Hypo not working

[ACBlinky]

Recently we broke down our 65g and removed all the fish to treat them for ich. We sold the tank, and the plan was to keep the fish in hypo for six weeks or so, then raise the salinity back to NSW levels and keep them in the QT until the new tank is ready.

I lowered the SG from 1.026 to 1.009 over three days and the fish handled it very well. They've been in hypo for five days now, and tonight all three angels are covered in white spots. They look five times worse now than they did when I started treatment. None of the fish are breathing hard, but a few are flashing, so even though they don't have spots on their bodies I know it's in their gills.

Am I doing something wrong? Is there anything I can do, or is the only recourse to raise the SG back up over five days or so and then treat with copper? I wanted to avoid copper if at all possible because we've got a clown.

Thanks for any help, I'm really at a loss here.

 

[Steven Pro]

There are several misunderstandings in your post. First of which, while it is commonly advised on various message boards to slowly lower the salinity, this is explicitly the opposite of what Dr. Colorni recommends. The drop in salinity is supposed to be done rapidly to be most effective.

Secondly, hyposalinity does not affect the parasites on the fish. It only kills them once they drop off to reproduce. Also, since ich can be attached to the fish for 3-7 days, but not visible to the naked eye that entire time, they could have simply been reproducing while you were lowering the salinity.

And finally, I have yet to see any proof that a copper medication when applied properly is harmful to any fish. There are some people that suggest that copper might harm tangs' digestive systems and others that believe that clownfish exposed reproduce less, but these are both theories.

 

[Triggerfish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8356402#post8356402 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Steven Pro
Dr. Colorni recommends. The drop in salinity is supposed to be done rapidly to be most effective.

steve - interested in reading the Colorni info regarding the rapid salinity drop.
this is the first i heard of anything regarding effectiveness of the treatment relative to how quickly salinity was dropped.
thx

 

[Steven Pro]

I have talked about it a few times, but you are correct, most people advocate a slow drop. Here is a brief excerpt from some email correspondence I had with Dr. Angelo Colorni.

"The success in the hyposalinity treatment lies in the rapidity in which it is carried out. The osmotic shock damages the tomonts at the bottom of the tank (the bacteria then complete the job), whereas it has very little effect, if any at all, on the trophonts in the fish epithelia."

To properly apply hyposalinity, it must be lowered quickly. I often wonder if the reason so many hobbyists seem to have such a difficult time with this treatment and limited success is because they misapply the technique.

By the way, if you don't know who Dr. Angelo Colorni is, he is one of the world's foremost authorities on diseases on aquatic organisms and one of the first scientists to publish regarding hyposalinity.

 

[Triggerfish]

i was aware that the drop does not need to be slow and in fact, the drop can be done at once.

i'm going to have to look into the notion mentioned there regarding hobbyists difficulty with the treatment.
something isn't making sense there.

if salinity is lowered over a day or two is it suggested that any tomonts will have already adjusted to survive the now hypoed conditions? thus allowing them to not rupture prematurely and continue to reproduce.

what about the trophont stage that could already be loaded on the incoming infested fish, thus not exposed to the lowered saline conditions until they release?
surely it cannot be presumed that lowering the salinity all at once can attribute to eradicating the parasite within all 4 stages, right?

if not, i'm not sure how there can be a direct correlation between instant lowering and difficulty with using the treatment.

in fact,,i would presume that most of the c.irritans upon entering the treatment tank would actually still be located within the fish tissue. and possibly remain there for 3-10 days.
if so,,i cannot see how instant lowering of salinity could really have much direct effect except for perhaps any tomonts that quickly encycsted right after the livestock entered the qt.

maybe i'm missing something or need more information relative to the research.

 

[papagimp]

When I last battled ich with Hypo treatment, I slowly lowered over the course of a week. It worked alright for me, but I also got the fish QT at first signs of ich, I think that more than anything is what affected my results so positivly. I do see where dropping quickly could be more effective though. Nice piece of info to share, thanks.