ACK! My Xenia are crashing! (pics)

[Fishdisease]

Hey Everyone.

Ok. So I woke up this morning the xenia looked a bit wilted, came home from work and half of them are definitely dead! The only thing that changed last night was that I did a tiny bit a reaquascaping (and the xenia were not touched) and I increased the flow by turning up a powerhead. Everything else looks very happy, more so then usual, which I lend to the increase in flow. Damn, I thought I was ready for xenia! It seams that only certain stalks are dying, the rest are looking normal.

Oh, and the xenia have been in my tank for 2 weeks and the tank has been up for about 3 months now and this is my first real problem.

Here are my conditions.

Temp: 81F
Salinity: 1.026
pH: 7.9
Ammonia: 0.3 mg/L (I assume this is up due to the rotting animals)
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 0
Phosphate: 0.25 mg/L
KH: 2.2 meq/L (110 ppm)

Heres what I've done / doing:

I'm doing a 15% water change
I've removed the dead tissue
I've sacrificed to the salt water gods
I've panicked profusely

heres the pic:

 

[jer77]

Has you pH gone down at all? 7.9 is a little low, especially for xenia which tend to like it rather high. Have you changed anything else? 2.2 meq/L alk is a little low too. What is your Ca?

 

[Fishdisease]

My pH and Alk have been steady since I got the xenia (and well before then too), I'm trying to bring up both but I think I need to invest in a 2-part as the SeaChem reef builder powder I'm using isnt helping at all.

I havent been testing calcium so I dont know.

 

[ahullsb]

I would look at your ph and your phos. I've never had traces of phosphate and my ph is stable at 8 .2 now because I use buffer. I used to have ph swings ranging from 8.4-7.8 over a 24 hour period before I decided I needed to use it.

 

[Fishdisease]

Cool, advice taken.

I have to switch to a 2-part cause i dont think the SeaChem Reef Builder I'm using is doing the trick.

random question: so would the xenia just up and crash afer 2 weeks of being healthy? I mean it could have been suffering for the last while and the aquascaping could have been "the last straw", but I tend t thin kit would've shown signs before this. Or would it look ok till that point of no return?

 

[Frick-n-Frags]

If xenia doesn't like the water it will crash, so yeah, it can just crash after 2 weeks of "appearing" healthy.
that tank is basically brand new, so the possibility of the water not being to taste is very good.

Everyone says xenia is so easy as a first coral. They are not correct in all cases. Yes, if the xenia likes the water, it grows retardedly fast. If it doesn't like the water, it limps along for a while then melts away. Anthelia is like that also.
If your biology isn't set the way the xenia likes it, nothing you add is going to change that.
This is where you sit back for 6 months, then try again if it just withers away to nothing.

lather, rinse, repeat as necessary.

 

[Icefire]

Mine looked dead overnight but after a few days, it's begining to cheer up.

When new

Almost dead

 

[jer77]

I'd suggest getting a calcium test, and then start adding a 2-part additive or even kalkwasser. Kalk will raise you Ca and raise pH a little if added slowly, plus it stabilizes alk. It also binds with phosphates and precipitates them out of solution. This will help to lower your phosphates.

 

[Fishdisease]

Another day another round of death

half of the remaining half are gone now...sigh...so sad.

 

[Frick-n-Frags]

been there. also, try different types. I never could get that silverback stuff like in the picture there to grow. I get some free at the end of a swap now and then, and it always fades away.
BUT, the pink pom-pom is unstoppable for me, so maybe try a few out.

 

[returnofsid]

I had one that recently did the same thing. Over a period of a couple days, it went from very healthy to melting and looking like pus!! It only happened to one though. Never did figure out what caused it. Hope you're able to get it back!!

 

[Fishdisease]

Thanks. I'll be doing another water change tonight when I get home (just another 15%) Yeah, everything else is doing great, cept my xenia, and I loved my xenia.

And I'll be sacrificing a plastic plant to the aquarium gods as well.

 

[Chrsnwk]

I've been keeping red sea xenia and for me it always grows like a weed, but here's the thing.... they don't like pristine water. They like it a little dirty. There are alot of people, myself included, that use xenia instead of cheato or calurpa for nutrient export as they thrive on the very things you are stripping from your water with your water changes. Do you have fish? Fish poop is a good thing sometimes.

I don't know where in ontario you are, but if it's southern near the Buffalo area, I'll gladly share a few sprigs of mine with you if yours completely crashes. Do continue to remove dead tissue as you can, but stop tweaking your water chemistry. the ocean we are trying to emulate is all about stability, and big changes in short timeframes are not only unnatural, in my opinion are bad for the system. Ph, Ca, Alk all shoud be adjusted over the course of days, if not weeks.

Nothing good ever happens quickly in a reef tank, but everything can co to hell overnight. there are no quick fixes, and when you take drastic measures, the outcome is rarely (in my experience never) good.

Good Luck!!!

 

[cartouche]

When I trim my xenia and dispose of it (the lfs don't want it) its stinks like amonia in about 5 minutes.... I would say if its dying then get rid, I'd hate to think what its doing to your water.

 

[Fishdisease]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9434404#post9434404 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Chrsnwk
I've been keeping red sea xenia and for me it always grows like a weed, but here's the thing.... they don't like pristine water.

.......

Good Luck!!!

Thanks for the advice. Perhaps I'll skip the water change tonight.

I do have some fish. I have 2 small false percs. I also have a few shrimp (2 peppermint shrimp and 2 cleaner) and a pink cucumber (but he cleans the water more then he dirties it).

I live about 3 hours from Buffalo but I do have a few good friends in Buffalo that I visit on a regular basis. I'll actually be down there on the 22nd-23rd of this month (for the Blue Men Group). So maybe I'll take you up on the offer!. Thanks!

Dave

 

[Chrsnwk]

that's not a very big bio load for your tank, and you had alot of xenia. it's possible that the xenia you originally added to nutrient rich water flourished and spread, only to exceed the capacity of their home to sustain them, only to die back. eventually an equilibrium is reached.

 

[Fishdisease]

So just to update the thread if any newbie can ever seach for it!

It's been almost a full week and the remaining xenia are fine *knock on wood*. I only lost one or two more stalks from what is pictured above. I talked to a few local reefers and the current theory is that when I reaquscaped I stressed out some shrooms which in turn slimed up, and some of that slime got tangled in the xenia and caused the death (toxins I guess).

I've since increased my flow and they like it. I've already noticed a few really tiny xenia starting and 2 of the bigger stalks are splitting, so it must be happy again. I've also started testing my calcium and thats fine too. Next time I'm in Toronto I'm going to pick up a 2-part cal-alk treatment to help with my pH and Alk. But I think I'm fine right now.

I guess what I've learned from this is to be careful aquascaping and although the xenia might be completed deflated and looking ill, patience is a virtue.

Thanks for the help!

 

[Sygnath&Elasmos]

Okay first thing are you adding any iodine and magnesium? I have seen huge colonies die off and once those two have been dosed they turn around nicely. Get the pH back to 8.2 - 8.3 and bring the salt back to the reasonable level of 1.023. Dosing for pH, doing the water change to correct the salinity, dosing iodine, mag and calcium will all help fix you alkalinity. As for you phosphate it has to go, they dirty water that works best for them has no phosphate and a nitrate level usually around 40. I don't mean to sound harsh and uber athorative but I am just pressed for time so please don't take this the wrong way or as the only thing that will work it is just a suggestion from someone who used to grow this stuff and sell to local LFS's.

 

[CoralFiend]

If you are going to dose iodine or magnesium (or anything else for that matter) I would suggest you get a test kit first to see what your levels actually are. You could be doing more harm than good without knowing what your levels are to begin with.

I have kept xenia of different types for years. Sometimes it just crashes. I have had colonies of xenia crash and only inches away other colonies thrive and are completely unaffected.

 

[Fishdisease]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9478783#post9478783 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Sygnath&Elasmos
Okay first thing are you adding any iodine and magnesium? I have seen huge colonies die off and once those two have been dosed they turn around nicely. Get the pH back to 8.2 - 8.3 and bring the salt back to the reasonable level of 1.023. Dosing for pH, doing the water change to correct the salinity, dosing iodine, mag and calcium will all help fix you alkalinity. As for you phosphate it has to go, they dirty water that works best for them has no phosphate and a nitrate level usually around 40. I don't mean to sound harsh and uber athorative but I am just pressed for time so please don't take this the wrong way or as the only thing that will work it is just a suggestion from someone who used to grow this stuff and sell to local LFS's.

Thanks for the advice. I think I will test before I start dosing anymore nutrients but I'll look into it. As far as the salinity I have always read, and its been posted here several times, that seawater has a natural salinity of 1.0264. Why do you suggest a lower then recommended salinity? Is that something that you have found works better with xenia?