunge. i want to take things slow and do everything exact cause i dont want to screw anything up (i just want a beautiful healthy tank) and honestly after hearing some of what your all telling me im starting to think he just wants my money
my skimmer isnt really workin out for me either its throwin a massive amount of bubbles
the reason im so upset is ive dumped like $700 in this and i dont know if im gettn bad advice (LFS) and just wasting my money and honestly im a college student i dont really have money to throw away
anyway this sucks
if u guys just read all that thank you so much and any advice is GREATLY appreciated
(sorry for the complaining)
**NOTE** everything ive dun has been explicit to the instructions given by LFS (which im starting to doubt)
bought me tank
yay!few days later i went and picked up
sand
salt (*instant ocean)
hydrometer (*instant ocean)
protien skimmer (*Sea Clone 100)
another form of filtration (*fluval 3plus [underwater filter])
**i also bought carbon filter pads for this filter**
brand new buckets
(thanks to dollar general
kick *** place might i add)areator (small pump, line, and air stone)
mag-float
NovAqua+Plus water conditioner
new light bulb (reef*sun 50/50)
and i think that was it
after i got home with all that I.............
1ST poured some water (duh) i put my water conditioner in and put my little pump and air stone in and let it set over nite (16-18hrs) i put my sand in and then checked the salinity of my salt, it was on target so i though the sand and water in and waited a day or two till the water calmed down and then hooked my skimmer and underwater filter i had to go away for a day so it was just left alone doin its thing for a day when i got back it was beautiful, crystal clear and awsome.
im now sitting infront of it on my lab top writing to you guys confused and upset
my LFS told me i didnt need to put any LR in yet and after it cleared up to come back and get some thats already cured (he has LR thats cured and has some mushrooms and a clam 2 fish in with it) he said in a couple days i could just get a couple pounds drop it in and in another week drop in some fish, and told me to wait on clean up crew (im very confused and very upset) ive been doin some reading on here for the last 4 months i wanted a SW tank for a while and decided to take the plunge. i want to take things slow and do everything exact cause i dont want to screw anything up (i just want a beautiful healthy tank) and honestly after hearing some of what your all telling me im starting to think he just wants my money
my skimmer isnt really workin out for me either its throwin a massive amount of bubbles
the reason im so upset is ive dumped like $700 in this and i dont know if im gettn bad advice (LFS) and just wasting my money and honestly im a college student i dont really have money to throw away
anyway this sucks
if u guys just read all that thank you so much and any advice is GREATLY appreciated
(sorry for the complaining)
annetate
Premium Member
where do you go to college? Id read some books and do more research on here. Unfortunately a lot of LFS employees are retarded ppl and will give you advise that they dont themselves know about. Thats why I say. research before you buy. Ive learned my lesson the hard way and do my part to help prevent ppl from making my mistakes. You have the right attitude but don't listen to some of the LFS ppl. I know there are good ppl that work there but then again.. they are trying to get your money so they may tell you something that isnt right just to sell you something.. we arent!
