Heniochus Bannerfish rotting
- Thread starter BrianMiller
- Start date
fender4string
New member
It could be bacterial. If I were you I'd pull the fish immediately and start a treatment of an anti-bacterial. A bacterial infection killed the fish in my avatar. I started out as a light spot, and began to look like skin peeling off of her. By the end it looked like her entire side had been ripped open, raw, red and horrible. A bad, bad way for a fish to go out.
A better picture would help a more definitive diagnosis.
A better picture would help a more definitive diagnosis.
BrianMiller
New member
Can I treat him in the tank? I don't have a facility to isolate him within another system.
Thanks for the response.
BrianMiller
New member
MrTuskfish
Team RC
Now is the time to set up a basic QT system. (Try Craig's List). IMO, its a vital piece of equipment. You can't possible treat this fish with antibiotics (assuming that's what you use) in a bucket.
BrianMiller
New member
Can this QT be on the same water system? Is the point of QT to just isolate the fish from others, or an isolated water system too?
A different water system could shock the fish and stress him out even more, no?
-Brian
fender4string
New member
All you'd need is like a 29 gallon (long) for a QT. Get a HOB filter, powerhead, and some PVC for your fish to hide in. MrTuskfish has a good suggestion about Craig's List but honestly I'd be at a pet store today buying a tank. I wouldn't wait to start mixing up water for the tank and giving it a day or so for the salt water to age.
When you're treating with antibacterials, you can't run carbon. I believe I used Maracyn-Two as treatment (I waited too long to start treatment which is why I believe it didn't work). There are directions on the box regarding treatment duration
Definitely do a separate water system. The LR will absorb the medication rendering it useless. He'll be fine as long as the water parameters are close to those in your DT and he's been properly acclimated to the QT.
When you're treating with antibacterials, you can't run carbon. I believe I used Maracyn-Two as treatment (I waited too long to start treatment which is why I believe it didn't work). There are directions on the box regarding treatment duration
Definitely do a separate water system. The LR will absorb the medication rendering it useless. He'll be fine as long as the water parameters are close to those in your DT and he's been properly acclimated to the QT.
BrianMiller
New member
I can do this. I'll swing by the LFS today for a small tank, filter and powerhead. I don't believe I'll be able to keep the QT up and running 24/7. Is it the norm to have to start it from scratch every time? I'm thinking I can move 20% of the water from my main tank to the QT and turn it into a water change. Then top the rest of with RO/DI with salt mix.
-Brian
fender4string
New member
I only start mine up when a fish is showing signs of sickness of if I'm going to be getting a new addition. I don't see the need to keep it running all of the time. As long as the water in your tank is really clean it should be fine to use your DT water as you won't be able to do a water change while the medicine is in the tank (it'll affect dosage). That being said, feed lighter for the duration of the treatment. I think it's only about a week or so.
Here's a link to what medication I used:
http://www.fosterandsmithaquatics.com/1/1/932-maracyn-two.html
Good luck and please keep us posted!
Here's a link to what medication I used:
http://www.fosterandsmithaquatics.com/1/1/932-maracyn-two.html
Good luck and please keep us posted!
BrianMiller
New member
fender4string
New member
Yeah, haha that'll be important too 
BrianMiller
New member
Well,.. after much time and money, my banner fish died this afternoon.
His "rotting" spot grew significantly right before moving him to the QT. He was in the QT for a little less than 24 hours and ending up dying around 1pm PST today.
The water tests looked good before and after putting him in the QT. This was a huge amount of work for a $30 fish.
Thanks for your suggestions and help. I guess I acted too late.
His "rotting" spot grew significantly right before moving him to the QT. He was in the QT for a little less than 24 hours and ending up dying around 1pm PST today.
The water tests looked good before and after putting him in the QT. This was a huge amount of work for a $30 fish.
Thanks for your suggestions and help. I guess I acted too late.
MrTuskfish
Team RC
I think this fish had internal bleeding; but the QT suggestion is sound. I can't imagine long-term success without one.
IMO, a $30 fish or a $3000 fish should be treat exactly alike. Not because I have some huge moral objection to a fish dying; but because I think this hobby/addiction is based on learning and doing everything possible to watch our marine life thrive. If owning and setting up a QT for a sick fish is too much work for you; are sure you've chosen the right hobby? If you think this was a lot of work; continue to add fish to your main tank without a QT regimen and wait for the inevitable parasite infestation.
IMO, a $30 fish or a $3000 fish should be treat exactly alike. Not because I have some huge moral objection to a fish dying; but because I think this hobby/addiction is based on learning and doing everything possible to watch our marine life thrive. If owning and setting up a QT for a sick fish is too much work for you; are sure you've chosen the right hobby? If you think this was a lot of work; continue to add fish to your main tank without a QT regimen and wait for the inevitable parasite infestation.
BrianMiller
New member
I ran a successful reef in this tank for 9 years without a QT. I was careful with my water changes, using RODI, digital meters and constant water testing.
I turned sick of it and am now running a FOWLR system. The QT process seems excessively stressful and the risk of moving the fish between different water systems only makes it worse.
I'm all about saving the fish and learning or I wouldn't have attempted it. I'm sure I need to iron out the kinks in my process--It just takes time.....
-Brian
I turned sick of it and am now running a FOWLR system. The QT process seems excessively stressful and the risk of moving the fish between different water systems only makes it worse.
I'm all about saving the fish and learning or I wouldn't have attempted it. I'm sure I need to iron out the kinks in my process--It just takes time.....
-Brian
sandwi54
New member
When you bring a large number of fish into your DT without QT, it's just a matter of time before you get a sick fish. Parasites often don't manifest themselves until the illness is severe enough so there's no guarantee that every fish you buy does not carry parasites, even if you have a sharp eye and know how to pick healthy specimens.
Many people who first start out in the hobby do not quarantine and almost all of them get burned by ich, flukes, etc., and end up having to remove all of the fish into a QT to treat. Since they didn't have a QT to begin with, their QT aren't cycled and they have water quality issues, have to do large water changes (or not if they are lazy) and make mistakes along the way. The fish die as a result of multiple stresses, the aquarist gets frustrated and quits the hobby.
The above describes a large number of the hobbyists (hence the average lifetime of this hobby is only 1.5 years). The lack of strict quarantine protocols is the main underlying reason for this. Someone may get lucky and buy a small number of fish without having them come in with any parasites, but like i said, when the number starts increasing, it's just a matter of time before he gets an infested fish. murphy's law and mother nature always dominate at the end of the day.
Good husbandry (water changes, RODI, testing) do nothing to eliminate parasites. Once they are in, they are in. They can only be eliminated with medication, most of which cannot be used in a DT, especially a reef tank. a good quarantine process saves you A LOT of headache in the long run, including the trouble of tearing down the DT to catch fish. Take some time to read the stickies in this forum and the necessity of QT should become obvious.
Many people who first start out in the hobby do not quarantine and almost all of them get burned by ich, flukes, etc., and end up having to remove all of the fish into a QT to treat. Since they didn't have a QT to begin with, their QT aren't cycled and they have water quality issues, have to do large water changes (or not if they are lazy) and make mistakes along the way. The fish die as a result of multiple stresses, the aquarist gets frustrated and quits the hobby.
The above describes a large number of the hobbyists (hence the average lifetime of this hobby is only 1.5 years). The lack of strict quarantine protocols is the main underlying reason for this. Someone may get lucky and buy a small number of fish without having them come in with any parasites, but like i said, when the number starts increasing, it's just a matter of time before he gets an infested fish. murphy's law and mother nature always dominate at the end of the day.
Good husbandry (water changes, RODI, testing) do nothing to eliminate parasites. Once they are in, they are in. They can only be eliminated with medication, most of which cannot be used in a DT, especially a reef tank. a good quarantine process saves you A LOT of headache in the long run, including the trouble of tearing down the DT to catch fish. Take some time to read the stickies in this forum and the necessity of QT should become obvious.
fender4string
New member
I'm sorry to hear the bannerfish died. At least you gave it a shot.
QT might seem like it's more stressful but in the end the fish benefits. It has time to recoup from being in the LFS (usually way worse than your own tank), learn to eat the foods you feed, and to fatten up before being moved into your main tank with all of the other fish. Being able to spot diseases before they are introduced to your DT is always a bonus too.
Good luck in the future. While this whole experience sucks and will leave you feeling defeated, it's an invaluable learning experience. Next time this happens, you'll notice it early and will have a better chance of succeeding.
QT might seem like it's more stressful but in the end the fish benefits. It has time to recoup from being in the LFS (usually way worse than your own tank), learn to eat the foods you feed, and to fatten up before being moved into your main tank with all of the other fish. Being able to spot diseases before they are introduced to your DT is always a bonus too.
Good luck in the future. While this whole experience sucks and will leave you feeling defeated, it's an invaluable learning experience. Next time this happens, you'll notice it early and will have a better chance of succeeding.
BrianMiller
New member
I appreciate everyone's feedback and support. I've never QT'd a fish before introducing it to my DT (I'm assuming DT=Main tank?) .
I also don't have the room and time to maintain a QT 24/7. I would need to break it down and start it from scratch every time I needed it.
My new QT is a simple 10 gallon tank with cheap backpack filter, powerhead and heater. Is it acceptable to take 10 gallons from my DT (46 gallon) and use it for my QT to have it ready to use immediately? This way I can time my water changes around adding new fish by using that old water as QT water.
Thoughts?
Thanks again,
-Brian
I also don't have the room and time to maintain a QT 24/7. I would need to break it down and start it from scratch every time I needed it.
My new QT is a simple 10 gallon tank with cheap backpack filter, powerhead and heater. Is it acceptable to take 10 gallons from my DT (46 gallon) and use it for my QT to have it ready to use immediately? This way I can time my water changes around adding new fish by using that old water as QT water.
Thoughts?
Thanks again,
-Brian
MrTuskfish
Team RC
Water won't cycle a tank; the friendly bacteria that does the work lives in the LR, substrate, and even filter media. Ordinarily, water from your main tank is fine for a QT and if you're 100% sure that you don't have any parasites in your DT now, you could use it. Parasites are fairly easy to kill in a QT. If you keep a filter pad for your QT somewhere in the flow of your main tank, it will be ready to cycle the QT whenever needed (after a few weeks). This method is really only foolproof when all fish in the DT have been quarantined; but I don't think using DT water and a filter pad from a healthy tank creates any more risk than a new fish. Plus, anything that happens will be confined to the QT.
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