Hair Algae problem with a twist

[subman719]

Ok, here's my problem: I have a hair algae problem and am following almost all of the recommended procedures I've found in these threads. Here's the twist: In addition to the other procedures listed, I'm using Marc Weiss Organics Algae Magic but not only is it killing off the hair algae, it's killing my Chaeto Algae in my sump. I removed the Chaeto and put it in a 10 gal "quarantine" tank with just a MJ-400 power head to keep it stirring along with a 50/50 bulb. Over night my water turned extremely green so now I'm worried that I'm still killing off my Chaeto. Any ideas on what I should do? Thank's

 

[graveyardworm]

First I would quit using the product. I cant imagine what might be in it, who knows what kind of damage it may be doing to your system overall. Next you can either try to stick it out with the cheato you already have or toss it and start new. Get the refugium going, remove as much of the HA as you can by hand and look into getting a good herbivore or two if you dont already have them.

Can you list what is currently present in the tank for herbivores, tank water parameters, lighting, and feeding.

 

[subman719]

The Algae Magic is supposed to be "all natural" and just increase oxygenation to kill off the food source for the algae. I have an extensive cleanup crew: well over a hundred various snails and hermits, 4 mithrax crabs (which love to eat my hermits, snails, and soft corals...go figure), 6 peppermint shrimp (which also eat the "wrong" stuff), a blue tang and a yellow tang. This is pretty much my supposed "herbivore" group which all don't touch the hair algae! I had reduced lighting to 6 hours actinic and 4 hours 10k for the past month... no help. I just came out of a 4 day "lights out" period in both the tank and refugium along with adding a phosban reactor and a UV sterilizer on top of my already heavy wet skimming with ozone. The hair algae is also growing in my refugium and on the chaeto so I should probably toss it now that's it's about a third of it's original size and half dead. Phosphate level was close to zero-I'm sure because of all the algae and nitrates are about 40-50 ppm. I've never been able to get below that. My hair algae problem isn't nearly as bad as many photos I've seen on here but it's killing off many of my sps and acropora's. That's my main concern. I've been brushing it off the corals with a toothbrush but I think it's too late, plus I'm almost sure the toothbrushing can't be good either! I'm running about 300 watts power compacts, was running 400 until the algae started many months ago then I cut back. I know this all started due to me seriously over feeding (heavily twice a day). About 3 months ago I cut back to once a day (but still too heavy) and now I'm lightly target feeding everyone. I know many people recommend once every two days but I can't find it in me to do that! The poor things are always looking for food! I've been plucking the algae but it does come back. Maybe if I keep up up with this regimen it will go away. I am thinking of putting a little kalkwasser on the algae but I'm concerned about putting my pH through the roof too fast. Ok, I think I've written enough for now! LOL

 

[graveyardworm]

Here's a description I found online for the product.

Stimulates oxygenation which eliminates the food sources for nuisance algae.
Enhances clarity of the tank by eliminating the food sources for nuisance algae blooms (including green hair, brown diatom and red slime)
Not harmful to fish, plants, corals, rocks and other living organisms in the aquarium
Does not contain copper sulfate
Algae MagicTM is 100% organic. It takes the natural chemistry of the past and transforms it to the present. Clarity of the water relates directly to a water-balanced tank. Algae MagicTM provides the ability to lower the food supply of the nuisance algae. This event can take a short amount of time but it is not instantaneous. The objective of the formulation allows the desired plant growth to deal with wastes in the tank to more efficiently maintain better oxygenation. As the increased aerobic conditions of the tank predominate, nuisance algae will still exist (because this is the natural state of the life cycle), however, they will not predominate and cause displeasing aesthetics.

Algae MagicTM when added to your tank will fortify your plants` leaf structure. The by-product of this effect enhances oxygenation within the tank and adds an additional food source for animal life. As the plants and microscopic creatures respond to the enhanced environment, the tank naturally clears of visible wastes and nuisance algae â€"œ creating an awesome view.

I dont want to try to pick apart the product because I honestly cant figure out how something which

Stimulates oxygenation which eliminates the food sources for nuisance algae.

can actually work. I can only imagine it somehow works on the same principle as Vodka or sugar dosing, and drives bacteria to utilize nutrients and compete with algae. Only it doesnt make sense cause one of the issues that sometimes goes along with using bacteria is oxygen depletion.

Again I would discontinue use of the product. There are lots of different types of algae found within our tanks much of which are beneficial to you're tanks inhabitants. By eliminating all the algae in your tank you are signing a death warrant for all of your herbivores. As you stated the HA is likely the result of overfeeding and high nutrients. That is where I would concentrate my efforts. There is no miricle cure otherwise everybody would be using it. The Marc Weiss product has one purpose and that is to seperate you from your money. Good husbandry, your more than adequate herbivore crew, competition for available nutrients, and some patience will get you past your HA problem. Dont waste your time trying to kalk the HA, you'll never get it all so until the underlying problems are addressed it will continue to come back.

 

[subman719]

Thank's David. I'll just keep up with your recommendations and what I'm doing. I did also read this article which hopefully can help me.
http://www.melevsreef.com/gha.html
Due to the amount of HA in my refugium and on the chaeto, I'm going to clean it out and start fresh. I probably wouldn't mind the HA in the tank if it wasn't killing my corals. Any insight on that? Can I continue to brush them off with a toothbrush or is that going to also kill them? I do have another question. I noticed from your pictures that you have a mangrove tank. What's the purpose/advantage to having mangroves. I see them used a lot in refugiums and was considering adding them to mine. Do they actually serve a functional purpose or are they just cosmetic? Thanks again for your help and time! Bob

 

[graveyardworm]

My mangrove is strictly novelty, there's no real benefit to a having a single mangrove or even a few. In a mangrove biotope tank they would be appropriate and would serve a function.

 

[Beth J]

I had the start of hair algae. I got a long spiny sea urchin and he is like the coolest lawn mower you ever saw. I have no hair algae visible anymore. But after I got him I found this thread and figured I would try it if my hair algae came back. It my be worth a try for you.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1113109&perpage=25&pagenumber=1

 

[graveyardworm]

The link posted is for Bryopsis not Derbesia ( HA ) unless some where in there Derbesia is also discussed. I havent read the entire discussion so perhaps its in there.

 

[subman719]

I thought about getting an urchin some time ago but I had a couple of maidens hair and shaving brush plants that I was afraid would get eaten by it. Turns out, my lettuce nudibranches and mythrax crabs ate the plants and then the crabs and power heads ate the the lettuce nudibranches. I haven't replaced any of those since then so maybe getting an urchin could be a good idea now. I may also experiment with the magnesium trick just to see what happens.

 

[smatter]

Don't get a tuxedo urchin, mine is not interested at all in the derbesia in my tank, he prefers coralline. It is very cool though, especially when I throw little lego man hats in the tank and the urchin wears them.

 

[subman719]

It's funny, I was just thinking of getting a couple Tuxedo Urchins to hopefully help solve my problem. I probably wouldn't care so much about the hair algae if it wasn't killing my corals! I've already lost about 10 frags due to being smothered or possibly from me brushing of the algae with a toothbrush. I've also had to throw out my chaeto because it was dead and smothered in HA and I'm going to have to do a complete teardown of my sump/refugium because it's infested. I'm really at a loss here.

 

[shilo_1]

I feel your pain, although I don't want the HA in my tank, even if it wasn't harming anything ! lol

What urchin will eat HA ? I'm willing to get one, I think they are cool, and don't mind them muching on coralline either.

Tagging along....

 

[Beth J]

I got a black long spiny sea urchin. He mowed it down to the bare rock. I read that is the only way to really get rid of the HA. He sure did a great job.

 

[Beth J]

Efrain in Chicago has one he is trying to give away. Here is the thread. http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1332172