high nitrates @50 on salifert and SPS?

[LPSpsCloWn]

Hi everyone

I wanted to get some advice and opinions on where to go from here.

I have a 300L tank volume and no matter what i have tried and i have tried many many many many many many things. Vodka, vinegar, all kinds of filter media, additives ect ect and I cannot move my nitrates. I even tried new sand bed, extra 10kg of live rock, nothing.

I cant reduce feeding any more than this and after all this my nitrates are at 50ppm. I have checked my water supply and RO filter and everything is perfect, water from my tap has no nitrates or phosphates or negligible amounts. .

I currently have a quarantine tank full of SPS,LPS and various softies and I am struggling to keep them all happy in there. Been there 2 years and I am starting to loose frags because of small water volume and swings.

I need to move everything into the main tank but i have a nitrate issue. Cant get my nitrates under 50ppm.

I have read everywhere that says nitrates will kill the frags, and I tried a small piece of SPS and it turn brow in 2 weeks and died. But at the same time my Fish shop tells me don't worry 50ppm is fine and many have reef tanks with such high nitrates. I have seen few on the internet that is proof of high nitrates and SPS and LPS full tank.

my quarantine tank is currently at 2.5ppm nitrates.

So who do i believe?

what should i do?

as my only other option is to get rid of most my fish and keep just 2 clowns fish and that would allow me to reduce feeding massively. But a tank with no fish is horrible sight.

Thanks all

 

[Daddi0]

Do you have a skimmer? How is your flow? You could try a different test kit to see if the numbers are correct? How much are you actually feeding?
Cheers! Mark

 

[LPSpsCloWn]

Do you have a skimmer? How is your flow? You could try a different test kit to see if the numbers are correct? How much are you actually feeding?
Cheers! Mark

Hi there

I have a Deltec MCE 600 hang on skimmer. I have been told by deltec this is good enough for my tank volume and load. I used to clean the cup once every 4 days and would barely collect anything. But since two weeks now i clean the cup once every day and it seem to be collecting much more than usual which is a plus. I was going to upgrade to a deltec 1000i skimmer but i am short on sump space.


Regarding feeding, i have a yellow tang and purple tang both medium size and a single slarge clown fish. Just these three. Problem is that i tried feeding less but the fish start to look poorly and their fins starts to waste away so i have go back to my previous regiment of two times a day. Single time is not enough.Also once a week i treat them to little bit of algae about 2 inches by 3 inches.

Test kits are all correct, i have tested them with 2 different test kits and also took my LFS did a test. I also did a trition water test.

Flow is very good in the tank, I have two 2300gph power heads and also the flow from my sump pump adds extra flow to the tank. I tried adding more it would kick up sand and fish were annoyed.

Really not much else i can try that i know of, even tried deep sand bed. I moved the shrimps into the tank downstairs as they were causing me headache in the quarantine tank even though i know high nitrates can be bad for them, i really have no choice any more, just cant keep the corals and live stock in the quarantine tank.

my last hope was which is still in the tank was a media reactor with some seachem denitrate in there with a slow flow pump and was hoping that nitrate would come under control but in 6 months its done nothing.

i was going to try a deltect nitrate reactor but that is almost the same as vodka dosing if i am not wrong?

Thanks

 

[reefgeezer]

I'd question what your LFS tells you. The HOB skimmer probably isn't big enough for your 300l (75 gallon) tank... particularly with 3 relatively large well fed fish. Tangs are really messy to boot. I'd find something that will fit in your sump or and external that will sit beside it. I had to cut the base plate down to make my skimmer fit in the sump.

IMO, moving SPS corals from 2-3 ppm to 50 ppm (or more) of nitrate would not be a good thing.

The difference between 50 & 100 ppm on the Salifert color chart isn't that great. You could easily think your nitrates are 50 when they are really 80. You might not even notice a drop of 25-30 ppm. You could do two 40 gallon water changes back to back. That should drop your nitrates into the 12-25 ppm range. You'll need some export capability to keep those levels though. I'd hesitate to say your SPS will thrive, particularly at the upper end of that level.

 

[Daddi0]

I think you are over feeding. My fish eat every other day and are really healthy. As an example, my 65gallon reef has approx. 10 fish and they get a single cube every other day. They also get a small piece of seaweed (about the size of a quarter) that I pre-soak in reef water and grind up.
Cheers! Mark

 

[LPSpsCloWn]

I'd question what your LFS tells you. The HOB skimmer probably isn't big enough for your 300l (75 gallon) tank... particularly with 3 relatively large well fed fish. Tangs are really messy to boot. I'd find something that will fit in your sump or and external that will sit beside it. I had to cut the base plate down to make my skimmer fit in the sump.

IMO, moving SPS corals from 2-3 ppm to 50 ppm (or more) of nitrate would not be a good thing.

The difference between 50 & 100 ppm on the Salifert color chart isn't that great. You could easily think your nitrates are 50 when they are really 80. You might not even notice a drop of 25-30 ppm. You could do two 40 gallon water changes back to back. That should drop your nitrates into the 12-25 ppm range. You'll need some export capability to keep those levels though. I'd hesitate to say your SPS will thrive, particularly at the upper end of that level.

My protein skimmer Deltec MCE 600 is rated for 600L tank medium load and 500L heavy load. My tank is only 300L, are you sure its not enough?

https://www.theaquariumsolution.com/product/3026/72


Then what size protein skimmer should i buy? can you recommend one from this page

https://www.theaquariumsolution.com/products/internal-protein-skimmers-0

The problem is that, I have tried every kind of nutrient export you can imagine. Nothing apart from water change works and that is just too expensive to do 40Gallons weekly. I would be throwing salt buckets down the drain and its expensive.

 

[LPSpsCloWn]

I think you are over feeding. My fish eat every other day and are really healthy. As an example, my 65gallon reef has approx. 10 fish and they get a single cube every other day. They also get a small piece of seaweed (about the size of a quarter) that I pre-soak in reef water and grind up.
Cheers! Mark

i am suprised you feed so little, i fed the fish once every other day and they really looked pale and started to get fin rot. I upped the food back to twice a day and they recovered in 2-3 weeks.

Out of interest what fish do you have and what size tank and size of fish?

also do you mind if i take a video of how much i feed and post it and you tell me if i am over feeding because i am lost now as to how much i must feed.

Thanks for all the feed back everyone, much appreciated.

 

[Daddi0]

One of my reefs is 65 gallons and has:
Yellow Tang
Coral Beauty
2 Watchmen Gobies
Pistol Shrimp
2 Springer Damsels
Blue Damsel
2 Pajama Cardinals
10 Emerald crabs
5 Peppermint Shrimp
More Trocus snails than you can count
and over 100 corals - mainly SPS/acros

Reef #2
Yellow Tang
2 Clowns
2 Springer Damsels
Purple Dottyback
Flameback Angel
Six Line Wrasse
along with Emerald crabs, peppermint shrimp and Trocus
and over 100 SPS/acros

Reef #3 - 30 gallon
Six Line
Adorned Wrasse
Clown Fish

Reef #4 - 32 gallon
2 Clowns
Purple Dottyback

Reef # 5 - 30 gallon
4 large Serpent Stars
100+ Acros/SPS

Reef # 6 - 55 gallon
4 foot moray

Every tank gets fed every other day and all the critters/corals are happy

Cheers! Mark

 

[mcgyvr]

Dont waste your money on another skimmer..

How much rock do you have in the tank?
What kind of rock?
Explain in detail how you were carbon dosing and for how long.. How much daily? How long were you doing this for?etc...

What is your water change schedule/amount?

High nitrates will likely cause the sps to die so you are right to keep them in qt for now..s

Have you done a large 40g change? Did it drop nitrates way down?

Answer ALL of those questions in as much detail as you can and we can help..

 

[gprdypoo04]

I've never had any success in water changes to reduce nitrates. When I first started years ago my nitrates were probably close to 100 ppm. I tried the so famous vodka dosing and had no luck either. My nitrates averaged around 50 ppm for months and years. Finally i decided on biopellets and after about 5 months my nitrates ran about 20ppm. Then they hit about 12ppm. After purchasing some coral on line I got a freebie.... xenia. Now after a little growth from this weed my nitrates are now running 3ppm. It's only taken me six or seven years to finally get this low.

 

[reefgeezer]

l]Then what size protein skimmer should i buy? can you recommend one from this page...

...Nothing apart from water change works and that is just too expensive to do 40Gallons weekly. I would be throwing salt buckets down the drain and its expensive.

The 1000XI would be my choice if you want to stick with Deltec. They have always been top shelf. I think you'll find that much more skimmate is removed by it than your current HOB. Skimmers are always over rated. The limitation of an HOB skimmer really effects their efficiency. They are always way over rated. Even Deltec falls into the trap.

The two big water changes are used to get the levels down to where you can recognize changes, and not as a long term solution. You might have to do some bigger changes for a while but not long term.

Adding a better skimmer would do some export to help nitrate build-up slower and would make carbon dosing a better option to reduce existing nitrate. If I had your problem I would:

1. Install the skimmer and get it operating;
2. Start carbon dosing with vinegar (or some other carbon source like vodka or a commercial product);
3. Do two large water changes to reduce nitrates to a reasonable level; and
4. Continue bigger water changes until the carbon dosing process kicks in.

The idea is to get to a maintenance level of carbon dosing that allows your nitrate level to stay low. Don't forget to check phosphate. You'll need some available for the carbon dosing process to work.

 

[gprdypoo04]

I've never had any success in water changes to reduce nitrates. When I first started years ago my nitrates were probably close to 100 ppm. I tried the so famous vodka dosing and had no luck either. My nitrates averaged around 50 ppm for months and years. Finally i decided on biopellets and after about 5 months my nitrates ran about 20ppm. Then they hit about 12ppm. After purchasing some coral on line I got a freebie.... xenia. Now after a little growth from this weed my nitrates are now running 3ppm. It's only taken me six or seven years to finally get this low.

I've also got halimedia macro growing on my sand bed and rocks.