Experience with Planted Discus Tanks?

[ggrillo]

Sorry, not really sure where to post this.

I've been thinking that I want to get rid of my reef tank recently and I think I'd like to do a planted Discus tank. I'd like to find a 75, 90, 120, or even a 125 gallon tank because I'd be able to use my existing T5 fixture. How difficult are Discus to keep? I've always loved the look of them in a tank with huge plants. I'm hoping that it would be a lot easier than my reef tank now because I feel I'm getting tired of all the upkeep.

Any thoughts?

 

[Aquat]

Ah, as a newbie in the reef hobby. I've been in the freshwater hobby for years.

Of course, it's nothing difficult compare to that of a reef. They're quite sensitive fish, so try buying them as juveniles. They'll acclimate much easier, and it's a joy seeing them grow. They do require a variety of food (beef hearts does best) and VERY clean STABLE water.

As for lighting, I'm guessing this is for your previous reef setup? What kind of bulbs? To help with plant growth, anything from 6500k - 10,000k would be best. I do enjoy the look of 6700k for a planted aquarium. It's white with a hint of yellow.

Plant Care; I would highly recommend you invest in a quality substrate. I recommend anything associated ADG. The substrate is the life line for the stability of your plants. Most plants absorb almost 300x more nutrients from their roots than from the water column. Unless they're heavy rooters. (Swords, Crypts) Of course liquid fertilizer is encouraged, because the of the ion cach exchange. Positive particles from the fert will be drawn into the substrate from the negative ions. Because not every substrate last forever. Simple science right? haha. There's also dry fert, but that's for the more experienced aquarist because you get to dose specifically what's needed.

Is there there a specific layout you're looking do? Try googling Takashi Amano, Oliver Knotts and research the different styles there are to forming an amazing planted aquarium. There's one thing they all have in common though, is the hardscape. The hardscape will tie everything together, literally. Personally, I've always favored the 'Iwagumi' design, from the Japanese 'rock garden'. It literally translate 'rock formations'. I'll post a video layout of my most recent setup. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rZPDMKFU6I

 

[Aquat]

But of course, not everyone is going to put Discus in an Iwagumi.

Here's a link to a nature aquarium layout made for Discus!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q768Zto6g-w

 

[RogueAgent94]

If you want less upkeep then Discus is not the way to go. With my Discus I needed to keep up a daily waterchange schedule to keep them growing and looking good until they matured completely. 5" or bigger Discus normally could take twice a week waterchanges but still prefer really clean water.
Also, planted Discus tanks really aren't the best idea IMO. The plants and substrate make it more difficult to get all the gunk out of the tank when doing a waterchange. Again, larger Discus do better in planted tanks because tolerate less than pristine conditions better.
If you want go for a heavily planted tank and not have to do much work on it I suggest looking into Angelfish. They are awesome fish and come in a variety of colors and patterns. But you need to do quite a bit of research into plants and how you are going to set it up before you think about fish.

 

[ggrillo]

Thanks Aquat! That "Through the Distance" tank is exactly the style I was looking into. I've had freshwater tanks before with a few plants that did really well. For bulbs I would probably run 50/50 with 10,000K and 6,500K.

Jonathan, Thanks for the input. I don't have a problem doing daily water changes, it having to mix up saltwater and match it with the tank daily that I don't like so much haha. I don't want a heavily planted tank but was thinking of driftwood in the corners and maybe a large anubia on the side or the background. I'd like to keep most of the substrate opened. I'll keep reading about keeping them.

 

[Ostara]

I had an 80 gallon planted discus tank and my biggest piece of advice (related to what RogueAgent said) is to buy large, mature discus from the start. Order them from a quality breeder and don't mess around with the pet store varieties. Kenny's Discus is where I got mine and he is excellent; his discus come from Forrest. He operates mostly off of one of the main discus forums (Simply Discus, if I recall correctly). He gets a shipment in each month and you can pick what you want; he'll then ship them just like LiveAquaria does and for a decent rate. I did this and had a tank full of good looking fish that did fine with three water changes a week. They are cichilds, so make sure you get a group to start. Six would be ideal, but four or five should work if you want to wait on specific colors/varieties. Less tends to cause problems.

Also, a hose that hooks up to your sink is your best friend with these guys.

 

[scolley]

Having a nice planted tank is hard. Having a tank of healthy discus is hard. Putting the two together, having done neither, is a recipe for disaster. Failure - or at best a really crappy outcome - is almost guarenteed.

Do one or the other, THEN decide if you want to try the far more difficult path.

PS - I have a heavily planted discus tank that's pretty old. Can be done. But you MUST know what you are doing. And that generally takes experience.

 

[ggrillo]

Ostara, thanks I'll check them out. And I have a hose right outside my window that reaches my tank.
Scolly, I've kept African chiclids before I went to a reef tank and didn't have any trouble with that. I also had a small 10 gallon with a betta and plants that were overgrowing the whole thing.

I guess I'm just tired of the reef tank and want something that looks a little cleaner.

 

[scolley]

Scolly, I've kept African chiclids before I went to a reef tank and didn't have any trouble with that.

Well technically discus are new world cichlids. But they are not a fish that is easy to keep well. It's easy to keep marginally healthy discus. But not robust ones. I don't mean you can't. Sure you can. It's just work. And lots of research and learning with the inevitable problems. But if you can keep a decent reef, you can keep discus - to be sure. And if you can keep a decent reef - you can keep a planted tank - to be sure. It's putting the two together that's the problem.

If it's just an anubias or two in a pot or tied to some driftwood, that's no harder than keeping discus. I would not dissuade you from that. But discus in a truely planted tank is very hard. How many GOOD, LONG TERM planted discus tanks have you seen?

Again, if you can keep a decent reef, I'm sure you can do it. But I hold fast on my prediction that you will fail if you try your hand at both - for the first time - at the same time. You could beat the odds, but that's what it would be - winning a long shot.

 

[ggrillo]

Well technically discus are new world cichlids. But they are not a fish that is easy to keep well. It's easy to keep marginally healthy discus. But not robust ones. I don't mean you can't. Sure you can. It's just work. And lots of research and learning with the inevitable problems. But if you can keep a decent reef, you can keep discus - to be sure. And if you can keep a decent reef - you can keep a planted tank - to be sure. It's putting the two together that's the problem.

If it's just an anubias or two in a pot or tied to some driftwood, that's no harder than keeping discus. I would not dissuade you from that. But discus in a truely planted tank is very hard. How many GOOD, LONG TERM planted discus tanks have you seen?

Again, if you can keep a decent reef, I'm sure you can do it. But I hold fast on my prediction that you will fail if you try your hand at both - for the first time - at the same time.

Thanks! That's what I want to hear! I have no problem keeping a thriving reef tank. Really I guess I don't want a fully planted tank, but rather mostly a hardscape (rocks and driftwood) with a few plants to fill things in and bring in some greens.

 

[scolley]

I guess I'm just tired of the reef tank and want something that looks a little cleaner.

Go take a look at the the AquariumDesignGroup web site. On the very first page Jeff Senske has put together a discus tank that IMO is very clean looking, requires no more maintenance and/or knowledge than a discus tank, and is not nearly as boring as discus in a glass cube.

It's simple. Clean. And a great starting point.

 

[ggrillo]

Yes! That is actually the tank that got me started on wanting a discus tank! I'd want to have a layout very similar to that with maybe a few small plants here and there. Possibly some moss on the ends of the branches (if any will grow in the conditions)

 

[scolley]

...with a few plants to fill things in and bring in some greens.

If you decide to do that, and if you are interested, pls send me a PM and I'll send you some beautiful Taiwan moss that you can tie to driftwood or rocks with green thread (which no one can see). It will green up your tank, accepts a wide range of light, grows like a weed, takes virtually no maintenance except the occasional trim. And is so hearty that it's your planted version of a canary in a coal mine. If the moss is not growing, you can bet your bottom dollar that higher order plants would not.

And if it IS growing (likely) it's lovely. Just lemme know.

 

[ggrillo]

This is the look I'd be going for, by Jeff Senske also.
Probably even less plants than this.

 

[ggrillo]

If you decide to do that, and if you are interested, pls send me a PM and I'll send you some beautiful Taiwan moss that you can tie to driftwood or rocks with green thread (which no one can see). It will green up your tank, accepts a wide range of light, grows like a weed, takes virtually no maintenance except the occasional trim. And is so hearty that it's your planted version of a canary in a coal mine. If the moss is not growing, you can bet your bottom dollar that higher order plants would not.

And if it IS growing (likely) it's lovely. Just lemme know.

Thanks for all the input, I'll keep that in mind.

 

[scolley]

No can do in a first discus tank. My opinion. Famous tank called "Heiko's Lesson" as I recall.

Those Amazon Sword plants take a lot of light and a lot of fertilization to keep healthy. You CAN achieve that by putting them in pots of fertilized soil. But that's a bit harder than it sounds. The alternative is planting them in fertilized substrate (now it gets even harder) or soaking up nutrition though the water column (harder still). You discus will not provide enough nutrients for that much green life to remain green.

Beautiful tank, but is a great example of what I believe cannot be done by a discus/plant beginner.

 

[Aquat]

No can do in a first discus tank. My opinion. Famous tank called "Heiko's Lesson" as I recall.

Those Amazon Sword plants take a lot of light and a lot of fertilization to keep healthy. You CAN achieve that by putting them in pots of fertilized soil. But that's a bit harder than it sounds. The alternative is planting them in fertilized substrate (now it gets even harder) or soaking up nutrition though the water column (harder still). You discus will not provide enough nutrients for that much green life to remain green.

Beautiful tank, but is a great example of what I believe cannot be done by a discus/plant beginner.

I would have to respectfully disagree. Amazon Swords lighting requirement are quite low, and they're extremely hardy. But yes, they are heavy rooters. They feed mainly from their roots. So, an enriched nutrient filled substrate is a must. But this goes for any plant. Root tabs would be an excellent supplement for swords. Just place some around the roots. If you see the sword leaves begin to say, 'yellow'. No fear, just snip them off. And as long as you see healthy green vibrant NEW growth. It should be fine. Just because an aquarium looks perfect doesn't mean it is.

Personally, I find that certain layout to be nothing too advance. It contains mainly beginner friendly plants, and simple hardscape.

 

[Ostara]

I would have to respectfully disagree. Amazon Swords lighting requirement are quite low, and they're extremely hardy. But yes, they are heavy rooters. They feed mainly from their roots. So, an enriched nutrient filled substrate is a must. But this goes for any plant. Root tabs would be an excellent supplement for swords. Just place some around the roots. If you see the sword leaves begin to say, 'yellow'. No fear, just snip them off. And as long as you see healthy green vibrant NEW growth. It should be fine. Just because an aquarium looks perfect doesn't mean it is.

Personally, I find that certain layout to be nothing too advance. It contains mainly beginner friendly plants, and simple hardscape.

+1. Swords are simple to keep, and a good substrate makes them even more so. I can't recall ever doing anything for mine except trying to keep them from growing out of the water. I did have CO2 supplementation for the other, more finicky plants though. I considered my first planted discus tank very simple, but it was definitely more complicated than that one.

 

[scolley]

I would have to respectfully disagree. Amazon Swords lighting requirement are quite low, and they're extremely hardy.

I think you misunderstood. I didn't say they were a high light plant. I said they took high light. Which is true if we are comparing a tank that keeps Amazon Swords healthy to a tank with the lower levels of light that discus are most comfortable under.

I've said my two cents. Will close by giving a big +1 to Ostra's discus sourcing/size/quantity recommendations.

Good luck ggrillo.

 

[atreis]

I tried a planted discus tank some years back - CO2 injection, RO water, iron-rich substrate for the plants, as well lit (but different spectrum) as a reef tank (the focus being on the plants, really)...

It was bloody hard. Discus are really particular. I've actually had more success with reef tanks. On the other hand, as others have said, a discus tank that happens to have a few hardy plants in it is likely to be easier. I ended up not going that route though. I left the tank planted, but switched to angels and gouramis. That worked too, and it was neat watching the many broods of baby angels.

I shut it down and parted it out when I moved five years ago, and haven't set up a freshwater tank in my new house.