Hello, I have a 75 gallon tank. i have 7 fish in there right now and 2 piece of coral and one cleaner shrimp. I added a blue tang last week and it was fine for the first week and now i see that it has ich . the ich always appear at night and sometime its gone in the morning. please help me how can i cure the ich. I really don't want to set up a QT. I don't have any live rock in the tank, just marco dry rock. I was wondering if i can remove the coral and shrimp and do the copper treatment. I just added a UV and been feeding the fish with garlic extreme. Please help me . Thanks in advance .
First time dealing with ich . NEED HELP!
- Thread starter jason89
- Start date
Deinonych
New member
The only ways to treat for ich are copper, hyposalinity or tank transfer. Treating your DT with copper creates a host of problems. You are better off setting up a QT, treating your fish, and letting the DT go fallow for 12 weeks. If you try to use copper in the DT, your rocks will absorb some of it making it 1.) difficult to control the concentration and 2.) hazardous/deadly for any invertebrates you put into the system after treatment.
Setting up a QT is not expensive or difficult. You will need to stay on top of water changes unless you have some seeded media (sponges, filter floss etc.), but other than that, it's not a big deal.
Setting up a QT is not expensive or difficult. You will need to stay on top of water changes unless you have some seeded media (sponges, filter floss etc.), but other than that, it's not a big deal.
jduck
Member
Using copper in the system will cause issues with trying to keep inverts/corals in the future.
Look at getting a small tank to put coral and shrimp into. Treat it with Chloroquine phosphate, does not harm biological filter. Although it will kill any algae in the system. Or Hyposalinity
Look at getting a small tank to put coral and shrimp into. Treat it with Chloroquine phosphate, does not harm biological filter. Although it will kill any algae in the system. Or Hyposalinity
MrTuskfish
Team RC
Do you mean copper with the rock and substrate will cause issues? I agree. I hope you were't referring to the old myth that copper makes a tank itself unusable because its absorbed by silicone or glass. Cupramine copper will not wipe out a bio-filter. I like CP too, I'm a recent't semi-convert. (Still use copper with my own fish.)
To the OP: If you won't use a QT/HT for disease and new fish, this isn't the best hobby for you. I hate to be so blunt. But, IMO & IME, a QT is vital for long-term success; not an optional accessory.
jamesbaur13
Apsiring Alhcohlolic
What fish do you have in there? When did you add the very first fish to your tank?
The Plummer
New member
+100 on that statement. I was there 20 years ago. My daughters convinced me to give it another go recently.
Things were going great, till I got bit by the inevitable ick bug. I didn't want to do the EXTRA work, expense, second or third tank setup, but I knew from past experience that most "medications" are snake oil, and copper treatments are a pain to do without killing your patient.
Face it you've got one incideous killer in your system, and there's only one thing to do about it to really FIX IT, so you NEVER have to deal with it again.
It's just like losing weight, you must change your thinking at its core.
Now I'm all about working smarter, not harder and I believe my new protocol is effective 100% and as easy and inexpensive as any. I'll outline it for you, both to help you and to bounce my ideas off others, to improve my protocol:
1. Purchase 2 new food grade 5 gallon buckets and lids, white in color,($10),3 tetra HT10 heaters ($45), 3- petco king 160 power heads ($45), 2 suction cup feeding clips($5), 2 all glass aquariums (I chose 10 gal as mu fish and population are small)($26), 1HOB filter(had extras in my case), 1 20 lb bag of sugar fine sand ($18).
2. Set up one 10 gal aquarium with all the sand, one heater, filter, and power head. Add water and new salt. I added 1 cube of frozen lysis shrimp to start bacteria culture.
3. Fill buckets with fresh saltwater, add heater and pumps, adjust salinity to 1.020. Don't try to match salinity to DT, as long as DT IS HIGHER THAN 1.020.
4. Wait 24 hrs for water in buckets to age slightly. Use air injection on power head to keep oxygenation as high as possible.
5. Pull all finned fish from DT and SLOWLY drop acclimate them to one of the buckets, while drip acclimating, set second bucket higher than first bucket and acclimate into the first bucket, as your going to use about half of the water from the first bucket and it needs to be replaced.
I use a small 1 gallon trash can to acclimate the fish to the bucket, 1/2 full of DT water to start, drip till full (30 minutes or so), dump off half of acclimation water, and acclimate till full again.
Catch fish with a white small plastic butter dish. They can't see white very well and once in the dish, they stay as they like the confines of the dish.
Pour off all water from dish back into 1 gal container, using another butter dish, collect a small amount of water from the first bucket and pour it over the caught fish to rinse him of any remaining contaminated DT water. Pour off rinse water into acclimation container and place fish into the first 5 gal bucket. Place lid over bucket and don't feed for 12 hours. Feed lightly twice a day for next three days (72 hrs), add ammonia stabilizer at first feeding.
Now add new water to second bucket, power head and heater and set aside.
I know this sounds daunting, but by prepping properly at the first transfer, it gets really easy from here.
7. After 71 hours, feed fish rather heavily. On 72 hours, catch fish in white butter dish, pour off tank water, and rinse fish with another dish of new water. Pour off the rinse water into the first bucket and place fish into second bucket.
72 hour clock starts again. Dump old water from first bucket and refill with hot fresh water, add small amount of vinager and run power head in solution for a hour or so. Meanwhile, add all contaminated equipment to vinager water (heater,butter dish, bucket lid needs to be laid upside down and vinegar water poured into it to disinfect. Scrub all items with brush and rinse with hot water in bathtub. Allow to air dry 24 hours before making new salt water solution again. Add heater and power head (with air injector operating).
Repeat this process for 5 consecutive 72 hour transfers, then place fish in the set up QT. remember to check ammonia levels and add enough prime to neutralize toxicity. Monitor fish health, water paramaters, and do regular water changes for remaining 11 weeks of fallow time for DT before placing fish back into DT.
You will have completely eradicated the ick parasite from your life if you do this.
Nice thing is, now you have all equipment necessary to complete the process of tank transfer for ANY FUTURE ADDITIONS to your DT.
I never mentioned what to do with the second glass aquarium. It's there as a bare bottom hospital tank, only to be set up if during the quarantine, you have a fish get really sick during the TTM and quarantine time:
I feel this is the easiest, cheapest method to eradicate ICK once and for all from your life.
Good luck
Thanks for all the help. I bought this fish from a local guy . I told him that I didn't have a qt tank, so after he ordered the fish, he put the fish in his qt tank to monitor it. Then he called and told me the fish is healthy and he feed the fish for me to see it eats good. It was a healthy fish with nice color and everything , it was eating good.
I have a question, even if you put the fish in Qt and everything, what if it still gets ich later . Do we have to put all the fish in the Qt and repeat the process every time a fish get ich?
I have a question, even if you put the fish in Qt and everything, what if it still gets ich later . Do we have to put all the fish in the Qt and repeat the process every time a fish get ich?
The Plummer
New member
If one fish exhibits ick again, hopefully while in QT, yes all inhabitants are still infected and have to go through the bucket transfer again. But, if you follow the advice of doing 5 tank transfers before going into QT, virtually all possibility of any parasite existing is eliminated.
The toughest part of this is maintaining your fish in a small QT for the remaining 11 week fallow time, which is longer than most recommend, but I figure that you've already gone so far as 6 to ten weeks fallow to achieve 99% chance of eradication, why not go a little longer to achieve a true 100%.
My studies claim that a cyst can survive up to 72 days in dormancy, add the up to 48 hrs free swimming stage, why not add three extra days just as insurance.
The Plummer
New member
One more thing, he may have QT'ed the fish for you, but he did NOTHING to eliminate the parasite from what was probably at best, just a ick resistant carrier of the disease. The bucket transfer method is the only way to ensure eradication, without meds.
Rmember that, ALL FISH THAT YOU GET FROM SOMEONE ELSE WILL HAVE ICK and MUST be tank transfered yourself. If you don't take this attitude, your just playing Russian roulette with all chambers loaded.
Oh ok . My question is that if I put all the fish in the QT to treat the ich and put them back in the DT after leaving it fishless for 10 weeks. What if one fish get ich again after a couple months, do I have to repeat the whole process again? Since tang is ich magnet , I was wondering if the QT will get rid of ich for good and it will never get ich again? Thanks for your help
if u qt properly and treat fish properly along with leaving the main tank fishless for 12 weeks chances are ur system will be ich free. but if any shortcuts are applied them no guarantees.
i have more than 30 fish in my main tank. all qt'ed at first and treated. now been in my main tank with no ick or other parasites.
i have more than 30 fish in my main tank. all qt'ed at first and treated. now been in my main tank with no ick or other parasites.
The Plummer
New member
Ick isn't caused by stress, it's a parasite. If its in your water colmn you've got it PERIOD. It may not show itself until stress brings a lowered immunity, but you still have it.
Once you make the decision to eradicate it, it won't be there no matter how stressed your fish get.
u will have to get all the fish out of the main tank.... tank has to stay fishless for 10-12 weeks. remove all but few inches of water its easier to catch fish like that.
u can always use hyposalinity to cure ur fish if copper is a problem.
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2300497
u can always use hyposalinity to cure ur fish if copper is a problem.
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2300497
The Plummer
New member
With the bucket tank transfer no medication is necessary. I have read that a dosing of PRAZIPRO will eradicate other parasites and diseases, such as velvet.
From my prior experience copper treatments are tricky at best, and the copper is toxic to the liver of the fish.
I have not personally tried hypo salinity (exactly 1.009) but from what I've read, PH is difficult to maintain at that low salinity. Also it's hard to maintain the exact salinity. Go above 1.009 and you have to start over. Also, some strains of ick are resistant to hypo salinity. Sounds too touchy and iffy for me to try, especially since the transfer method is 100% sound.
The reason I profess keeping salinity at 1.020 is due to the limited water in a bucket during transfer, and the lower salinity has a higher oxygen saturation and that is a stress reducer. It's also easier on a fish to acclimate from a higher salinity to a lower one.
I'm considering maintaining 1.020 in my DT permanently as its healthier for the fish and corals anyway.
Deinonych
New member
Prazipro is an antihelmintic only (flukes, worms etc.) It will not treat marine velvet. You need copper to treat for velvet.
The Plummer
New member
Thanks for that info, I went on a quest to locate Prazipro the other day and no one seemed to know about the product. Seems like many whom participate in this hobby, in my general area, are really very knowledgable in what really works.
Example, I've been using a remote DSB with fantastic results and when I share my results with even LFS owners all I get is the deer in the headlights look. Then I get some crap about how it won't work that isn't logical.
Not to mention the false belief that ick is naturally occurring and cannot be eliminated. I'm beginning to think most LFS want you to continue to have problems so they can lead you to more unnecessary purchases.
Lots of "snake oil" out there, that's why I'm so glad I happened on this forum.
Deinonych
New member
I know what you mean. I've had a LFS employee tell me that using a sump is doing things "the hard way," and that it will flood if I ever have a power outage. When I try to explain the use of siphon breaks and a redundant overflow (I use the BeanAnimal design), I get the same "deer in the headlights" look. Needless to say, I don't take any of his advice.
I do like to frequent said LFS now, just to see what ridiculous things this employee will say. Last time, he said that chromis are more difficult to care for than anthias.
I do like to frequent said LFS now, just to see what ridiculous things this employee will say. Last time, he said that chromis are more difficult to care for than anthias.
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