Have to nuke my tank

[EddieJ]

As I have lost the battle to aiptasia I need to nuke my tank and start over. They are everywhere. I have a 210 gallon display with 60 gallons in the basement. First, how much bleach should I put in to ensure death to all those thousands of bastards? Then after a drain and refill with tap water I need to add some muriatic acid to dissolve coralline and millions of vermatid snails.. Thoughts?

 

[jdstank]

Giving up? Get some Lysmata wurdemanni and they'll take them out. Saltwaterfish.com has that species of peppermints, most lfs that I tried did not carry that species and they are really the only ones that touch aptasia. Adding bleach and acid is going to ruin the rock and only cause more problems when you try to restart. For what you'll spend in bleach, acid, and Excedrin to take care of the ensuing headaches you can get 10 pepps and let them feast! It only took 4 of them in a 75g for me several years back to wipe out hundreds of those dang things in a matter of about 2 weeks.

 

[EddieJ]

I have triggers so the shrimp are just expensive dinners lol! They are large and way to numerous at this point to have a predator do the trick. I put 200 bucks in berghia in and that didn't work. Taking the rock out, that is not a concern.

 

[blennieluvr]

The Science Center in Bemidji, MN where I live had them bad too. I thought for sure they'd have to tear down, acid bath the rock and start over. Someone recommended a ffilfefish. Done. Tank looks great!

 

[jdstank]

I have triggers so the shrimp are just expensive dinners lol! They are large and way to numerous at this point to have a predator do the trick. I put 200 bucks in berghia in and that didn't work. Taking the rock out, that is not a concern.

Ah that sucks, but I suppose the triggers would love you for it!
Have you tried kalkpaste yet? Or how about Joe's Juice I believe it's called.

 

[jdstank]

The Science Center in Bemidji, MN where I live had them bad too. I thought for sure they'd have to tear down, acid bath the rock and start over. Someone recommended a ffilfefish. Done. Tank looks great!

That may work too, Matted filefish are known for taking out aptasia. They not reef safe fish anyway so being in a predator tank will just add some more variety. Very cool looking fish!

 

[Technoreef2013]

Filefish rock. Mine took care of an aptasia problem pretty quick. They're like pigs in truffles! However, you probably want to check the compatibility of them with your triggers. I have a Piccasso trigger that's [profanity] ran my filefish all over so I had to move him to another tank.

 

[jdstank]

Filefish rock. Mine took care of an aptasia problem pretty quick. They're like pigs in truffles! However, you probably want to check the compatibility of them with your triggers. I have a Piccasso trigger that's [profanity] ran my filefish all over so I had to move him to another tank.

True, all fish are different. I had a picasso who lived in harmony with a tiny clown forever. Even when he was 8x's his size he was best buds and would even protect/guard him when I reached in for cleaning. Matted's are pretty docile fish.

 

[JavyJaverson]

i eliminated both vermatids and aiptasia from my display by dropping the salinity to 1.009. i did it for about a month but i'm certain they died at about the 1 week mark. Just drop slowly to avoid ammonia spikes.

 

[dkeller_nc]

Of course, since you will have to remove the triggers (and all other fish) from the tank anyway to "nuke" it, there's really no reason not to move the triggers to another tank and give the peppermint shrimp a try. It's worth a shot, and cheap.

 

[EddieJ]

Would the acid treatment just be enough without the need for bleach? I was thinking around 20 gallons of muriatic acid, that would be roughly a 1:10 ratio. Or would 10 gallons be sufficient to dissolve/soften the millions of vermatid snail pipes on my overflows? Should I drain out the saltwater before and refill with tap water or just add it to the existing water? I have used Muriatic over the years so I am very familiar with it's dangers/odors/etc.. Once again, the rocks and sand will not be in it as I am going with all new rock. I want to clean-up the overflows which are loaded with vermatids and aiptasia growing out of the slots (between the double wall on a AGA reef-ready. My other option is to drain it, and spray the heavily infested area with bleach, then scrap and clean. But that doesn't address snail calcium I want to dissolve. Maybe spray vinegar? or a muriatic acid solution and then scrap them after sometime? This is being done in the family room on the stand, not tearing the plumbing out and removing the tank. There is plenty of ventilation in the area, but I don't want to let it sit and rot, bleach/vinegar and hell, even muriatic acid smell better then low tide! And yes, I am aware of the muriatic acid fumes as it's coming out of the bottle.

 

[dkeller_nc]

You may be familiar with Hydrochloric Acid, but it doesn't really sound like it, or you have a very different risk calculation than most of us.

But to answer your questions:

1) You should drain your tank of seawater before adding the acid. While acidic saltwater would still work to dissolve calcium carbonate snail tubes, coralline algae, etc..., you're asking for a huge foaming problem as the initial acid works to neutralize the saltwater's alkalinity.

2) 1N HCl is far too strong for what you're planning on - circulating it through your tank in a living space. 1N HCl (which is about what you'll get by diluting concentrated HCl 1:10) is still quite dangerous - it will violently react with calcium carbonate, will burn your skin, eyes, and mucous membranes, and having 220 gallons of it inside your family room is extraordinarily risky.

3) You can spray vinegar if you wish, but vinegar is quite slow at dissolving calcium carbonate. It could well take 10 or more applications and few days to accomplish your goals.

The best solution to your problem is to simply disassemble the tank, sump and plumbing, get some friends to help you move the tank outside, and wash it out with 0.1N HCl (with face and hand protection).

If you insist on not moving the tank, the safest thing for you and your family would be to make 1N HCl outside by diluting concentrated HCl 1:10, and adding 20 gallons of this to your 220 after you've filled it with tap water. Doing a two-step dilution like this will drastically cut down on the hydrogen chloride gas that will otherwise fill your house, and be somewhat safer in the event of a spill.

 

[toothybugs]

You may be familiar with Hydrochloric Acid, but it doesn't really sound like it, or you have a very different risk calculation than most of us.

But to answer your questions:

1) You should drain your tank of seawater before adding the acid. While acidic saltwater would still work to dissolve calcium carbonate snail tubes, coralline algae, etc..., you're asking for a huge foaming problem as the initial acid works to neutralize the saltwater's alkalinity.

2) 1N HCl is far too strong for what you're planning on - circulating it through your tank in a living space. 1N HCl (which is about what you'll get by diluting concentrated HCl 1:10) is still quite dangerous - it will violently react with calcium carbonate, will burn your skin, eyes, and mucous membranes, and having 220 gallons of it inside your family room is extraordinarily risky.

3) You can spray vinegar if you wish, but vinegar is quite slow at dissolving calcium carbonate. It could well take 10 or more applications and few days to accomplish your goals.

The best solution to your problem is to simply disassemble the tank, sump and plumbing, get some friends to help you move the tank outside, and wash it out with 0.1N HCl (with face and hand protection).

If you insist on not moving the tank, the safest thing for you and your family would be to make 1N HCl outside by diluting concentrated HCl 1:10, and adding 20 gallons of this to your 220 after you've filled it with tap water. Doing a two-step dilution like this will drastically cut down on the hydrogen chloride gas that will otherwise fill your house, and be somewhat safer in the event of a spill.

From one chemist to another, thank you!

HCl in a full salt tank is a huge (dangerous) mess waiting to happen, and will dissolve your sand and rock like nobody's business - think "vinegar and baking soda volcano" only on a grander, more wicked scale. Just use a liter of bleach if you must and let it circulate. There are many ways to neutralize bleach, hydrogen peroxide is one safe way but if you're going to remove your sand and rock, heating bleach destroys it too. Using hydrogen peroxide can leave residual peroxide behind which will be detrimental to life in the future. Heat takes care of bleach nicely with no foul leftovers. I cleaned up a couple hundred pounds of sandbed once upon a time that way - no nitrates or junk after bleach, wash, and an hour in the oven at 250 (stirred on occasion to let steam escape).

I'm on board with the peppermints or filefish train. If you pull your triggers to QT and rearrange the rock a bit after the filefish has a chance to work, I'd bet you have good luck re-introducing the triggers to the "new" tank with less chance of dominance issues.

 

[dinger28]

Prazipro kills aiptasia as well. Demolished all of it in my tank.

 

[hart24601]

Since you are removing all the rock are relocating the fish why not just let the system sit dry for a week or so? No chemicals at all!

 

[EddieJ]

You may be familiar with Hydrochloric Acid, but it doesn't really sound like it, or you have a very different risk calculation than most of us.

But to answer your questions:

1) You should drain your tank of seawater before adding the acid. While acidic saltwater would still work to dissolve calcium carbonate snail tubes, coralline algae, etc..., you're asking for a huge foaming problem as the initial acid works to neutralize the saltwater's alkalinity.

2) 1N HCl is far too strong for what you're planning on - circulating it through your tank in a living space. 1N HCl (which is about what you'll get by diluting concentrated HCl 1:10) is still quite dangerous - it will violently react with calcium carbonate, will burn your skin, eyes, and mucous membranes, and having 220 gallons of it inside your family room is extraordinarily risky.

3) You can spray vinegar if you wish, but vinegar is quite slow at dissolving calcium carbonate. It could well take 10 or more applications and few days to accomplish your goals.

The best solution to your problem is to simply disassemble the tank, sump and plumbing, get some friends to help you move the tank outside, and wash it out with 0.1N HCl (with face and hand protection).

If you insist on not moving the tank, the safest thing for you and your family would be to make 1N HCl outside by diluting concentrated HCl 1:10, and adding 20 gallons of this to your 220 after you've filled it with tap water. Doing a two-step dilution like this will drastically cut down on the hydrogen chloride gas that will otherwise fill your house, and be somewhat safer in the event of a spill.

And this is why I was asking here in the chemistry forum. Thank you very much for your input.

 

[EddieJ]

Since you are removing all the rock are relocating the fish why not just let the system sit dry for a week or so? No chemicals at all!

Mainly the stench at that point. But that does nothing to clean up the all the vermatid tubes which are sharp as hell. I think the route I am going to take is to drain it down, hit the bad area's of aiptasia with bleach and clean them up to reduce any stench. Like toothbugs said, bleach is pretty easy to get rid of and neutralize. Then I am going to work on softening the snail tubes on the overflows and scrap them off.

 

[EddieJ]

Prazipro kills aiptasia as well. Demolished all of it in my tank.

Really?? wow, never heard of that. I guess test that pretty easily by taking a rock covered in aips and put it in a 10 gallon tank and see what happens..

 

[big al 1967]

Is there any way you could post some pics so we could see how bad of a problem you have.

 

[EnderG60]

I had to bleach all my rocks as well a few years ago.

If your system is running, do it in stages so you dont kill off all the good bacteria at once, or get some new rocks to take up the slack while you recure them.

Just bleaching will kill everything, the acid bath will just melt off the top layers of calcium which is really only needed if you have a phosphate problem. For aptasia I wouldnt bother.

After bleaching, Id do a dip in fresh water and prime(dechlorinator) with a small pump and let it sit for a day or two.

Then a rinse and let it dry for another 2 days and back in the tank.

It will take 4-8 weeks to repopulate with bacteria so keep a close eye on your parameters and be ready to do a bunch of water changes while the system stabilizes(sea chem stability will help as well)