Batteries draining on 580 EX ii

[Recty]

I just dont know much about flashes so I hope someone here does

I bought a 580ex II the other day and have been using it quite a bit. I bought two sets of 4 NiMH AA batteries, one set is 2500 mAh and the other is 2700 mAh. Both are Sony brand.

My brother has borrowed my camera twice since I bought the flash. The first time I got it back from him, I was taking fish pictures and was able to get 4 shots where the flash fired and then was out of batteries. I figured he simply used the flash a lot that weekend. I asked him about it later and he didnt even know it was in the bag. So that was odd, it basically took about 50 photos at normal average power settings and was done.

Two weekends later, he borrows it again. This time I had been using the flash probably 20-30 times and then hadnt used it for almost a week. When he went to use it, it fired once or twice then wouldnt anymore.

So... do I have bad batteries? Or is the flash somehow staying charged? I havent done anything to discharge the flash after my last shot, so is it somehow slowly sucking power to keep something in there charged up? Do I need to discharge it? I've been turning the switch to Off but that's it.

Any ideas would be great... at this point I'm thinking it's bad batteries and I'll just return them to Amazon.

 

[TitusvileSurfer]

That sounds like an over-dramatic battery drain. What the problem is exactly, I have no idea. That isn't normal though.

 

[Recty]

I went ahead and arranged a return to Amazon, I agree that something isnt right. I'll just buy some normal AA batteries and if those have the same problem, I'm sending the flash back, but I really think it was battery related not flash related.

 

[BlueCorn]

The problem with the rechargeable is that they're only 1.2 volts. The lower voltage means that the flash pulls more current, draining them faster.

 

[Recty]

Ah, I see. I thought the mAh rating was basically the capacity of the battery, I didnt realize voltage would also apply to battery life? I'm still not sure how that works I guess, I thought the volts basically determined how much energy it can output at a time, not how much life it has.


Regardless, they seem to be draining while not being used for a week, it doesnt seem to just be that they get drained fast while in use.

The last set only lasted about 30 shots, which is horrible and I've got it dialed back a full stop so it should be lasting much longer than that I would think.

So do you recommend using non rechargeable batteries for a flash unit? I dont mind doing that, I just figured the rechargeables were more convenient.

 

[BlueCorn]

Amps = voltage/resistance.

If you lower the voltage and the resistance stays the same, the amperage goes up. I've had much better luck with alkaline batteries. It's wasteful but there really isn't any practical way around it.

 

[Jacob D]

20-30 pops is not right, even using lower capacity rechargeable batteries (e.g. Eneloops). You should be getting 60-70 *full power* pops before the recycle time starts to lag a little. With 2700 mah batts you should be able to get 120 full power pops, although the recycle time might be pretty slow after 100~110 (my experience with 580ex II and Sanyo 2700 mah batts).

Hopefully the next flash (or batteries? which did you return?) will be a winner. Make sure that you turn it off when you put it away - especially if you have the auto sleep disabled (that has bit me a few times). Get a LaCrosse charger and after every session with your flash pull the batteries and put em in the charger and set it to discharge, then put a fresh set in the flash. It will completely discharge the batteries then automatically recharges them to full capacity. This keeps the batteries from losing capacity over time by being charged without having been fully discharged.

If your batteries are suspect the LaCrosse also has a refresh feature where it attempts to restore the battery capacity to it's original spec.



Also for your reference:
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=712423

 

[Recty]

Alright, thanks for the input guys.

Yeah, I just returned the batteries, not the flash, I really dont feel it's the flash at fault.

I'll try non rechargeable batteries and see how that does. I wasnt doing full power flash, so I'm really surprised how poor the battery life was. And yes, I was very careful to turn the flash off the last time before it failed since I thought maybe I had left it on the first time is why the battery life seemed so poor.

Anyone know if on the 580EX ii there is a way to tell how much battery life is left?

Thanks for the link btw, I'm reading through it right now, sounds like that guy is experiencing exactly what I am.

 

[Recty]

Hmmm, well after fully reading that link I dont think my batteries are at fault, it sounds like a lot of people are experiencing this issue.

I'm not sure I feel right sending back batteries to Amazon if they are working fine and the flash just uses more power than I had figured, so I guess I'll be keeping the batteries. No reason Amazon should lose money on this one

So it sounds like I need to keep a set of batteries on the charger and fully charged and just swap to those when I'm going to use the flash, then when I'm done take the batteries out and charge again.

Do they make a LiPo battery pack that works with a 580EX ii? That would be nice.

 

[Jacob D]

You should send the flash into Canon USA since it will be covered by warranty (if purchased new and not grey market).

or your batteries are no good (easy to check)

What you (and the guy/s on that thread) are experiencing with the flash is NOT normal, re-read my previous post again if that point was missed.

 

[Recty]

Yeah, I purchased it new on Amazon.

Well you say what I'm experiencing with the flash isnt normal, but in the other thread you linked to quite a few people are experiencing the same problem. IIRC, the guy who sent it in to Canon got it back with some parts fixed but it still has the same behavior? I'll have to re-read the thread again, I'd rather not send the flash in to Canon if I dont have to.

 

[Jacob D]

20-50 pops at "normal power" (do you mean something less than 1/1 ?) is not right.



Either your batteries are the issue or the flash is. The OP from the linked thread stated:

"I got my flash back today, it only said "the part was replaced" and some electrical adjustments, calibration, and cleaning. I gave them a call and they said they had to replace the battery compartment and flash head as they both were malfunctioning."


That is not normal man!

 

[Recty]

Right, I agree with you there, but I thought I read somewhere that even after the changes, the flash behavior is the same? Or did he state that it fixed the issue? Sorry, I'm at work now and dont have time to reread the other thread.

 

[chicken]

I had the same problem when I bought my 580 EX II also. Was using NiMH rechargeables and getting so little flashes out of it. A friend of mine who is a semi pro photog said to buy the Energizer Lithium AA batteries. I put those in 6 months ago and still use the thing today. Atleast 300+ shots on it and still going. I doubt your flash is the problem. Its the voltage just as beerguy said.

 

[Dino]

Can you do some tests for us? Sounds like you still have the batteries, charge them completely and set the flash up on manual 1/1 power and pop it once every 10 seconds or so (taking breaks if it get hot of course, to pop it just press the pilot button) and record how many full power pops you can get with it before it starts lagging and how many after it starts lagging and is completely dead. If you have a set of batteries that haven't been used much and have been sitting in the flash for a week or so - even better.

Regardless of battery you should be getting better than 50 pops at full power.

 

[Recty]

I already packaged them all up and it's sitting at my work's pickup area, sorry, I wont be doing any testing with these batteries.

I read through the manual a little bit last night and it stated that lipo batteries could be used, I was thinking about doing that, it should help I would think although I admit I dont know tons about batteries.

LiPo can charge quick and holds a charge very well, so that should be nice.

 

[Jacob D]

Since I had never officially tested this I decided to give it a whirl...

Flash: Canon 580ex II
Batteries: (4) Eneloop 2000 mAh fully discharged and recharged by LaCrosse charger. * batteries are approx 9 months old
Power Setting: 1/1 (set by manual "M" mode)

Recycle time on shots 1-10: ~ 1 sec
Recycle time on shots 11-75: ~ 2 sec
Recycle time on shots 76-80: ~ 4 sec

-- Removed batteries let them cool at room temp for ~ 10 minutes then put them back in ---

Recycle time on shots 81-110: ~ 3 sec
Recycle time on shots 111-120: ~ 4 sec


There is plenty of juice left in the batteries although my flash head is getting warm and I don't want to test the thermal protection today. Hopefully you get the idea from this.

 

[Recty]

Sounds good. I think I'll end up just buying the Eneloop AA batteries, that seems to be what most people recommend.

That LaCrosse charger... is that something you ordered special or is that the charger that comes with the Eneloop battery/charger package?

Edit - Nevermind, I just did a quick search on Amazon and see it's a separate item. Interestingly, I also found some 1.6v rechargable AA NiMH batteries, which might be nice.

 

[Jacob D]

The batteries you have now should perform better than the Eneloops.

Another nice feature of the LaCrosse - it will tell you if a battery is bad.

 

[Recty]

Why would they perform better? Just because the mAh is higher?