BRS new video on solving Calc and Alk dosing problems

[greg683x]

So I dont know how many watched this video but I did their experiment and had some concerns. Its based on people that have problems getting their ALK to rise. They say its bc they overdose, and bc they overdosed the ALK doesnt absorb into the water and thats why they dont see a bump in their levels, to paraphrase. They say their BRS160 tank only consumes around 200ml of ALK solution a day and it would be considered a low to moderately stocked tank. They also say Calc and Alk are usually dosed in a 1:1 ratio. Also, that if your tank is dosing more than the BRS160 and does not have as many stocked corals, that you should look into whether youre overdosing your solutions or not. They way to do this is to stop dosing for 4 days straight, dose each day an amount to bring the levels back up and hammer down the pattern.

I dont have issues with Alk not rising like mentioned in the video. However, I have a 90 gallon tank compared to their 160. I have probably half as many (if that) corals as they do, but still SPS dominated. I do though still dose just over 200ml a day of ALK in my tank, and I also only dose roughly 150ml of Calcium daily in my tank. The kicker is I also dose kalk in my ATO, so really, without that my consumption would be even higher

So I decided to check and see if I might be overdosing at all and Im actually pretty spot on for the most part, and I actually need to dose more if the numbers hold up. Right now Im dosing for 1.5dkh loss in a day, today was 1.7.

SO I guess the point of all this is I wanted to ask why my tank, even though almost half the size, and half the amount of corals, is consuming just as much as their BRS160 tank that they would regard as light to moderately stocked.

Also, I was always under the impression that ALK and Calcium consumption wasnt a 1:1 ratio. I had always read that about half as much calcium was consumed as ALK usually, but theyre saying otherwise.

I know that was a lot, does anyone have any thoughts on this?

 

[aclinville]

Mine is a 1:1 ratio and have a moderately stocked 180 gallon display sps only.

 

[greg683x]

how many ML of Alk solution are you dosing in a day roughly?

 

[bertoni]

For a 2-part, the supplements should be designed so that a 1:1 dosing is about right. There can be some drift:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-12/rhf/index.htm

If a tank gets too much supplementation, the alkalinity and calcium levels are likely to raise. If the supplements precipitate, though, that won't happen. You should see buildup on the walls of the tank or sump or heaters. In some cases, the precipitation might be hard to see, but daily measuring and dosing should be a fine way to get a handle on actual consumption for most tanks.

1.7 dKH per day is high, but reasonable. My soft coral tanks consumed 2-3 dKH per day for years due to coralline growth, as one example.

 

[Scorpius]

I've never dosed in a 1:1 ratio, ever. I have issues with saying you're ratio should always be 1:1. Ever tank is different. As long as you're not getting precipitant I wouldn't worry.

 

[aclinville]

Even though I'm moderately stocked they are all still small in size so I'm currently dosing 120ml each per day

 

[thegrun]

Your dosage does seem high although if you have a lot of coraline algae it would be possible for a tank to consume that much two part. I have an SPS dominated 120 gallon reef tank (with little coraline) that uses 130mL of two part daily. 200 mL along with kalkwasser seems high. I went through a period of overdosing several years ago. At first the weekly increases necessary to keep up with what I thought were needed were small, but over several months it became obvious that I was overdosing as I started seeing calcium precipitation on the glass and I was needing to clean my pump impellers frequently. I'm not sure what BRS recommends, but I would stop dosing both two part and kalk for at least three days to let the potential calcium precipitation finish, then measure your parameters and go another two days without dosing to see what your demand is. I think stopping the dosing for only one day is not going to be long enough for the over-saturated calcium to work its way out of the water table.

 

[Bagabaga]

What's the magic bullet to amazing coralline growth anyway? My calcium is high and my alk is low and I don't get precipitate in my tank at all. Only time coralline grew was when I was away on vacation and thectank evaporated out. Maybe my salinity meter isn't reading correctly.

 

[Martin Kuhn]

Even in two tanks with identical size and identical SPS coverage the consumption CAN be different

Just imagine
Tank a) a bit elevated nutrient levels @ light intensity and spectrum not perfect

Tank b) nutrients close to, but > 0 and intensive light of perfect spectrum and "all sides" (like T5 )

I'm quite sure that tank B will consume by far for 2/3part S corals will grew much better than in a


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[homer1475]

When I was dosing in a 1:1 ratio I had a ton of precip, so much so one of my MP10's actually stopped from precip buildup. If I cut back my numbers would drop. When I posted in the chemistry section about it, Bertoni explained that sometimes you don't need a 1:1 ratio depending on your tanks needs, and that not dosing in a 1:1 ratio is not a wrong way to dose.

I now run 180ml of ALK(Randy's DIY recipe 2), and only 80ml of calcium(BRS calcium chloride), and my parameters stay on point. 8.6DKH, and 450 Cal with no precip.

I'm not saying BRS is wrong, but every tank is different, so a broad statement like that is just wrong.

 

[greg683x]

well I dont really have any coraline algae growth. I also do have buildup on my heater and on the walls of my sump, I dose into the bubble trap before the return chamber so most of the buildup is in there. Perhaps I should consider changing my dose location. Maybe put a small powerhead in the return chamber and dose into there

So, do you all think I should stop dosing two part part for like a week to let this all dissipate and then reevaluate my consumption? Should I clean the build up out or will it dissipate on its own?

 

[Bagabaga]

Definitely clean it up. Then re-evaluate your dosing schedule. Couldn't hurt in the end.


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[neiltus]

Do you have a healthy population of corraline algae? If so, there is your answer.

The BRS 160 uses painted rock.

 

[bertoni]

I would dose into the main display. That's the largest volume of water, and it has good flow. I did that for years. Of course, my tanks seldom had a sump attached, so I had no choice.

 

[zsuman101]

j imagine the larger the tank , the closer the 1 to 1 ratio could be. ime my smaller reefs consume much more alkalinity than calcium (as all my xtra full bottles of b-ionic cal supplement are getting dusty). my biggest reef 135 cube 50 sump is a much closer ratio than the smaller reefs. with that said, none of my tanks have precip, i test daily in all tanks, the frag tank and my 60 cube are zeo reefs and the consume alkalinity and are rarely at a 1 to 1 dosing ratio, the big tank is a bio pellet reef and gets kalkwasser and is never dosed with 2 part although im still loading that up with sps, so that will change. i have in the past have created imbalances using kalk. ie... it is very possible to strip alkalinty with kalkwasser by using too much to fast. sorry for the winded reply but... every tank is different and they are all ever changing, the only way to keep up is by testing and going from there.... good luck zsu

 

[Scorpius]

I dose in my sump where my return pump is so it immediately gets mixed into the water column by my return pump.

 

[bertoni]

There's a lot more calcium in saltwater than alkalinity, so often water changes can keep up with demand. There are a few processes that consume only alkalinity, as well:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-12/rhf/index.htm

 

[zsuman101]

There's a lot more calcium in saltwater than alkalinity, so often water changes can keep up with demand. There are a few processes that consume only alkalinity, as well:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-12/rhf/index.htm

very interesting read thank you bertoni. let me pick your brain a bit... as i stated my reefs are using alk much more than calcium, i have very little if any precip on my equipment, could the precip bond to the aragonite sand and therefore be fooling me? i do 10% water changes about once a week and a 25% change every 4th week to balance and replenish whatever the corals and skimmer remove.... thoughts? thanx in advance... zsu

 

[bertoni]

I don't know what's happening in your tank, but I probably wouldn't worry about the situation. Precipitation in the sand is possible, but it would consume calcium and alkalinity at the normal ratio.