Chloroquine phosphate/crypt

[Stuart60611]

Well, I wanted to share something with everyone which I have found to be very interesting. I just had a lengthy conversation with Dr. Fishman of Fishman Chemical, LLC (http://www.fishchemical.com/) about the use of this drug to treat crypt. He described it as extremely effective and much more effective than quinine sulfate. He further recommended something that I have yet to hear. He suggested dosing 1 teaspoon per 50 gallons once per week with discontinuing all chemical fitration for 48 hours after dosing. He suggested doing so for many months. He indicated that this would not harm the fish, nor the system's biological filter. He indicated that over time the drug would build up in the blood stream of the fish and eventually irradicate the crypt. He said you could eventually discontinue use of the drug, but he mentioned several other major fish wholesalers/farms who have adopted this approach and have been dosing like this for years without any problems. I did not ask about how the drug would affect corals, but he said that it will not be any issue whatsoever in a fowlr.

Anybody have any comments?

 

[RBU1]

Well it seems everyone has a different opinion.....Hard to tell what to do. I was told that Chloroquine will destroy your biological filtration and Quinine Sulfate is the way to go. That came from Dr. Aukes at the Fish Pharmacy....You get some many different opinions and treatment ideas from different people....Its almost like do what you feel is best and hope it works.

 

[Stuart60611]

For what it is worth, those at wetwebmedia and particularlly Fenner opine that Chloroquine is better for crypt than Qunine.

 

[Stuart60611]

Also, everything I have read indicates that it does not destroy the biological filter. However, both Quinine and Chloroquine will kill all algae and all molusks. What may be happening is people are experiencing ammonia spikes from the death of algae and molusks when dosing and are confusing the ammonia spike with the drugs affecting the biological filter.

 

[JHemdal]

Chloroquine will cause ammonia spikes under two conditions; newly cycled aquariums, and old tanks with lots of critters that are killed by it (their decomposing bodies fuel the ammonia).

This isn't a new treatment, anyone who used Marex back in the 1970's was using it. Works as a great preventative, not reef safe though.

Jay

 

[Stuart60611]

Chloroquine will cause ammonia spikes under two conditions; newly cycled aquariums, and old tanks with lots of critters that are killed by it (their decomposing bodies fuel the ammonia).

This isn't a new treatment, anyone who used Marex back in the 1970's was using it. Works as a great preventative, not reef safe though.

Jay

How about established tanks consisting exclusively of base rock with little fauna? Would one expect an ammonia or biological filter problem in that context? How effective is the treatment to erradicate an existing infestation as opposed as a mere preventative, and how would you suggest dosing? There appears to be quite a bit of disparity in terms of suggested dosing protocal.

 

[Stuart60611]

Bob Goeman's recommendation for treating display tank with chloroquine phosphate:

Hi Kevin,
There is a treatment mentioned in the book that has allowed leaving the inverts in the aquarium. Have you read that?
As for treatment, maintain proper specific gravity (1.024 "“ 26) and recommend an initial 20 mg/l, so that's twice the amount you're planning on. Thereafter, a 10mg/l dosage every 7 "“ 10 days for the next three treatments. (total of 4 treatments) Of course, during treatment, any phosphate removing product (CP will kill-off any algae) should be discontinued, as should activated carbon and/or ozone and skimming/UV. Once treatments are concluded, those products/devices and/or Poly-Filters can be used as needed.
As for water changes, a small change (20 gallons in your size aqu.) between each additional treatment is thought helpful, and also at the end of treatment. Otherwise, CP will be removed by the media mentioned above.
Keep me informed, and what city do you live in, as I'm tracking all CP data.
Hope this helps,

 

[RBU1]

I would not treat my main tank with anything...Even if JHemdal said it was ok.....Just kidding Jay...

 

[Stuart60611]

I would not treat my main tank with anything...

Certainly not my preference either, but with a fowlr consisting exclusively of base rock and little fauna combined with a large number of large fish, it is an option for me.

 

[RBU1]

So is Cupramine....or any copper for that matter but the choice seems to be cupramine.

 

[Stuart60611]

So is Cupramine....or any copper for that matter but the choice seems to be cupramine.

I am not sure what you mean, but in terms of copper choices cupramine definitely seems to be the best of them for treating crypt.

 

[Stuart60611]

In reseaching this further, I found the below link full of useful information:

http://www.saltcorner.com/Letters/showexchange.php?exchangeID=179

 

[RBU1]

I am not sure what you mean, but in terms of copper choices cupramine definitely seems to be the best of them for treating crypt.

What I mean is if you have a fowlr you can run copper in it and not mess with the chloriquine.

 

[Stuart60611]

What I mean is if you have a fowlr you can run copper in it and not mess with the chloriquine.

Definitely something I am considering also.

 

[RBU1]

I would not run anything unless you need it....Some people run a constant level of copper. My opinion is running copper all the time is not good for the fish.

 

[Stuart60611]

I would not run anything unless you need it....Some people run a constant level of copper. My opinion is running copper all the time is not good for the fish.

I agree and would not run a constant level of cupramine. Unfortunatley, I think I may need it. My fish definitely have crypt. All are eating well and not scratching too bad, but my trigger, in particular, looks pretty uncomfortable and is engaging in some substantial scratching and darting behavior. I would treat and then remove the best I can from the display if I did so. I have cuprisorb, cupramine, rox carbon, and copper test kit already on hand, along with live bacteria to deal with any retardation of the bacteria and/or fauna die off. My only concern is I have a bit of hair algae in the display which will, of course, die from the cupramine. Otherwise, I am very confident no other substantial fauna exists.

 

[RBU1]

Well good luck..

 

[Stuart60611]

Well good luck..

Thanks!