Another I suck at SPS post...

SLove1104

SLove1104

New member
I've read a lot on lighting and SPS but I wanted everyone's opinions on my particular set-up.

I have a 60g that's about 5 months old, but was an immediate cycle as most of the water and all the LR and LS were from established tanks.

Zero amonia, trites and trates, but a bit of phosphates... I think it's like 1.5-2... I also have a bit of algae but I think it's because I need to up my CUC... Calcium is well above 450 and alk was 12 last time I checked...

Anyway, I'm running a CPR bakpak, and two Rio powerheads (soon to be replaced by Tunze) and one 400w MH 15k Hamilton...

Here comes the question. I have a 60 gallon long tank... meaning the depth is pretty shallow, at 18". Knowing I was going to use a 400w MH and not wanting to fry my corals, I allowed quite a bit of space above the tank... and placed the MH approximately 20" above the water line. Just getting into SPS, I'm unsure where to place them, but have usually placed them close to the bottom at first, and work them up in time. The thing is, I'm getting tissue recession in my SPS, and browing in a few as well... I'm not sure if the browning is caused by too much, or too little light??? And what about the recession...? I've had one frag completely gone, and a couple are slowly receding now... I have Monti caps that are still full of color and growing well, but acros are barely growing.

In three months, I've seen no growth at all in my Milli, a hydnophora, and a couple other acros... I've also had a few beautiful (forgot the names) acro frags that have browned out...

I guess my question is, what am I doing wrong? I assumed with a 400w MH, I should have better luck with SPS... is my placement wrong? Is it too high, should I lower it? Or am I actually providing TOO MUCH light? Most SPSes are mid tank...

My tank is mixed reef and all my softies and LPSes are doing great and growing well...

I even switched from 20k Radiums to a lower spectrum to see if I can get better growth in SPS and nada... I dose Lugol's and feed PE Mysis and a homemade mix daily... I maaaaay have an overfeeding problem... :) Can this be part of the problem?

Would dosing anything else help? I think I'm getting the color thing under control as when I started with the Lugol's a couple weeks ago, I started seeing colors brighten up on some of my browned zoas... So I'm mostly concerned about SPS growth...

Oh, and can not enough flow be a problem too? I'm planning to replace my PHs soon...
 
what is the make of your test kits? I think an alkalinity reading of 12 is a bit high and correcting this should be your first priority. I've always had problems when my alkalinity shoots too high. What are your phosphate readings? Most test phosphate kits will only go as low as 0.03 ppm which is actually pretty high for many sps.

Getting the tunzes will definitely help as you probably need more flow. Also I would look into changing your skimmer out as I don't think it will pull enough out of the water for a 60 or sps corals for that matter.
 
I'm using cheap ole API... Thanks, I'll get to lowering my alk asap...

As for the skimmer, I have the model that's up to 60g and also have it modded with an Accela pump... should be sufficient right? Had a lot of skimmate in the first week when I put it in last month, but it's toning down now...
 
Don't change anything abruptly. Just slow down calcium-alk additions until you can get a firmer grasp on managing these parameters. They will go down over time. Also, don't correct pH problems with buffers. What salt mix are you using? The reason I ask is a few of them tend to be high in alkalinity.

What temperature is your tank? Does it fluctuate much over the course of the day? What is your salinity and how are you measuring it?

I would probably phase out the api kits.
 
I'm not adding any calcium... Nor am I using any buffers. I'm using premixed H2Ocean water from my LFS.

My temps are 78 and no it does not fluctuate at all. I was worried about it doing so because of the 400w MH but it's high enough over the tank, and also only on for 7 hours... That brings me to ask, could this have to do with slow growth? I hear mixed opinions on photoperiod... Some say they get better growth with longer hours, and some say with shorter hours... I have it on 7 really just to save electricity since no one's around to enjoy the tank most of the day. I have it turning on at 2pm and off at 9pm with actinics before and after... Should I lengthen the photoperiod?

My salinity is 1.025-6... a bit on the high end. I'm measuring it with a floating meter...
 
the_rider said:
How about your nitrate level and magnesium level ?
Click to expand...

Nitrates are at zero. But then of course, it's possible since I have algae that they're not registering because of the algae. I don't test for mag myself, but get it tested at my LFS and last I checked like 3 weeks ago it was fine. I forgot the reading but it was good.
 
SLove1104 said:
Zero amonia, trites and trates, but a bit of phosphates... I think it's like 1.5-2... I also have a bit of algae but I think it's because I need to up my CUC... Calcium is well above 450 and alk was 12last time I checked...
From the statement above, it tells me that you don't test often and not sure about your water chemistry. For a successful SPS tank, testing regularly is a must. Good luck.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
SPS_77493 said:
From the statement above, it tells me that you don't test often and not sure about your water chemistry. For a successful SPS tank, testing regularly is a must. Good luck.
Click to expand...

In the beginning I tested weekly, but as time went on and I kept getting the same readings anyway, I dropped it down to about every 3-4 weeks. I do nitites, nitrates, alk and calcium at home, but take my water in to get the other readings at my LFS and also to confirm my readings of those four.

The only problem I've had consistently is the phosphate problem, and I'm upping my WC for that reason. I also had the opposite problem with my ca, as I was actually HIGH on calcium for a while... Mystery to me and my guy at my LFS as we have no idea where my calcium was coming from. My calcium is fine now though.

You're right though... I think I have to test more and actually pick up a better test kit... Any helpful thoughts though considering the info you do have from this post?
 
If you're testing the salinity with a hydrometer I would recommend a refractometer. I had similar problems when I first started sps. Turns out my reading of 1.026 on the hydrometer was way off. It was really 1.034 when tested with a refractometer. That was also keeping my calcium really high which was weird to me because I wasn't dosing anything. The hypersalinity was doing it
 
shaggy14 said:
If you're testing the salinity with a hydrometer I would recommend a refractometer. I had similar problems when I first started sps. Turns out my reading of 1.026 on the hydrometer was way off. It was really 1.034 when tested with a refractometer. That was also keeping my calcium really high which was weird to me because I wasn't dosing anything. The hypersalinity was doing it
Click to expand...

Wow, thanks. I'll give that a shot... Off to find a refractometer then... Thanks. :)
 
SPS_77493 said:
From the statement above, it tells me that you don't test often and not sure about your water chemistry. For a successful SPS tank, testing regularly is a must. Good luck.
Click to expand...

I disagree with the above statement COMPLETELY! Once you have a FIRM grasp on your tanks needs and consumption rate, there is no need to perfom continual rounds of testing. Once you get in the 'sweet zone', you'll just notice differences in your tank and those will be your cues. If you miss these cues, that's when it can be problematic.

Some may disagree with me, but myself and others on RC may only test 1-2 times a month and have had success managing their Ca-dKh-Mg levels with no problems.

I do agree with where SPS_77493 was going with this but not the statement of how often. Until you get to this point of knowing your tank, I would suggest weekly monitoring of these parameters. Once you can 'call' what your measurement will be before even physically testing just by recalling what has been dosed, then testing can occur less often. Also, I would consider buying your own Mg, Ca, dKh, NO3 & PO4 tests so you don't have rely on someone else's ability to accurately test.

As for your questions, sps placement is different in every tank. I probably 'float' a frag around the tank for 2-3 months before I find the best coloration from my lighting. As for lighting perferences, they are truly a personal preference. The higher Kelvin you go usually equates to some wicked colors, but with slower growth. The lower Kelvin rating results in faster growth, but blah colors if not supplemented with actinic. I have run 20K and truly prefer 12k for growth reasons. Unfortunately, lighting is not a simple matter of answering what is the 'BEST' bulb. Everyone seems to have differing experiences and opinions and IME Reeflux 12k bulbs have yielded phenomenal growth, but a few corals have become drab. Experimentation is the key with lighting I feel.

JMHO
 
+1 Invest in a refractometer.
How do you top off your evaporated water?
Invest in your own Ro/DI unit. I used to get my water from the LFS and they only kept it at 1.023 and it was only RO water not DI, I spent alot of money on many gallons of water, to and fro the LFS and I now cannot live with a reef without my RO/DI that I use practically everyday.
 
I would also recommend making your own seawater. Maybe the source of your problem is in the mix you get from the LFS.
 
Lyfey said:
+1 Invest in a refractometer.
How do you top off your evaporated water?
Invest in your own Ro/DI unit. I used to get my water from the LFS and they only kept it at 1.023 and it was only RO water not DI, I spent alot of money on many gallons of water, to and fro the LFS and I now cannot live with a reef without my RO/DI that I use practically everyday.
Click to expand...

I top off pretty much daily. I'm sumpless, so I just pour the premixed water in slowly as to not cause a rapid change in anything nor a temp change. I would get a unit, but at the moment I live in someone else's house and they don't approve of me installing one.
 
Sig45 said:
I would also recommend making your own seawater. Maybe the source of your problem is in the mix you get from the LFS.
Click to expand...

I've tested the water from my LFS and it's exactly the specs specified for D&D... I'm blessed to have a cool LFS...
 
SLove1104 said:
I top off pretty much daily. I'm sumpless, so I just pour the premixed water in slowly as to not cause a rapid change in anything nor a temp change. I would get a unit, but at the moment I live in someone else's house and they don't approve of me installing one.
Click to expand...

What do you mean by premixed top off water? Are you mixing something with your top off?
 
DeathWish302 said:
I disagree with the above statement COMPLETELY! Once you have a FIRM grasp on your tanks needs and consumption rate, there is no need to perfom continual rounds of testing. Once you get in the 'sweet zone', you'll just notice differences in your tank and those will be your cues. If you miss these cues, that's when it can be problematic.

Some may disagree with me, but myself and others on RC may only test 1-2 times a month and have had success managing their Ca-dKh-Mg levels with no problems.

I do agree with where SPS_77493 was going with this but not the statement of how often. Until you get to this point of knowing your tank, I would suggest weekly monitoring of these parameters. Once you can 'call' what your measurement will be before even physically testing just by recalling what has been dosed, then testing can occur less often. Also, I would consider buying your own Mg, Ca, dKh, NO3 & PO4 tests so you don't have rely on someone else's ability to accurately test.

As for your questions, sps placement is different in every tank. I probably 'float' a frag around the tank for 2-3 months before I find the best coloration from my lighting. As for lighting perferences, they are truly a personal preference. The higher Kelvin you go usually equates to some wicked colors, but with slower growth. The lower Kelvin rating results in faster growth, but blah colors if not supplemented with actinic. I have run 20K and truly prefer 12k for growth reasons. Unfortunately, lighting is not a simple matter of answering what is the 'BEST' bulb. Everyone seems to have differing experiences and opinions and IME Reeflux 12k bulbs have yielded phenomenal growth, but a few corals have become drab. Experimentation is the key with lighting I feel.

JMHO
Click to expand...

+1 sound advice.
 
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