DeathMagnetic's Modified Ich Treatment Protocol

[DeathMagnetic]

Hey guys,

after battling ich for around a year.. it finally got the best of my tank.. and my fish. Needless to say i resolved to never happen again.

My method of choice to treat ich is hypo.. however i dont want to keep the fish in hypo for such a long time..

Simply stated, i leave the fish in hypo for 9 days... then do a tank transfer of the fish to another hypo tank... ( the second tank being freshly setup with matching salinity 1.009, temp, and ph ) Since the ich's lifecycle on the fish is no longer than 8 days ive got a clean fish and a clean tank.. then i can slowly raise the salinity to normal levels

hope this helps you guys....

Joe

 

[MrTuskfish]

This would be good if ich played by the rules. The timing of their life-cycle phases are just norms....and individual ich parasites can. and do, deviate (by many days) from that norm. Not even the standard 30 days of hypo guarantees that all individual parasites have gone through a phase where the hypo will kill them.

A well-researched example: Ich cysts are said to release their next generation in 30 days; but only 68% of the cysts actually do so. At 60 days, its 95%. 90 days gets 99.7%. I sure wouldn't trust my tank to following what's "normal" for ich. http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2041951

 

[DeathMagnetic]

Good point.. but if the cysts are off the fish in 8 days max and you are moving the fish to a clean tank... there will b no cysts to "hatch"

correct ?

also .. i would b moving the fish to another qt tank for the required observation period.... not putting directly into my display

 

[MrTuskfish]

There are never any cysts on the fish. They're on the bottom, substrate, etc. The theronts on the fish are not guaranteed to leave the fish in 8 days. You could easily have a theront leave the fish on day 12, day 20, (or whatever). If that occurs and SG is anywhere above 1.009; that theront will form a new mother cyst. A clean tank is fine, but not needed (IMO).
If hypo conditions don't continue for at least 30 days, ich will almost certainly be back. (Again, IMO) Hypo seems to fail much more often than it used to. I'm sure much is error by the hobbyist; but ich may be developing some tolerance to even lower a SG. I admit that I am not a fan of hypo. But if I were looking for ways to tweak it; I'd look for ways to make it more effective, not faster.

 

[DeathMagnetic]

Im only trying "tweak" to speed things up for the fish's health... forgive my error re "cyst" Actually trophonts are on the fish... Theronts are never on the fish they hatch from the cysts ( pre-host )
the below quote comes straight from snorvich's post

Interesting Facts about Cryptocaryon Irritans

its the 3rd paragraph under the Biology and Life Cycle of Cryptocaryon irritans

The most commonly observed stage is the trophont, or "feeding" stage. The trophont is found on the fish, usually underneath the outer skin layers. Spherical to club- or pear-shaped, with cilia all over its body, the trophont will normally be seen "rolling" or rotating slowly under the epithelium (outer cell layers of the skin or gills) (see figures 3–6 ). Because the trophont is embedded within the skin, it is relatively protected from any potential treatments. The organism's cytoplasm is more opaque in this phase, which means the lobed macronucleus (and several smaller micronuclei) can be difficult to see in live specimens (Dickerson 2006). Trophonts can range in size from about 48 x 27 µm (~1/20 x 1/40 of a mm) to 452 x 360 µm (~1/2 x 1/3 mm) (1 µm = 1 micron; 1,000 microns = 1 millimeter). The trophont feeds on the body fluids and cells of the fish for about 3–7 days before leaving the host.
Trophonts will also actively leave fish that have died, but are not immediately infective. They require additional time to develop from protomonts to tomonts, just as they would if leaving a live host.


this is where im basing my information from...

Joe

 

[MrTuskfish]

Steve (Snorvich) is the expert on ich.

Again, you can't count on ALL trophonts leaving the fish in 3-7 days.

 

[DeathMagnetic]

Maybe Steve can chime in on this !!! everywhere ive read its been 7 days MAX !!

 

[MrTuskfish]

Maybe Steve can chime in on this !!! everywhere ive read its been 7 days MAX !!

It could be 7 days max; but I just don't think anything is 100% certain with the life-cycle of any critter. With protozoan parasites, like ich, all it takes is one parasite that has morphed a bit and you're in trouble. Years ago, if my I remember right, hypo was considered very effective at an SG of about 1.013. My gut feeling, from reading so many threads on our forum, is that there may be strains that are even resistant to 1.008. Who knows? Some doctoral candidate at some school may decide to research this someday. In the mean time, I'll try to keep up to date on hypo, but still use copper on all of my own fish.

FWIW; I'm starting to be a real believer in chloroquine phosphate.

 

[snorvich]

My concern is that hypo (or a non-therapeutic level of copper) may inhibit trophont life cycle progression. Many organisms are sensitive to their external environment and when that environment is different than ideal, the need to self perpetuate may be inhibited until the environment is favorable. In a similar manner, oodinium can be masked on fish that are kept in a non-therapeutic copper level. I am not aware of any studies that have actually been done on this reaction mechanism so my experience has been observational rather than double blind reproducible. Tank transfer is predicated on using the life cycle of cryptocaryon irritans to eradicate the parasite and has been shown to be effective in doing so. From a time perspective, this method is the shortest that I know of and has no negative effect on fish. I hope this helps.

 

[DeathMagnetic]

Steve, would you agree that the trophonts are protected from their environment by the fish itself ? They wouldnt know they were in hypo until they emerged.. that would be too late...

JD