Help me defend our hobby

[AcroporAddict]

Our reefs use a lot of electricity, but 95% of my SPS corals are 3rd generation up captive grown, how's that for being green?

 

[Godzillarex]

I agree with the others, it is just polite manners to not make degrading comments on your host's lifestyle if you are a guest. Also with those kind of people it is more like a religion with them than a logical choice. Any arguement or suggestion that goes counter to their religion they will just disregard. You see it time and time again with the whole organic food debate. And really if they were truely concerned about their carbon footprint, they wouldn't have had a child anyway. The amount of resources needed to raise a child is just mindblowing. What you and the rest of us are doing with our reef tanks is just like what has been said before. We are securing their future, increasing our body of knowledge, and ultimately being closer to nature and thus more aware of it. Can a dog or cat owner say the same thing?

 

[aklee987]

I've dealt with people who are "always right" before, no matter how much information I have at my fingertips. I think that a tent in the backyard is the best option for you, especially if you accidentally turn the water wasting sprinklers on in the middle of the night.

If you can't be a jerk (might make your wife mad), then I've found that agreeing with them while doing exactly what makes them mad is very fun.

"Yes, this tank does waste water. Hold this bucket for me while I do a 30 gallon water change. Thanks."

or

"Yeah, it's horrible that I take animals from nature. Let me show you how to kill this aptasia anemone with kalk. Don't worry, it just melts them."

 

[amehel0]

just put a cloth over it and tell them its an experiment of perpetual motion and free energy that could potentially reduce ones carbon footprint by 98%

 

[greenbean36191]

Don't even try to defend the hobby to them. It's an argument you can't win, even if they were willing to listen. If they can't accept that they are guests in your house and then tell them that you won't accept them as guests in your house and be done with it.

IF you feel the need to defend your hobby, in your own home, you might teach them that our hobby has led to a lot of knowledge that is used in wild reef recovery programs all over the world. In fact, many reefs are being repopulated with coral frags that were "home grown."

Actually, the hobby has very little to to do with the knowledge used in reef recovery programs. They're planned based on knowledge developed from the field and carried out using techniques that were mostly developed over 100 years ago. Coral propagation and captive grow-out wasn't invented by hobbyists.

Also, there are no restoration programs using home-grown corals from the hobby, nor are these corals suitable for restoration work. We won't touch them with a 10 foot pole because we can't verify their origins, what parasites and diseases they might have come into contact with, or sometimes even what species they are.

Too many hobbyists try to justify their hobby by saying that they're going to be the saviors of the reefs when the reefs are gone. It's not gonna happen. Once the reefs are gone in the wild, they're gone for good. Even if we wanted to use captive corals to restock them, it's not a viable plan once the reefs have been wiped out. The best hobbyists can hope to do is to house the last examples of species which are extinct in the wild.

Hobbyists as a whole need to stop trying to justify what we do. It's not an environmentally friendly hobby no matter how you look at it. Despite what people try to convince themselves of, we're not doing it to educate others. We're not doing it to save the reefs (and if that were our motivation we would be failing miserably). We're doing it because we enjoy it. It's a hobby- nothing more and nothing less.

 

[BIGG D]

Hobbyists as a whole need to stop trying to justify what we do. It's not an environmentally friendly hobby no matter how you look at it.We're doing it because we enjoy it. It's a hobby- nothing more and nothing less.

The painful truth.

 

[swiftwing7]

No its not environmentally friendly, but really no human activity is. Unless we become nomads and go back to the stone age we don't really fit in with the balance of the rest of the planet. Since there's no chance of that happening our best bet is to practice moderation and sustainability, as well as rebuilding natural populations. The oceans are a huge place and generate massive amounts of resources for us. But we have to be smart and collect only what we can so it comes back. It is defiantly possible to collect corals from the reef in a sustainable manner and even make artificial reefs to grow as many as we could ever want. Its possible to catch as many fish as we could ever need to eat without building vessels that catch entire schools of tuna. I watched a special on that and it was very disturbing. We learned a long time a go if you kill every cow you go hungry later so we learned to raise them and have sustainable populations. Analyzing ocean populations is much more difficult due to its massive size and because we just cant see everything as easy. We need to educate the population especially in the pacific region about using sustainable methods even though it may take some more cash. Since cutting into profits is bad motivator to most businesses, without government regulation and enforcement it will probably never happen. It's funny how people who are in the hobby, interested in the ocean, or like to fish (all 3 for me) are the ones concerned about sustainability while those seeking profit don't seem to care. (That is a generalization many companies use green methods.) So yes although we harvest fish and corals from the ocean we are also very outspoken activists and do a lot for changing the world and conserving what we have.

I doubt in your in laws will care about that argument either, but I think its good for enthusiasts to know that we do make a difference. Our buying power can send signals to companies that do it right and I'll gladly pay more for collection done sustainably.

 

[bamastunter]

ya, tell them to stay home and save yourself the aggravation.

+1

 

[Wolverine]

I agree with Greenbean. Don't try to defend it, because, from a purely environmental standpoint, this hobby is not really defensible. The education argument and the repopulate the dead reefs argument are pretty flimsy shields.

 

[Michael]

i hate know it alls, best to find out what their interests are, and on christmas day after 10 weeks of study you can shut them up big time about their hobbies lol.

 

[Dingo44]

Sounds like you're going to have an eventful Christmas. I agree with other posters on how you're never going to win a debate with your in laws. I liked the comparison to playing tennis against a brick wall! I would say that your main concern would be to not let your kids be too dissuaded by your in laws. You know they are a little strange, but your kids might take what they say to the bank and start feeling guilty about owning a reef tank. I don't know how old they are but if they are young I would say address your rebuttals to your kids instead of your in laws.

 

[scsuboy18]

Do you think they are going to point their fingers at you and blame that you were the one that had built those pathetic man-made "palm" islands in Dubai? Maybe if they have a problem with what you're doing for pleasure and as a hobby, show them what others in this world are doing to our natural reefs. Did you know that those fabulous multimillion dollar plots of land on those islands are extremely detrimental to the environment? Not only does tons of sediment which became suspended in the waters off the coast starve and suffocate corals, but those islands have also redirected the natural ocean currents--currents to which are imperative to the corals. It's also the use of coastal areas and rebuilding the landscape, which affects more than just the waters but also the land mass itself. It's causes like this that make environmentalists mad, and I don't blame them. ON the contrary, you are only one person and so are they and trust me, their "carbon footprint" (if you call it that) has a neglible impact on the environment as a whole and so is yours--meaning it isn't going to change a single thing either way. You could also educate them on the use of aquacultured fish/corals vs wild caught. If they eat fish, explain to them how humans harvesting fish alters and changes the food chains in the oceans by bringing important species to extinction or pretty close to. That should shut them up or at least make them think about something else. IF they keep on persisting, ask them what makes them happy and then throw it back in their faces as to why you feel it's wrong. I know that's a little harsh, but sometimes people just dont know when to DROP IT! IF they persist even more, show them the way out and then tell them that it's a long bike ride to Al Gores' house.

Also one other thing--I find it a little ignorant to believe that this hobby doesn't promote an education--because it does. It may not be directly correlated to how humans form or operate reef recovery programs--but it makes us aware. If making us aware isn't education--well then I guess I dont know what education means. From experience I can say this hobby has allowed me to think of a lot more than just for myself. That's all.

 

[lordofthereef]

I have a hard time believing you could change their minds on a hobby like this if they don't even own furniture. While I am also against wild caught, I also feel that I have no right to force anyone to believe what I do. As many have said, if they don't like it they can leave.

 

[D to the P]

I would just change the subject really. Tell them how having the tank has made you more aware about what's going on in the ocean and then change the subject to something like the texas-sized garbage pile hanging off the coast of California. You'll never be "right" so I wouldn't even try.

Actually, you know what? It's your house. You do what you want. I would put up 2-3 christmas trees with extra lights. If they don't like it, they can bike their way back home. I'm gonna assume that Crow and his parents are vegans, so I can only imagine what you guys are having to do food wise to meet their needs. Hopefully tofu doesn't have to share the table with the Turkey (or whatever else you guys eat).

 

[jterrell]

I would bet that you are worried about nothing. They may detest your hobby but why are you so concerned about what they think? They may even enjoy your tank but tell you about wasted electricity, water, bla, bla, bla but so what. Enjoy your hobby and maybe change the subject by chopping wood for a Christmas fire. (you could let them hug the tree first)
Hate to say it but Greenbean is right, our hobby is about as "green" as a Hummer idoling in the driveway. We might try to cut down where we can by buying frags and aquacultured live stock and some are using sunlight to light their tanks but as a whole we are using more energy, water and fuel (to get those frags overnight) than if we collected stamps.
I had a conversation with someone similar who said I should ride a bike to work, I then asked her how I should carry 20gal of paint to the work site on my bike?
You are dealing with your brother who you should love but don't feel like you have to live the same way.

 

[Wolverine]

Do you think they are going to point their fingers at you and blame that you were the one that had built those pathetic man-made "palm" islands in Dubai? Maybe if they have a problem with what you're doing for pleasure and as a hobby, show them what others in this world are doing to our natural reefs. Did you know that those fabulous multimillion dollar plots of land on those islands are extremely detrimental to the environment?

If they're like other people I know, they will see those things as morally equivalent, but differing only in degree. Saying that someone else is doing something much worse doesn't justify what we do. As I said before, from an environmental standpoint, there's no good defense for this hobby. It's best to just come to terms with that.

 

[scsuboy18]

We shouldn't have to justify our hobby. "I am a reefkeeper. Therefore I am."

 

[Wolverine]

We shouldn't have to justify our hobby. "I am a reefkeeper. Therefore I am."

I agree. I don't bother justifying it.

 

[BIGG D]

I'm gonna assume that Crow and his parents are vegans, so I can only imagine what you guys are having to do food wise to meet their needs. Hopefully tofu doesn't have to share the table with the Turkey (or whatever else you guys eat).

Very perseptive! Yes...theay are avid vegans. Although it is my understanding that they have recently decided to add FISH to the menu. I dont know much about the thought process there, but that might make for an interesting discussion.
The wife handles most of the food prep and she will most likely make sure there is a bowl of sauteed mushrooms on the table or something. I will make sure to put i next to that big plate of rare roast beast!!!

 

[BIGG D]

They may detest your hobby but why are you so concerned about what they think?

I am not at all concerned about what they think. I just merely wanted to be able to provide some environmentally positive feedback to the guy if he starts up. But you guys are confirming what I guess I already knew.

our hobby is about as "green" as a Hummer idoling in the driveway.

It is...what it is.