dreaminmel
New member
I'm having trouble finding the link for red bug treatment and haven't received any responses here yet... anyone here know?
Other thread
Other thread
Help? Red bugs...
- Thread starter dreaminmel
- Start date
Stephany
New member
dreaminmel
New member
That was definately helpful but didn't have the dosage recommendations I know I've seen here somewhere before... As far as how to calculate how much to use vs. your total volume.
dreaminmel
New member
Ended up w/ the link in the other thread...
Definately red bugs. My actinics come on at 11:30 am and then the daylight starts at 12:30 while I'm home for lunch. Was standing in front of my tank observing my not so hot looking green acro frag, the daylights turn on and Holy Bejeezus look at all those tiny bugs scurrying for cover! My dog even jumped at the noises I started making.
I just did a complete reaquascaping about a week and a half ago and until today had never noticed the bugs but now that everything's been rearranged I've got my sps in more visible locations so I wouldn't be surprised if they've been in there lurking for a little while and I just wasn't able to see them.
Stupid, stupid murphy's law. I think that's the gazillionth time Murphy's ears started ringing this week...
Couple pics... the flash really brings out their beady red heads in contrast to their little yellow bodies.
Grrr....
Definately red bugs. My actinics come on at 11:30 am and then the daylight starts at 12:30 while I'm home for lunch. Was standing in front of my tank observing my not so hot looking green acro frag, the daylights turn on and Holy Bejeezus look at all those tiny bugs scurrying for cover! My dog even jumped at the noises I started making.
I just did a complete reaquascaping about a week and a half ago and until today had never noticed the bugs but now that everything's been rearranged I've got my sps in more visible locations so I wouldn't be surprised if they've been in there lurking for a little while and I just wasn't able to see them.
Stupid, stupid murphy's law. I think that's the gazillionth time Murphy's ears started ringing this week...
Couple pics... the flash really brings out their beady red heads in contrast to their little yellow bodies.
Grrr....
gary greguire
Premium Member
is this the dosage you found? 10mg/25 gallons.
dreaminmel
New member
gary, actually what I found suggests the reverse: 25mg per 10 gal
gary greguire
Premium Member
that seems like alot but I have never done it before. I do Know that you should remove all the shrimp crabs ect.. that you can because it kills them all.
dreaminmel
New member
Gary,
Here's what I'm going by...
"The medication is a DOG heartworm medication called Interceptor, it is only available from a veterinarian with a prescription. The tablets used in the initial treatments were for large dogs, 51-100lbs. These tablets are just under 1 gram each and contain 23mg of Milbemycin Oxime, the rest of it is a lovely smelling beef flavor."
then he says...
"The dosage used in an aquarium to kill redbugs is 25mg (0.025 grams) per 10 gallons of actual tank water . That is 25mg of the entire tablet. Each tablet in the pack of 6 will treat about 380 gallons. The tablets are ground with a mortar and pestle into a fine powder."
So I'm reading this as 950mg (makes sense as a tablet that weighs almost a gram would weigh almost 1000mg) weight to each tablet if it can treat about 380 gallons per tablet so when they discuss the 25mg per 10 gallon dose being a really small amount it's not that they're using the entire "25mg pill" it's that they're grinding it up and weighing out 25 actual mg on a scale... I WAS confused at first thinking well if I'm to dose 25 mg per 10 gall how can a 25mg tablet treat 380 gallons but it's medicine "mg" terminology versus actual mg weight on a scale.
I've calculated my water volume at about 60 gallons after allowing for displacement by rock, sand, etc so will be grinding up one large dog "25mg" tablet and weighing out .150 grams on a scale. (about 15% of the entire tablet)
Hope that helps...
Here's what I'm going by...
"The medication is a DOG heartworm medication called Interceptor, it is only available from a veterinarian with a prescription. The tablets used in the initial treatments were for large dogs, 51-100lbs. These tablets are just under 1 gram each and contain 23mg of Milbemycin Oxime, the rest of it is a lovely smelling beef flavor."
then he says...
"The dosage used in an aquarium to kill redbugs is 25mg (0.025 grams) per 10 gallons of actual tank water . That is 25mg of the entire tablet. Each tablet in the pack of 6 will treat about 380 gallons. The tablets are ground with a mortar and pestle into a fine powder."
So I'm reading this as 950mg (makes sense as a tablet that weighs almost a gram would weigh almost 1000mg) weight to each tablet if it can treat about 380 gallons per tablet so when they discuss the 25mg per 10 gallon dose being a really small amount it's not that they're using the entire "25mg pill" it's that they're grinding it up and weighing out 25 actual mg on a scale... I WAS confused at first thinking well if I'm to dose 25 mg per 10 gall how can a 25mg tablet treat 380 gallons but it's medicine "mg" terminology versus actual mg weight on a scale.
I've calculated my water volume at about 60 gallons after allowing for displacement by rock, sand, etc so will be grinding up one large dog "25mg" tablet and weighing out .150 grams on a scale. (about 15% of the entire tablet)
Hope that helps...
dreaminmel
New member
Spartan,
That's actually what's eating at me the most. In the past month I've only added a group of three frags from a well known reefer in Buffalo and a Goniopora from a LFS. So it's either one or the other... I'll probably never know for sure. The last coral addition before that was in February and I'd like to assume that if the bugs came in on those corals I would have either seen them or seen signs of their irritation prior to 3 months passing...
That's actually what's eating at me the most. In the past month I've only added a group of three frags from a well known reefer in Buffalo and a Goniopora from a LFS. So it's either one or the other... I'll probably never know for sure. The last coral addition before that was in February and I'd like to assume that if the bugs came in on those corals I would have either seen them or seen signs of their irritation prior to 3 months passing...
gary greguire
Premium Member
I found the thread you were refering to did you have luck getting a vet to give you a perscription? The receptionist asked if I could bring my tank in for the vet to look at.
dreaminmel
New member
? Are you serious... bring the tank in? Was she dense or just being "funny"? :eek2:
Actually my dog has an appointment Tuesday at the Vet for his annual heartworm exam after which I'll be buying a six month supply of large dog Interceptor from them. When I called to make the appointment today they told me there should be no problem getting a few extra for my tank problem. According to my calculations 1 tablet would be enough to dose my tank at least 6 times. If they refuse to give me an extra one they still have to sell me the tablets anyway for my 85 lb dog so they really don't have room to say no.
Actually my dog has an appointment Tuesday at the Vet for his annual heartworm exam after which I'll be buying a six month supply of large dog Interceptor from them. When I called to make the appointment today they told me there should be no problem getting a few extra for my tank problem. According to my calculations 1 tablet would be enough to dose my tank at least 6 times. If they refuse to give me an extra one they still have to sell me the tablets anyway for my 85 lb dog so they really don't have room to say no.
RandyO
Active member
If one pill treats 380 gallons, if you cut the pill in half with a razor blade, you have two treatments of 190 gallons each. Cut those two pieces in half and you have 4 treatments of 95 gallons each.
I know the instructions say to measure it out exactly, but when you are estimating on actual water volume, it must not make that big of a deal. I used a whole tablet for my system. No more red bugs, and my crabs and shrimp survived. I did loose a few crabs on the second treatment. One was a 5 year old Acro crab that I was very attached to.
But your sps will thank you in the end.
I know the instructions say to measure it out exactly, but when you are estimating on actual water volume, it must not make that big of a deal. I used a whole tablet for my system. No more red bugs, and my crabs and shrimp survived. I did loose a few crabs on the second treatment. One was a 5 year old Acro crab that I was very attached to.
But your sps will thank you in the end.
I found that it tanks at least 24 hours for the pills to totally dissolve and have the desired affect. Unless you have crabs or small shrimp you wont have any adverse effects. When I dose I don't run carbon or anything. Then I dose again after about a week or so. Then I'll do a waterchange and run carbon.
dreaminmel
New member
Kent E - so even though you don't use carbon between 1st and 2nd dosings, did you do a water change in between? How long ago did you treat and did you have to do it again from a reoccurence of bugs at all?
RandyO - How long ago did you treat your system?
RandyO - How long ago did you treat your system?
No I'm lazy. I think the carbon is to clear up the stuff to put shrimp and crabs back into the tank. I had no ill effects without a water change or carbon. I found it doesn't affect anything, besides if there were any eggs hatching I wanted to off them.
I'm not saying you should do it my way, rather it worked for me. I don't have any redbugs and the tank looks great.
I'm not saying you should do it my way, rather it worked for me. I don't have any redbugs and the tank looks great.
Before you rush to treat, you should realize that the cure may be worse than the so called pest you are attempting to eliminate. Most tanks with sps contain redbugs. In most cases, no notable damage has been definitevely linked to them. People have formed spurious correlations when seeing RTN and then observing redbug and making the assumption that it was caused by the redbug. It wasn't long ago that bristleworms, copepods etc. were thought to be pests and now they are recognized as providing valuable contributions to the biodiversity of the tank. I have had redbugs in my tanks for over two years, ever since I began collecting sps's. They appear to be primarily attracted to only sevreral acropora species. I have yet to observe any damage resulting from their presence. I witness no difference in growth or coloration in the corals most heavily infested by them relative to the other corals. I have yet to find definitive research that shows they are parasitic in nature, i.e., that they draw nutrients from their host. Interceptor on the other hand may be quite dangerous to the tank fauna. Personally, I would not introduce it to the system. I have talked to a number of sps farmers around the area and country and virtually all report redbug with no apparent ill effects. Just my two cents but something to consider. Many will undoubtedly disagree.
dreaminmel
New member
drbronx,
I have heard that from another person as well. I have been watching these things gradually multiply and they are now on 10 of my acro frags. Each time they move to a new one the polyps barely come out and the frag starts losing color. All frags without the bugs still look great. The pics of the frag above... that coral was a deep neon green all over before the bugs got on it and within hours of their inhabitation it started declining. Eric Borneman has some theories on these bugs as well and I'm not sure if it was him but someone had found that they bore into the coral tissue much like ticks. They then stated the bugs will leave that coral just before it dies and move to another one giving the 1st time to recover so that they don't deplete their food source. Eric also found that when isolated from the acros these bugs die within 5 days which speaks to me that they cannot live without them and usually points at a host/parasite relationship.
Personally, I prefer dosing my tank and eradicating them and then restocking pods over the idea of watching my frags suffer to the point of near death hoping that they recover. I have yet to hear one person speak of any long term ill side effects and this treatment has been used for a couple of years now. I relate it to this... my dog may not die from having fleas but I prefer to keep them off him to give him a better quality of life.
Wish me luck... getting the meds Tuesday and be sure I'll keep everyone updated both short term AND long term as not many others have spoken re: long term so my experience will either reassure others there are no long term ill effects or that it is something NEVER to be done again. I hope for the first scenario...
Thanks for all the replies so far and feel free to keep them coming.
P.S. Here is a pic of the above coral that was taken 3/22/06...
I have heard that from another person as well. I have been watching these things gradually multiply and they are now on 10 of my acro frags. Each time they move to a new one the polyps barely come out and the frag starts losing color. All frags without the bugs still look great. The pics of the frag above... that coral was a deep neon green all over before the bugs got on it and within hours of their inhabitation it started declining. Eric Borneman has some theories on these bugs as well and I'm not sure if it was him but someone had found that they bore into the coral tissue much like ticks. They then stated the bugs will leave that coral just before it dies and move to another one giving the 1st time to recover so that they don't deplete their food source. Eric also found that when isolated from the acros these bugs die within 5 days which speaks to me that they cannot live without them and usually points at a host/parasite relationship.
Personally, I prefer dosing my tank and eradicating them and then restocking pods over the idea of watching my frags suffer to the point of near death hoping that they recover. I have yet to hear one person speak of any long term ill side effects and this treatment has been used for a couple of years now. I relate it to this... my dog may not die from having fleas but I prefer to keep them off him to give him a better quality of life.
Wish me luck... getting the meds Tuesday and be sure I'll keep everyone updated both short term AND long term as not many others have spoken re: long term so my experience will either reassure others there are no long term ill effects or that it is something NEVER to be done again. I hope for the first scenario...
Thanks for all the replies so far and feel free to keep them coming.
P.S. Here is a pic of the above coral that was taken 3/22/06...
