custom reef creations
- Thread starter lawboy888
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LoanFisher
New member
I sure love all the support this forum shows our local stores. Of course I'm kidding. It seems to have become more of a sales forum. Custom Reef Creations and all of the stores in the metro could use a little more support from this "club".
chaderic26
New member
If you own or work for a fish store and are wondering why it's not doing well... It's because we're in a recession. "Not because "the club isn't helping". People are making some tough decisions right about now.
Recession or not, nobody owes a business anything. yes, supporting local fish stores is nice, but the very word support is incorrect. I feel no obligation to support anyone other than myself. If the business is well managed, and prices are fair, I see no reason not to buy from them.
Custom Reef Creations is a pleasant store. I've not bought much from Bill, but the purchases I have made have been good ones. I find that the best prices for coral are still on forums and individual trades. Livestock, same, but availability is a challenge; thus, the store comes in handy. Wet Pets--while largely overpriced-- has the occasional good deal, but it is rare.
Removed~dc
If I get banned from this forum, I'll know why.
You can't possibly think that was acceptable~dc
Custom Reef Creations is a pleasant store. I've not bought much from Bill, but the purchases I have made have been good ones. I find that the best prices for coral are still on forums and individual trades. Livestock, same, but availability is a challenge; thus, the store comes in handy. Wet Pets--while largely overpriced-- has the occasional good deal, but it is rare.
Removed~dc
If I get banned from this forum, I'll know why.
You can't possibly think that was acceptable~dc
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lauremf2002
New member
I think this club does a wonderful job supporting the local stores and I am happy we trade and sell to each other as well. I also think Reef Creations is an awesome store and they have really good prices and customer service. I have a very tight (nearly non-existant) reef budget and CRC is one of the only places I can afford livestock and coral. Other than that and trading or buying from members, I would have nothing in my little tank. I encourage members to trade and buy from each other. Isnt that one of the great perks of being in a reef club?
I whole-heartedly agree, when I lived up in CT and dealt with the C.T.A.R.S folks I quickly learned that trading frags/fish is not just a great way to diversify your livestock/coral but also a great way to network, make friends and get to know what other people are doing with their setups... I have only been an active reefer down in OKC for a few weeks now but I can already tell that the people here are more than willing to go out of their way to help each other out (Thanks a bunch Cjilge).
On the other hand, I think all of us can agree that a LFS has saved us/been there for us in this hobby at least once. It may have been great advice or that one product that we need to complete our setup (Thanks for staying open late for the silicone, CRC).
On the other hand, I think all of us can agree that a LFS has saved us/been there for us in this hobby at least once. It may have been great advice or that one product that we need to complete our setup (Thanks for staying open late for the silicone, CRC).
LoanFisher
New member
Lawboy posted a nice comment about a new LFS and no one agreed or even commented on it for 2 days. I thought that was interesting.
Chadreric26, what things have the club done to help any LFS? I see people post they are looking for this or that and I rarely see a LFS recommended. When it finally does happen someone comes behind and recommends an online source instead. I would think this would be very disturbing to any business owner.
BigPurp, your descriptions of "pleasant" (condescending) and "largely overpriced" (insulting) is exactly what I'm talking about.
Yes, this club is very willing to help it's members in need. That's a great thing. I'm not suggesting you should never by online. I'm simply wondering why this forum doesn't seem to appreciate their LFS very much. I've seen lots of stores come and go over the years. Usually the new store will sponsor the club for a while. It's the talk of the forum until the new wears off. Most of them have gone away. Is it because they aren't making a profit tying to compete with online? Some stores are poorly managed and go out of business, but the ones that have been around a while don't seem too popular among the club.
This is just my personal observation. Sorry if this is offensive to anyone.
Chadreric26, what things have the club done to help any LFS? I see people post they are looking for this or that and I rarely see a LFS recommended. When it finally does happen someone comes behind and recommends an online source instead. I would think this would be very disturbing to any business owner.
BigPurp, your descriptions of "pleasant" (condescending) and "largely overpriced" (insulting) is exactly what I'm talking about.
Yes, this club is very willing to help it's members in need. That's a great thing. I'm not suggesting you should never by online. I'm simply wondering why this forum doesn't seem to appreciate their LFS very much. I've seen lots of stores come and go over the years. Usually the new store will sponsor the club for a while. It's the talk of the forum until the new wears off. Most of them have gone away. Is it because they aren't making a profit tying to compete with online? Some stores are poorly managed and go out of business, but the ones that have been around a while don't seem too popular among the club.
This is just my personal observation. Sorry if this is offensive to anyone.
I apologize for the Obama comment.
Nevertheless, I still hold that Wet Pets is largely profit-driven. There is no need to sell Xenia at $15/head. Still, I've found some awesome deals on coral and livestock there. It is, however, rare. One thing I have noticed is that despite their move, they have maintained steady prices. Competitive prices, not entirely. A knowledgeable staff and a large selection of resources? Yes. A well organized store, with the occasional deal? Yes.
I meant no condescending tone in my description of CRC. If I indeed came across this way to others, I apologize. I believe in fair business, and fair prices. I do not agree with 200% profit margins, and will not support those unfair business practices.
I have noticed that the majority of people on here are extremely kind, generous, and supportive of one another. Perhaps the driving force behind less 'support' for these LFS stems from unfair prices, or simply put: tough times, and competitive pricing amongst individual trading vs. LFS purchases. Certainly, I've refrained from LFS purchases, unless I feel the price is fair.
I prefer to shop smart and save as much money as possible-- there's nothing wrong with that, and I'm sure the sentiment is shared.
Does anyone else agree?
Nevertheless, I still hold that Wet Pets is largely profit-driven. There is no need to sell Xenia at $15/head. Still, I've found some awesome deals on coral and livestock there. It is, however, rare. One thing I have noticed is that despite their move, they have maintained steady prices. Competitive prices, not entirely. A knowledgeable staff and a large selection of resources? Yes. A well organized store, with the occasional deal? Yes.
I meant no condescending tone in my description of CRC. If I indeed came across this way to others, I apologize. I believe in fair business, and fair prices. I do not agree with 200% profit margins, and will not support those unfair business practices.
I have noticed that the majority of people on here are extremely kind, generous, and supportive of one another. Perhaps the driving force behind less 'support' for these LFS stems from unfair prices, or simply put: tough times, and competitive pricing amongst individual trading vs. LFS purchases. Certainly, I've refrained from LFS purchases, unless I feel the price is fair.
I prefer to shop smart and save as much money as possible-- there's nothing wrong with that, and I'm sure the sentiment is shared.
Does anyone else agree?
chaderic26
New member
I know in the past this club has recommended many sponsors. If it were up to me which it's not, no store would be recommended by the club. Not because they are good or bad. Purely because they end up with hurt feelings when they get a bad review, or in this case a good review that everyone didn't jump on to shout praises.
Imho a business model for a fish store should not depend on getting pushed by a local hobby club. Further more, if your store isn't getting good reviews then maybe someone should concentrate on why instead of shooting the messenger. All the people on here form there own opinions. The club surely can't dictate that.
Imho a business model for a fish store should not depend on getting pushed by a local hobby club. Further more, if your store isn't getting good reviews then maybe someone should concentrate on why instead of shooting the messenger. All the people on here form there own opinions. The club surely can't dictate that.
FILTERDAQUATICS
New member
Bigburp, your knowledge of how a LFS runs seems very uneducated. Markups may be 200% on some things but profits on those same things are more in the range of 40% to 45%(if your lucky). Thats after you figure in basic business expenses like rent, electric, employees , food and supplements to feed the animals, insurance, salt , water and sewage, ro filters , Di resin, I could go on and on. These expenses are more than most as LFS are required to keep a animal alive until it sells. No business with a physical location and a niche market can survive for very long on any less. I doubt the internet could support this industry alone as almost everyone starts this hobby from going in a LFS or at least with a friend who started in a LFS.
I love COMAS and they support me well, putting my name out there is all I can ask the rest is up to me. To generalize like you did Bigburb is inappropriate.
I love COMAS and they support me well, putting my name out there is all I can ask the rest is up to me. To generalize like you did Bigburb is inappropriate.
LoanFisher
New member
Bigpurp, I would imagine any smart retail business owner would be profit driven or it's bankruptcy. You are obviously ignorant about how retail works. How do you know the cost of items they sell?
Chaderic, it's a good thing your not in charge of club sponsorship.
Filtered Aquatics seems to be spot on with his analysis of LFS challenges. There is a big difference between price and value. Good customers will pay a little extra to get value of service before and after the sale. I'm in retail and sure you want to help your customers, but the business should attain a profit off every transaction possible. That's how they pay the bills.
Chaderic, it's a good thing your not in charge of club sponsorship.
Filtered Aquatics seems to be spot on with his analysis of LFS challenges. There is a big difference between price and value. Good customers will pay a little extra to get value of service before and after the sale. I'm in retail and sure you want to help your customers, but the business should attain a profit off every transaction possible. That's how they pay the bills.
I claim no expertise in the area of LFS. However, I take issue with the claim that this hobby is an 'industry.' When the drive for profit exceeds the joy of sharing the hobby with others, there is a definite problem. This is perhaps another reason why most serious hobbyists resort to Online Forums: less profit-driven trading.
I will not condone or support business for the sake of business. I find the aquatics 'industry' so widely infected with a drive for profit that many people are not able to enjoy the beauty of underwater life due to prohibitive costs. The bills must be paid, yes. But at what price? I do not believe one should pay $15/head for Xenia. There is no generalization in saying that Wet-Pets is profit-driven. This is fact, is it not? Is wet-pets not a business? Is it not part of the aquatics 'industry?'
Perhaps I'm alone in this sentiment, or perhaps there are those who will silently agree. Regardless, it is not my job as a hobbyist to 'support' an LFS. Neither should it be the job of any club to support a LFS. I sometimes wondered how connected COMAS and reef central traders are with the LFS. I'm beginning to feel that I cannot express a review of a LFS without some sort of backlash, which I find disturbing. Is this indeed an open forum? I'm rather new here....
I will agree with Chaderic: If the store is not getting good reviews, one should focus on the review itself, not the messenger. I'm sure I'm not the first person to complain of inflated prices @ WetP, nor will I be the last.
I will say that overall, I think lauremf2002 has the right idea. Perhaps I should simply not say anything at all, unless it is generally supportive and nice.
Okay, I've poked enough fun for now. See you @ wet pets.
I will not condone or support business for the sake of business. I find the aquatics 'industry' so widely infected with a drive for profit that many people are not able to enjoy the beauty of underwater life due to prohibitive costs. The bills must be paid, yes. But at what price? I do not believe one should pay $15/head for Xenia. There is no generalization in saying that Wet-Pets is profit-driven. This is fact, is it not? Is wet-pets not a business? Is it not part of the aquatics 'industry?'
Perhaps I'm alone in this sentiment, or perhaps there are those who will silently agree. Regardless, it is not my job as a hobbyist to 'support' an LFS. Neither should it be the job of any club to support a LFS. I sometimes wondered how connected COMAS and reef central traders are with the LFS. I'm beginning to feel that I cannot express a review of a LFS without some sort of backlash, which I find disturbing. Is this indeed an open forum? I'm rather new here....
I will agree with Chaderic: If the store is not getting good reviews, one should focus on the review itself, not the messenger. I'm sure I'm not the first person to complain of inflated prices @ WetP, nor will I be the last.
I will say that overall, I think lauremf2002 has the right idea. Perhaps I should simply not say anything at all, unless it is generally supportive and nice.
Okay, I've poked enough fun for now. See you @ wet pets.
lauremf2002
New member
You are certainly entitled to voice your opinion, negative or positive. I dont think there is anything wrong with that but I will say I think its in the clubs best interest to have local store sponsors. I know for a fact that our sponsors have donated gift certificates, coral and supplements to the club for our annual membership drive and as raffle items for regular club meetings. That being said, we as club members should support them by recommending them when possible and shopping with them when we can too. So no its not your job as a hobbyist but I encourage you, if you are a Comas member, to try and "support" our sponsors. Obviously, within reason. Of course you dont have to shop somewhere you deem overpriced. But keep in mind they give the club lots of goodies and we should show our appreciation. One of the leadership Team would have to chime in here to list all of the sponsors but I will try and name the few I can think of.
Custom Reef Creations in Moore
Reef shop Warehouse in Okc
Filtered Aquatics in Tulsa
Oddballs in Tulsa
HighDefCorals in The Village (okc)
Pet Lovers Pet Shop in Mustang
Tanks A Lot in Yukon
and we also have some product sponsors and online sponsors:
Rod's Food
Air Water Ice
Hamilton Technology
Reef Hobbyist Magazine
Reeflo Pumps
All of these club sponsors have donated to comas. That means they gave us stuff for free. I dont even think WetPets is a club sponsor because they arent listed on our website but the namesake of this thread certainly is and should get a big sloppy kiss from all the Comas members ;*
LoanFisher - I would like to point out that there have been many many many recommendations for the above mentioned sponsors and even for many non-club sponsors and I can think of at least 3 other threads started and commented on by many praising Custom Reef Creations. Just because this thread went 2 days with no comment doesnt mean we dont love Custom Reef Creations. It just means the forum was a little slow and like I said, there have already been 3 threads just like this one. Maybe everyone just silently agreed and moved on.
Sorry for the rant.
Custom Reef Creations in Moore
Reef shop Warehouse in Okc
Filtered Aquatics in Tulsa
Oddballs in Tulsa
HighDefCorals in The Village (okc)
Pet Lovers Pet Shop in Mustang
Tanks A Lot in Yukon
and we also have some product sponsors and online sponsors:
Rod's Food
Air Water Ice
Hamilton Technology
Reef Hobbyist Magazine
Reeflo Pumps
All of these club sponsors have donated to comas. That means they gave us stuff for free. I dont even think WetPets is a club sponsor because they arent listed on our website but the namesake of this thread certainly is and should get a big sloppy kiss from all the Comas members ;*
LoanFisher - I would like to point out that there have been many many many recommendations for the above mentioned sponsors and even for many non-club sponsors and I can think of at least 3 other threads started and commented on by many praising Custom Reef Creations. Just because this thread went 2 days with no comment doesnt mean we dont love Custom Reef Creations. It just means the forum was a little slow and like I said, there have already been 3 threads just like this one. Maybe everyone just silently agreed and moved on.
Sorry for the rant.
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LoanFisher
New member
Fair enough Lauremf2002. Let's look at the list of LFS sponsors.
Custom Reef Creations - Still a very new store. Bill is a very nice guy and seems to be hanging in there with his maintenance customers. Clean and well organized store.
The Reef Shop Warehouse - Has been blasted on the forum many times before and is very, very rarely recommended by this club. (Notice I said rarely not never)
Filtered Aquatics - Is also very new. I haven't made it there yet since it's in Tulsa but it's owner seems to know what it takes to last. I consider Filtered Aquatics to be in a separate market since it's not in the metro.
Oddballs is widely complimented on this forum which is great. I haven't been there yet as well. Once again in a separate market being in Tulsa.
HighDefCorals should not be in the LFS column since they don't have a store front. A bit of a conflict of interest in my opinion since Mr. Whitby was the Pres of comas for a while before he started his biz. Just my opinion.
Pet Lovers is a nice store in mustang and I don't think I've ever seen anyone recommend them. Once again they are not a LFS as they sell all pets.
Tanks A Lot is out of biz.
So really you have 2 LFS that are sponsors. That's pretty bleak.
Let's look at the stores that use to be sponsors of COMAS.
Aquarium Concepts - out of biz
Aquatic Resource Tech - Store front closed and doing maint and custom aquariums
Exotic Aquatics - out of biz
Wet Pets - still in biz and just expanded
Rock and Reef - out of biz
Pet cafe - out of biz
Aquariums - still in biz and has nice corals and fish but mainly does maintenance (last I heard)
Hopefully by pointing this out some will be more likely to recommend a local source for their hobby fix. These days more than ever our LFS need support from us.
Custom Reef Creations - Still a very new store. Bill is a very nice guy and seems to be hanging in there with his maintenance customers. Clean and well organized store.
The Reef Shop Warehouse - Has been blasted on the forum many times before and is very, very rarely recommended by this club. (Notice I said rarely not never)
Filtered Aquatics - Is also very new. I haven't made it there yet since it's in Tulsa but it's owner seems to know what it takes to last. I consider Filtered Aquatics to be in a separate market since it's not in the metro.
Oddballs is widely complimented on this forum which is great. I haven't been there yet as well. Once again in a separate market being in Tulsa.
HighDefCorals should not be in the LFS column since they don't have a store front. A bit of a conflict of interest in my opinion since Mr. Whitby was the Pres of comas for a while before he started his biz. Just my opinion.
Pet Lovers is a nice store in mustang and I don't think I've ever seen anyone recommend them. Once again they are not a LFS as they sell all pets.
Tanks A Lot is out of biz.
So really you have 2 LFS that are sponsors. That's pretty bleak.
Let's look at the stores that use to be sponsors of COMAS.
Aquarium Concepts - out of biz
Aquatic Resource Tech - Store front closed and doing maint and custom aquariums
Exotic Aquatics - out of biz
Wet Pets - still in biz and just expanded
Rock and Reef - out of biz
Pet cafe - out of biz
Aquariums - still in biz and has nice corals and fish but mainly does maintenance (last I heard)
Hopefully by pointing this out some will be more likely to recommend a local source for their hobby fix. These days more than ever our LFS need support from us.
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lauremf2002
New member
So you're saying we should <font size="4" color="#0000FF">profanity removed</font> just because they give us some free stuff? If I wanted to be in politics I would of ran for office
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Let me introduce myself. My name is April and I am the treasurer and part of the leadership team of this years COMAS.
Unfortunately, it took the notification from one of our local fish stores to point me towards this thread. I have a real full time job, a real life and real problems and don't have time to babysit this forum daily. Fishkeeping is a hobby for me, unlike our local fish stores, and I am here to put a stop to this discussion.
Take it from me, as the single person who hoofed it to every local store, spent hours convincing them, and soliciting every local sponsor that we have, that each of those listed above are most certainly considered store sponsors and are recommended when possible. No, every store is not recommended for every question. The stores are spaced throughout the Oklahoma area, and I tend to recommend those who may be closest or most available for the need.
I take great offense to people who have 9, 20, and 29 posts making disparaging comments about any stores, whether they are considered supporting stores or not. Obviously, you are either new to fish keeping, new to Reef Central, or otherwise just simply unwilling to post with your so called knowledge unless you can be slamming someone else's hard work.
To become sponsors, these supporting stores were willing to donate either $100.00 cash, or $100.00 worth of supplies and goods throughout the year. As the new leadership came on board with very little cash this year and we wanted an amazing January membership drive, most sponsors were asked to donate supplies for raffles. I can say without exception, each and every store has donated way above and beyond the measely $100.00 sponsorship fee.
Loanfisher and bigpurp, since I don't recognize your Reef Central monikers, I am fairly certain that you are not club members. If you were, you would have been able to take advantage of the numerous raffles and give aways this club has to offer at EVERY meeting. Those items come from our club sponsors for FREE. If you were club members, you would also be able to take advantage of free corals after fragging demos, which also come from our sponsors sometimes free, or at a greatly reduced price. Without our sponsors, COMAS would not be able to provide monthly raffles, frag demos, the frag program, pizza or any of the other things that club members seem to enjoy so much. Membership rarely, if ever, considers or cares about the behind the scenes hassles and headaches the leadership team goes thru to put on a monthly meeting. Much of the help we get comes from our local sponsors.
Regardless, any time you get more than 1 person in a place together, you are going to have conflicting opinions. No one place is going to be able to provide everything, at the best price, in the best time frame,on any given day. Everyone is going to have their favorites, their reasons and their opinions and you are entitled to them.
This thread has possibly already cost COMAS 1 sponsor. I am doing what I can to prevent that and the loss of any others. Please keep any further non supporting, disparaging or otherwise useless comments to yourselves.
Unfortunately, it took the notification from one of our local fish stores to point me towards this thread. I have a real full time job, a real life and real problems and don't have time to babysit this forum daily. Fishkeeping is a hobby for me, unlike our local fish stores, and I am here to put a stop to this discussion.
Take it from me, as the single person who hoofed it to every local store, spent hours convincing them, and soliciting every local sponsor that we have, that each of those listed above are most certainly considered store sponsors and are recommended when possible. No, every store is not recommended for every question. The stores are spaced throughout the Oklahoma area, and I tend to recommend those who may be closest or most available for the need.
I take great offense to people who have 9, 20, and 29 posts making disparaging comments about any stores, whether they are considered supporting stores or not. Obviously, you are either new to fish keeping, new to Reef Central, or otherwise just simply unwilling to post with your so called knowledge unless you can be slamming someone else's hard work.
To become sponsors, these supporting stores were willing to donate either $100.00 cash, or $100.00 worth of supplies and goods throughout the year. As the new leadership came on board with very little cash this year and we wanted an amazing January membership drive, most sponsors were asked to donate supplies for raffles. I can say without exception, each and every store has donated way above and beyond the measely $100.00 sponsorship fee.
Loanfisher and bigpurp, since I don't recognize your Reef Central monikers, I am fairly certain that you are not club members. If you were, you would have been able to take advantage of the numerous raffles and give aways this club has to offer at EVERY meeting. Those items come from our club sponsors for FREE. If you were club members, you would also be able to take advantage of free corals after fragging demos, which also come from our sponsors sometimes free, or at a greatly reduced price. Without our sponsors, COMAS would not be able to provide monthly raffles, frag demos, the frag program, pizza or any of the other things that club members seem to enjoy so much. Membership rarely, if ever, considers or cares about the behind the scenes hassles and headaches the leadership team goes thru to put on a monthly meeting. Much of the help we get comes from our local sponsors.
Regardless, any time you get more than 1 person in a place together, you are going to have conflicting opinions. No one place is going to be able to provide everything, at the best price, in the best time frame,on any given day. Everyone is going to have their favorites, their reasons and their opinions and you are entitled to them.
This thread has possibly already cost COMAS 1 sponsor. I am doing what I can to prevent that and the loss of any others. Please keep any further non supporting, disparaging or otherwise useless comments to yourselves.
lauremf2002
New member
Thank you April. I appreciate your hard work. Especially the hard work you did getting all the new club sponsors. I would also like to say thank you to our sponsors. I APPRECIATE YOU! And I know the COMAS MEMBERS appreciate you too! Our club wouldnt be as cool and fun without your goodies and support. Please dont let the opinions of a few discourage you from dealing with Comas.
