Beginner to Saltwater Aquariums. Need advice.

[PittsburghAqua]

Hey everyone!! I'm not new to aquariums (I owned a 55g planted freshwater tank that one day sprang a terrible leak and I ended up selling it, and currently own a 20g freshwater non-planted tank), but am new to Saltwater/Reef aquariums.

I would like to "convert" my freshwater tank into a saltwater tank. My tank is a 20-gallon tank.

While I'd love to go bigger, and I know that bigger tanks are easier to maintain I don't have the space for bigger. The largest I could possibly go right now is a 30-gallon, and I haven't measured the height in my room to determine if this is possible.

Here are some of the things that I do know about my planned setup (If I am wrong on any of these please correct me!):

-I want to run a FOWLR setup that will down the road be upgraded to a full reef system
-My primary fish is going to be the Clownfish, but I am unsure of which species of clownfish. When I eventually upgrade the lighting, I will like to have bubble-tip anemones in the tank.
-I'll need about 600 GPH flow rate.
-I'll need at least 20lb live rock
-I need to get a good master test kit. Will be going with the API Master SW kit
-I'm not going to worry about a protein skimmer at first, unless I start to see problems with the water
-My RO/DI water will be bought from my LFS

So far I have:

-20g Aquarium
-Hagen AuqaClear 70 HOB Filter (flow rate of 300 GPH)
-Profile PH-601 Powerhead. I'm not sure if this is advised to be used as I have no idea on it's flow rate or quality...
-Day/Night timer for lights
-approx. 20 gallon sump with bio balls (It says on it A-Miracle if that helps with the name brand of the sump. it does have dividers in it)
-Submersible heater.
-Thermometer

Things I know I'll need
-Plumbing to the sump
-Plan for the plumbing

So I'm pretty much looking for advice on this setup. Is there anything you'd like to add/comment on. I just want to make sure I'm doing this right.. I've never ran a saltwater tank and just need to know I'm going about this the right way.

Well thanks for reading!! Hope to hear back from you guys soon!!!

 

[FTDelta]

Why not buy a used RO/DI unit on craiglist or ebay? It'll save you money in the long run.

 

[Zimmer]

HI! :wavehand: from personal experience i've been very unsatisfied with API test kits. after wondering and wondering why my levels weren't making sense for where the tank was in the cycle, i took a sample to LFS guy and man he isn't good for much but at least he uses the good test kits!! API will show ammonia all day long... even on RO/DI fresh water sometimes. just my 2 cents, and an advice to scan the boards about test kits and do some research. i didn't and regreted it!! :headwallblue:

also, i would recommend to rethink your plan to not use a skimmer - with sufficient live rock and sand, you could probly do just a skimmer and ditch the HOB filter altogether.

and... whats your plan for lighting? its waaaay more important in SW than it is in FW especially if you're wanting coral at some point.

otherwise your setup sounds good to me... :thumbsup: just keep in mind im not an expert or anything!

 

[PittsburghAqua]

@FTDelta:

I wasn't sure what to look for in an RO/DI unit, or anything about it. And I was mainly right now looking at the tank itself.

@Zimmer:

I'll search around for test kits then. I know that my freshwater kit was testing my ammonia just fine.

Do you just take your test kits to your LFS all the time?

I will rethink the skimmer as well, but I was trying to save money by using the HOB filter for now, and when I go for my lighting to buy a skimmer then.

Right now for my lighting I had no plan to be honest. Since I was only going with a FOWLR tank I didn't think I needed to worry about lighting.

The tank currently has an Aqueon 8,000k full spectrum T8 15w Daylight.

 

[Zimmer]

ya, your LFS people should test your water for free anytime and be happy about it!! lol that way you can make sure what your kit says is accurate... make sure you check expiration dates as well, they make a difference too! my kit was reading ammonia the same level throughout my whole cycle - the nitrites nitrates or ph i never had issue with, but the ammonia you will find is a common complaint for that brand.

you can probably get away without a skimmer for awhile, but as your bioload increases and waste increases, you may find that you have trouble controlling nitrates no matter what you try or how many water changes you do... thats when you need a skimmer!

i would try to upgrade to t5 bulbs and fixture with 2 bulbs at least, the t8's would probly be fine for fish and most inverts, but again if you're gonna go with anemones or corals at some point, you might as well get your lighting figured out ahead of time. LED's are actually really probly the best for that size tank, but can be spendy, lots of people use metal halides but they get real hot and they are more for like sps corals. i guess what you should take from this is that there are LOTS of options, and that lighting is determined by what you want to stock in your tank.

 

[gbru316]

Add an automatic top off to your list. They're invaluable, especially on smaller tanks.

 

[PittsburghAqua]

@Zimmer:

I actually am lucky to have a few respectable LFSs near me. There is one called Elemer's Aquarium/Pet center and another called Wet Pets. Both of them can test my levels for me.

And my initial load is going to be fairly small. At first I'm really only looking for the clowns... and I don't think that they will require a skimmer. But the skimmer is the big thing to get after the tank is set up. I actually want to get the R/O unit, then get a skimmer, and then focus on lighting, and then get corals/anemones/etc...

I"m guessing in terms of upgrading lighting I'm going to have to upgrade the hood too? I noticed that with most tanks they have "hanging" lights.. is there a more enclosed lighting like you get with a more basic hood? Something that wouldn't have me fearing my cat getting into the water?

@gbru316

I don't know if I'll have the space for a top-off. Is there a difference between me topping off the water myself, and an auto top-off? Aside from the fact that it's automatically topping off the water.....

 

[gbru316]

@Zimmer:

I actually am lucky to have a few respectable LFSs near me. There is one called Elemer's Aquarium/Pet center and another called Wet Pets. Both of them can test my levels for me.

And my initial load is going to be fairly small. At first I'm really only looking for the clowns... and I don't think that they will require a skimmer. But the skimmer is the big thing to get after the tank is set up. I actually want to get the R/O unit, then get a skimmer, and then focus on lighting, and then get corals/anemones/etc...

I"m guessing in terms of upgrading lighting I'm going to have to upgrade the hood too? I noticed that with most tanks they have "hanging" lights.. is there a more enclosed lighting like you get with a more basic hood? Something that wouldn't have me fearing my cat getting into the water?

@gbru316

I don't know if I'll have the space for a top-off. Is there a difference between me topping off the water myself, and an auto top-off? Aside from the fact that it's automatically topping off the water.....

You can top off manually, but it won't be as stable as having an ATO. Evaporation will increase specific gravity, which will then drop again when you top off. Before I implemented an ATO, I was topping off twice a day.

 

[MondoBongo]

Welcome to RC.

Where in Pittsburgh are you at about? I am in the south hills.

As others have said, I would get a skimmer and ditch the hob filter. An auto top off is a great thing to have too.

My rodi unit is something I consider essential as well. It has already paid for itself in convenience and cost. Buying it can be very pricey, and it is a pain in the butt to haul. Plus it is a good idea to always have some on hand in case you have to mix water or top off on short notice.

Also, price check everything at wet pets. They like to gouge like crazy, especially on their live rock. I found their "Purple Fiji" rock for half the price at oddball. They have it listed well over the MSRP of the maker. That seems to be par for the course there.

Also I would highly recommend a quarantine tank. Another thing I wouldn't go without.

 

[Zimmer]

ah you're so lucky! my LFS isn't bad enough that it was noticeable at first, until i became more educated and realized what was really going on! *I got pressured/talked into cycling my tank with a damsel against my best instincts....* :facepalm: after i realized that almost everything he was telling me was wrong, i started doing a lot more research on RC!! lifesaver!!! :celeb2:

there are lots of threads on here about DIY screen lids, you can do something like that if you decide to go with a hanging fixture, or even customize it to a different hood fixture if you do that instead - that way your feline explorers won't get into anything 'over their heads'.... *hehe*:lolspin:

 

[PittsburghAqua]

@MondoBongo
South Hills as well! I'm in the Beechview area off W. Liberty Ave.

What/Where is Oddball? I've never heard of that store! And Have you ever been to Elemer's. They are bit pricey too from what I've seen, but like Wet Pet's their fish seem to be in excellent health and the staff for the most part is knowledgeable. It's funny for me because both Wet Pets and Elmer's are the same distance from me. So it's all a matter of what time it is that I choose where I go.

I'll have to look more into RODI units then.. search online for them..

@Zimmer

Could I modify something around the stock lighting? The stock lighting has a screen/cover... could I modify something around that cover, or does it have to be "exposed" like mesh? I can post some pictures of the stock lighting setup so you know what I mean..

 

[MondoBongo]

you're not too far from me then, i'm in baldwin.

oddball is over in north baldwin, near the water treatment plant on Joseph st if you're familiar with the area.

they don't always have the best selection of equipment in stock since they're a fairly small store, but they're very friendly, very knowledgeable, and always willing to order anything they don't have on a shelf for you. their fish and coral selection is usually pretty good as well.

http://www.oddballpets.com/

there is also a place called AquaWorld out on 65. i just visited them for the first time this past weekend. somehow i restrained myself from buying anything, they had an incredibly large selection of livestock and equipment, for salt and freshwater. their prices on their corals were almost unbelievably low. i'm not sure if that's good or bad, i am always wary of stuff that looks too good to be true, but everything i saw there ticked all the right boxes.

http://www.aquaworldpsc.com/

i won't shop at wet pets anymore. i don't want to just crap all over them but their high pressure sales tactics, high prices, and general predisposition to be disingenuous about the quality of their products has cost me a lot of money and made me purchase several things twice. since their store looked so nice i trusted them a lot more than i should have, and didn't start double checking their prices and claims until i was way deep in money spent there. live and learn.

elmer's isn't bad. their equipment selection is kind of lacking though. when i was first setting up my tank i bought everything from them and they unfortunately talked me in to a CoreLife skimmer and canister filter. the skimmer broke fairly quickly, and the canister filter isn't needed for a reef tank with live rock and a skimmer going. their prices are reasonable though, and their selection seems good. i haven't purchased any livestock from yet, mainly because it is a fairly long drive for anything living purchased from there.

as far as RODI i picked up a Spectrapure 90GPD refurb unit a few months back for a steal from the Spectrapure site. great unit. you can find it about halfway down this page for $125:

http://www.spectrapure.com/email/sale.htm

 

[PittsburghAqua]

I didn't add this but I'm going to take a trip to my LFS today to price out some things. Primarily see what I want to run for powerheads. I'm also going to look at corals and anemones and see what I want/like.. so I can determine lighting..

 

[MondoBongo]

one other random piece of advice, if i plan on buying any livestock of any type, i always bring a small Styrofoam cooler with me. especially in the winter/summer when it is either very hot or very cold. it helps keeps the temperature in the bag as stable as possible, and keeps things dark to help keep the new addition(s) calmer.

if you have any questions feel free to shoot me a PM. i'd be more than happy to share my (admittedly limited) experience with another citizen of the 'burgh.

 

[Zimmer]

ya, they have lots of corner adapters for the screen tops you can make it fit around whatever you decide to have coming into your tank... you don't have to have a screen, a solid hood top/fixture is probly fine, but lots of people prefer a "topless" look :eek1: hehe i think for reasons like oxygenation, gas transfer, heat dissipation (lights get hot!), and who knows what else? there are a thousand ways to do the same thing in this hobby i have found, its really about what you can do and make work for you, and what you like the look of!!

i have a cat too who would love to meet my damsel, i actually caught his fat 12# butt ON the screen the other nite peering into my skimmer... i thought both our lives were over LOL but somehow it held him as he leaped for his life straight off it the minute he saw me good thing my hubby is strong in the Force :strooper: he's a DIY master and made a solid screen!

the more research i do, the more questions i have, but also the more i read the more times i have moments of "oh so THAT'S what that is" - this forum is amazing!

 

[PittsburghAqua]

Okay I know where Oddball is at.

AquaWorld isn't too far either.

Sucks about WetPets though.. Maybe I'll go to Oddball today then. My friend who I'm going with will probably want to go to the mall, but we can probably go to Oddball first then go to Centruy 3 after. That would work too since you say they are knowledgeable and it would be good to pick brains about my lighting system.

I like that RO/DI unit a lot too! I've got it bookmarked so that in the future I can buy it . Hopefully in 2 weeks when I get paid I'll get it!

I've heard of the cooler thing as well. I usually have this plastic cooler that I bring with me. My freshwater fish seem to have no problems and they have always acclimated fine into my tank.

And yeah if I need anything I'll PM ya!

@Zimmer:

That was my main concern. I don't think he would, but I also don't doubt him trying to sit on the screen and the taking a bath hahaha.

 

[MondoBongo]

if you decide to shop at Wet Pets, just make sure you have done your homework and know about brands and quality, and what something *should* cost before you purchase.

don't let them railroad you in to a lesser quality product at an inflated price.

last time i was at oddball they were talking about converting over their display reef to a new kind of LED system, currently it is running a T5 setup. Kessil i think was the brand name.

enjoy.

 

[PittsburghAqua]

Well I'll decide where I want to go, but I just want to pick the brains of people about lighting my 20g. I think everything else is coming into place.. I know from you what RO/DI unit I'm going to get, I have some ideas on protein skimmers.. just small things to work out right now.

 

[PittsburghAqua]

Just an update:

Began pricing out live rock and some other things. I'll be trying to purchase a good power head this pay which will raise my flow up to a good level for starting with FOWLR.

I now have 2 questions:

1. For live rock, what should I go with? I noticed that they have "cultured" rock inside tanks that go for around $10 a pound. Do I go with this, or can I buy live rock that isn't already cultured and would be cheaper? Do I need the cultured rock for starting? Just don't know what to choose for the rock?

2. The employee I talked to said that when I plan on going to saltwater, I'll need a UV sterilizer. Is this actually needed or is he just selling stuff? He told me that I don't need it to start the tank (and that it's bad to have one running when cycling the tank) but that after the tank is cycled I'll want to have one to help in keeping bad stuff out. Is this true?

 

[MondoBongo]

UV sterilization is a hotly debated topic. Some people swear by it, others don't bother with it. There is no consensus I could find.

In regards to live rock, you can always get mostly dry rock and some live rock if you're patient and want to save some money . it's really up to you and your budget.

I bought mostly aquacultured "fake" live rock. I try to get aquacultured livestock/rock/coral whenever possible.