RedEDGE2k1
Member
Not at all...just threw on the plumbing mod and turned the return pump back on.
The water surface is now 100% clear and rippling, unlike before where one half was clear & ripply, and the other half was flat and stagnant.
Custom Cabinet for 90g Reef (Build Thread)
- Thread starter RedEDGE2k1
- Start date
Not at all...just threw on the plumbing mod and turned the return pump back on.
The water surface is now 100% clear and rippling, unlike before where one half was clear & ripply, and the other half was flat and stagnant.
Bkndsdl
Member
Red, I must say this is a very nice build. I am planning on a cabinet somewhat similar, and was curious as to how you screwed the 2x6 and 2x4's to the front panel; did you drill holes beforehand for the screws in both the 2x's and the plywood? If so, what size? How far do the screws penetrate through the 3/4" ply? Also, when screwing the 3/4" ply top to the 3/4" ply sides and back, did you pre-drill these holes as well?
Sorry for the question onslaught!
Sorry for the question onslaught!
bower23
New member
I'm a little confused on mine.... I have three options for the stand now, the 3/4 oak you used, 2x4's with hemlock skin, or cabinets from work (Kraftmaid). Most of the stands I've seen use lots of 2x4's and makes me wonder if the 3/4 oak or my cabinets would be enough. My current stand has 3x4 cherry with 2x4's support for a 72g and it's fine but It's hard to know how much is needed and how much is overkill.
RedEDGE2k1
Member
I used 2" wood screws to attach the 2x6s and 2x4s to the front panel, with no predilled holes. I sunk them about 1/8" in the lumber, so the screws would go far enough into the plywood for a good grip, but not so far that they would pierce the face side of the plywood. I also used TiteBond III wood glue all over the pieces; as the glue is much, much stronger than the screws. The screws are primarily used to clamp the pieces together while the glue dries.
I did predrill every plywood face-to-plywood edge screw connection. Otherwise, the plywood edge will almost always split. I believe I used a 1/16" or 1/8" bit, I can't really remember.
Good luck with your project,
Dustin
RedEDGE2k1
Member
That's because the stands you've seen are probably built by the average DIY'er who knows very little about structures, and chooses to overkill their design in order to feel safe.
Try this -- go into any aquarium store, find the biggest tank/stand combo they have to offer (probably 200+ gallons) and take a look inside the stand. It will be 3/4" plywood, with no 2x members whatsoever.
If the average Joe buys a 220g tank & stand from the local fish store, he never gives a second thought as to whether or not the stand is going to fall apart. Give him some tools and ask him to build a stand for the exact same tank, however, and suddenly he's at Home Depot buying 4x4 posts, 2x6 braces, 6" deck bolts, etc etc etc. It's just a case of "better safe than sorry" in a situation where there is an understood lack of confidence.
cannarella
New member
You really need the glue on the edge of the plywood b/c screws don't hold very well in the end grain of plywood. They can strip really easy. Predrilling is a must in end grain.
RedEDGE2k1
Member
Several people have asked for my SketchUp model since I started this thread, so instead of emailing it to individuals one at a time, I decided to open an account with a free file hosting site and save the SketchUp model there. Now anyone can download it, play with it, change it, whatever you want. I do ask one thing though -- if you build your own cabinet based on my plan, send me some build/final pictures! It'd be neat to see your work.
Here's the link to the download (9.07mb)
http://www.mediafire.com/?7tkx2xf9igl
Take care folks-
Dustin
Here's the link to the download (9.07mb)
http://www.mediafire.com/?7tkx2xf9igl
Take care folks-
Dustin
JJ4417
New member
What...I can't send you my specs and have you design it for me? Bummer...
Seriously, you said people usually overbuild their stands, so I'll ask what really seems like a silly question. Looking at a 180 build...what am I looking at for the frame? Do I need a frame or would the plywood work?
Seriously, you said people usually overbuild their stands, so I'll ask what really seems like a silly question. Looking at a 180 build...what am I looking at for the frame? Do I need a frame or would the plywood work?
RedEDGE2k1
Member
A plywood stand is enough for any standard size tank -- no 2x members needed -- if you know what you're doing and use proper plywood joinery techniques.
RumLad
New member
This being the case, why then did you elect to use 2x members in your stand?
I think the phrase "if you know what you are doing" does not apply to 99% of the members that frequent this site for advice, as far as structural design and integrity goes. Most, if not all DIY'ers, would be hard pressed to design a stand for over 1600 pounds (180 gal x 9 lbs/gal, in the above post) out of plywood alone.
I know I would struggle to be truly comfortable filling that tank, on that stand, in my living room!
Most of us would likely feel the need to use some form of structural members at the corners, front and back edges in order to sleep at night.
My .02, once again.
RedEDGE2k1
Member
Ah...you're back. Go back and read the build -- I opted to use a 2x6 header to span the front of the tank, rather than implement a plywood center brace (blocking access to the sump and equipment below). Loading on the 2x6 header is transferred to the floor with two 2x4s at each end.
There's really only one thing to remember when thinking about building a DIY stand for a large (200+ gallon) aquarium -- either you know what you're doing, or you don't. If you don't, then you pay someone to do it or you buy an engineered one at the fish store.
Someone with no structural knowledge could spend $1200 building a 55g stand out of 8"x8" pressure treated pine and all the 2x4 braces they want, but if it's all put together with load-bearing screw connections and a Glu-Stic, it's going to fail.
Structures is 1% material strength and 99% engineered strength.
cannarella
New member
There you go again pushing buttons. Try offering up something constructive or not at all. The reason the DIY forum exists is for people to learn and try, not to bash.
RumLad
New member
How is that bashing?
Was I not constructive when I informed him how to make a straight cutout with a saw and a router on page 3, or offered some hinge designs, also on page 3?
I simply asked why he chose the method he did for his stand, when he just posted that it was not necessary if you know what you are doing. FWIW, In his case, I think the tank could be safely built with the front edge resting solely on the plywood, as the back edge is currently doing. But he chose to go with some additional support structure. Was this by 'engineering design, or his own gut feeling that this would be better?
That's how people learn too, by getting the inside details as to how these decisions come about. The old adage about giving a man a fish vs. teaching him how to fish, comes to mind.
Was I not constructive when I informed him how to make a straight cutout with a saw and a router on page 3, or offered some hinge designs, also on page 3?
I simply asked why he chose the method he did for his stand, when he just posted that it was not necessary if you know what you are doing. FWIW, In his case, I think the tank could be safely built with the front edge resting solely on the plywood, as the back edge is currently doing. But he chose to go with some additional support structure. Was this by 'engineering design, or his own gut feeling that this would be better?
That's how people learn too, by getting the inside details as to how these decisions come about. The old adage about giving a man a fish vs. teaching him how to fish, comes to mind.
RumLad
New member
never left, you've just been ignoring me, remember?
i think you would be hard pressed to spend 1200 on a 55 gallon stand TBH. You could buy enough 8x8's to stack a solid 48" high x 48 w x 16 d for a lot less. No need for fasteners!
But really, as above, was this by engineering design or your own "gut feeling" that you used the frame design instead of the solid design you have on the back edge?
cannarella
New member
Have you priced Teak lately?
Yes you offered up some useful tips earlier, but you have also ruffled feathers.
I think the earlier post was a jab at him for using 2x material in his stand and now he is preaching plywood. Nowhere has anyone said that you can't use both together. I think the main thing he learned is that glue is your friend.
RedEDGE2k1
Member
No, it couldn't, because there is no structural support between the cabinet doors to carry the weight of the front of the tank (that's what the 2x6 header and 2x4 legs are for). On the back, the plywood supports the center span, with some cutouts to cut down on furniture weight. Hence, no 2x members on the back of the stand.
As for your "bashing" comments, in some instances, maybe I have been harsh on you because I interpreted your comments as being sarcastic, witty zingers. In fact, you were just ill-informed and didn't thoroughly follow the cabinet build (ie, asking why I used 2x members if plywood is strong enough by itself, while ignoring the circumstance).
However, just as many of your comments were just way off topic and argumentative, while serving no purpose (ie. the water police). I'm not taking the time to get back into it, but you get the point.
Think before you type, especially consider how it will be read across the country on someone else's computer, without facial expressions and tones of voice.
-Dustin