ich disappeared?

[sw_df27]

I recently added a juv. sailfin tang and a flame angel to my 90 gallon reef tank (I know the tang will eventually grow out of my tank and already have a home in a 150 gal when it does) but I have had them for 2 weeks now and noticed a few white ich spots on their fins the next morning my flame angel was covered in white spots and so was my royal gramma however I came home from work and all the spots where gone except on the fins which I guess it gets worse at night when the lights are out so I started using kick ich that day and soaking their food(RODS) in extra garlic I also purchased a UV sterilizer and everyone seems to be doing great all spots are gone and barely noticeable after the first day of treatment and everyone is eating great is there anything else I need to be doing? I will continue treatment for the next 13 day every 2 days according to the directions but after that's done how long should I wait before adding another fish to my tank I have one more on my list and I'm done.
Nitrite=0
nitrate=20 I know it should be 0 but this is the lowest I have been able to keep it steady
ammonia=0
ph=8.2ish
temp=76
90 gallon tank with a 30 gallon sump
1" of extreme crushed coral almost looks like sand
48" aquatic life T5 light with led moon lights
reef octopus diablo XS 160
uv sterilizer for up to 100 gallons
1 koralia 550,1-750, 1-1150
90lbs of live rock
a few zoas
1 kenya tree
few pulsing xenia
1 finger leather
1 RBTA
1 green LTA
2 true perculas , 1 royal gramma, 1 flame angel,1 scooter blenny(I supplement copapods every two weeks), 1 sailfin tang, 1 yellow tail damsel which I wish I could catch and get rid of. The final fish I will add is a Mandirin goby in approx 2-3 more months after my pods have a chance to multiply for both it and the blenny and will continue to supplement

would also like to add no one is fighting or anything and are all very active

 

[HumbleFish]

I would suggest reading this and this in it's entirety.

 

[gone fishin]

Kick ich will do nothing to get rid of ich and neither will using garlic. The reason the spots disappered is the ich dropped off the fish to start the next stage of their life cycle.

If you want to be rid of the ich then the fish need to be removed to QT and treated with on of the three proven methods to defeat ich. Copper,Tank transfer or hyposalinity(very hard to pull off IMO). While treating the tank needs to remain fishless for 10-12 weeks.

There are numerous stickies at the top of this forum about ich.

 

[sw_df27]

I realize there are alot of sticky's on this which I have read but I also have read where trying to catch and move all fish to a qt tank can cause more stress on the fish and have also read ich will always be in my tank but as long as stress levels are kept to a min. and the fish are healthy they should beable to fight it off on their own? is that info wrong? I do have another tank set up with nothing in it incase I do need to go the copper route but what about my nems and corals? also what's the least stressful way of moving them into a qt and will a 30 gal work as a qt tank if they have to stay in it for 3 months or will I need to set up the 55 gal? and another thing the UV sterilizer won't that kill the ich that's dropped off the fish?

 

[gone fishin]

Ich will only host on fish. There are some that believe ich is always in the tank or that all fish have ich. I for one do not buy into that. I had an ich outbreak when I first started a few years ago. I learned about Qt, since I started QT my new fish I have not had any ich. I do not believe I have it in my system. I also do not suscribe to the manage ich theory. Why risk your investment and put your fish through ich time and again. The bottom line is either rid your tank of ich and QT new fish or live with it. Take my ramblings for what it is worth good luck to you.

In order for a UV to work the ich must stay in the water column. Then get pulled through UV. Then have enough contact time to kill it. That is alot of ifs. They do not get rid of ich IMO.

 

[HumbleFish]

I realize there are alot of sticky's on this which I have read but I also have read where trying to catch and move all fish to a qt tank can cause more stress on the fish and have also read ich will always be in my tank but as long as stress levels are kept to a min. and the fish are healthy they should beable to fight it off on their own? is that info wrong? I do have another tank set up with nothing in it incase I do need to go the copper route but what about my nems and corals?

They can fight it off, but the parasite never completely goes away without treatment. It's like this: the parasites attack the fish, the fish's natural immune system fights some of them off, but some always manage to feed on the fish long enough to continue their life cycle (in the gills if you can't see them on the skin). Rinse & repeat; this battle goes on & on. Sometimes a fish can go months or even years, and keep winning the battles. But all it takes is a "stressor event" (i.e. temp fluctuation, fish fight) to give the parasites the upper hand and overwhelm your fish.

 

[MrTuskfish]

I realize there are alot of sticky's on this which I have read but I also have read where trying to catch and move all fish to a qt tank can cause more stress on the fish and have also read ich will always be in my tank but as long as stress levels are kept to a min. and the fish are healthy they should beable to fight it off on their own? is that info wrong? I do have another tank set up with nothing in it incase I do need to go the copper route but what about my nems and corals? also what's the least stressful way of moving them into a qt and will a 30 gal work as a qt tank if they have to stay in it for 3 months or will I need to set up the 55 gal? and another thing the UV sterilizer won't that kill the ich that's dropped off the fish?

Just curious: where are you reading all of this?
I'd stop believing everything you read. How in the world did these fish and inverts get from the reef to your tank; when the "stress" won't allow the same livestock to be moved to another tank. You can believe the stickies, they have been reviewed by some of the best hobbyists around In this hobby, you can always find a post that says anything you want it to say. Ich will not pertinently disappear. Some fish can get some TEMPORARY immunity to ich strains; but it will return. The stress from moving fish is ridiculous ; originating, I assume, from someone looking for a way out of treating ich. Being killed by ich is stressful, moving to another tank is no big deal. The UV will help a little, but will not cure ich. You MUST have a HT/QT system in this hobby. There just isn't an easier way and all you heard or read about quarantining all new fish was obviously right.

 

[sw_df27]

I read everything you guys are saying and have yet to have my questions answered I'm willing to do what I need to do I currently running a 30 gallon qt ready to go but I asked how long do they all need to stay in qt and if I needed to upgrade it to a 55. I'm not here to argue about what's right and what's wrong I just need to know what exactly I need to do at this point so I move them to a qt for how long and treat with what exactly? and what do I do with my dt with my nems and coral in and for how long? Thank you all for your help and I'm willing to do what ever it is I need to do

 

[MrTuskfish]

I realize there are alot of sticky's on this which I have read but I also have read where trying to catch and move all fish to a qt tank can cause more stress on the fish and have also read ich will always be in my tank but as long as stress levels are kept to a min. and the fish are healthy they should beable to fight it off on their own? is that info wrong? I do have another tank set up with nothing in it incase I do need to go the copper route but what about my nems and corals? also what's the least stressful way of moving them into a qt and will a 30 gal work as a qt tank if they have to stay in it for 3 months or will I need to set up the 55 gal? and another thing the UV sterilizer won't that kill the ich that's dropped off the fish?

I think your questions have been answered; but (IMO) as long as you insist on using Kick-Ich, there's not much we can do. Kick Ich simply doesn't work. You seem convinced that moving them will hurt the by "stressing" them. It will not. UV will not cure ich. Ich will not always be in your tank. Copper, tank transfer, and probably C. Phosphate are the only cures that work, IMO. You cannot eradicate ich in a tank with corals or other inverts. You should use the 55 for a HT/QT. People tried to help you on your previous thread and you are still asking about "ich going away on its own. IT DOES NOT. You seem to be ignoring everything you don't want to hear and are still talking about the "stress'' of moving livestock. Get your fish in a QT, get some Cupramine and an appropriate test kit, quit looking for reasons for not using proven ich treatments----and we'll be glad to help. We don't even know if you're still trying to use Kick-ich; if you are; I don't anyone can help . Except the anecdotal reports 1 in 100 people the stuff seemed to help. Do you even know how Kick-Ich is supposed to work? I simply don't know what else to say. Looking at your last two threads, this one and the other about 3/29, Every one of your concerns seemed to have been answered. I have a feeling that all the info folks have offered you is just being ignored anyway.

 

[HumbleFish]

I read everything you guys are saying and have yet to have my questions answered I'm willing to do what I need to do I currently running a 30 gallon qt ready to go but I asked how long do they all need to stay in qt and if I needed to upgrade it to a 55. I'm not here to argue about what's right and what's wrong I just need to know what exactly I need to do at this point so I move them to a qt for how long and treat with what exactly? and what do I do with my dt with my nems and coral in and for how long? Thank you all for your help and I'm willing to do what ever it is I need to do

Catch all your fish, QT, treat with Cupramine for one solid month. Don't put them back in the DT for at least 10 weeks. Corals/inverts can stay in DT. QT all future fish purchases so you never have to go thru this again.

Footnote: Keep a close eye on the Flame angel; he may or may not be able to take the Cupramine. You may have to QT him this way.

 

[sw_df27]

well sorry to have bothered you all with my "ignorance" in this matter I have come to an agreement with the LFS that sold me all my fish they are coming tonight to remove all my fish as they are the ones that maintain and clean my tank monthly and refund me half my money and claim they will treat them all we will see as it's obvious I don't know what I"m doing I"m pretty new to this hobby only been in it for a year I only KNOW what I read on the net including this place and my LFS so I believe there is a lot more I need to learn I will keep my corals and inverts and let my tank sit for at least 3 months probably longer I may figure out this isn't for me I don't know at this point but thank you ALL very much

 

[jjk_reef00]

That is nice of your LFS. I would let them take the fish but I wouldn't trust them to treat the fish for disease. If/when you get the fish back I would personally treat them it in a QT tank. I use 2 weeks of prazipro and 4 weeks of cupramine on every fish before it goes into my display tank.

Sometimes this hobby is frustrating, but keep reading and asking questions. Things do get better for those who QT.

 

[MrTuskfish]

I hope you stay in the hobby; its a lifetime hobby that only gets better. Good luck; and give yourself a good present. The current edition of Bob Fenner's 'The Conscience Marine Aquarist". Not everyone agrees with everyone else on many things in this hobby, its still in its infancy. Fenner has people disagree with him, on many things (me included). But this book is good coffee table book with great info & info on all aspects of the hobby. As great as the web and RC are; sometimes a few good books are still mandatory reading...IMO & IME.

 

[sw_df27]

Thanks... I don't think I'll ever fully leave this hobby I really enjoy my corals and nems to much I won't be getting these same fish back my lfs will probably resale them if they actually do treat them who knows at this point I don't trust them anymore they are the ones that told me feed garlic and us a UV sterilizer and that ich is always in everyones systems blah blah I will from now on research before I jump into something like this. thanks for the info and thanks for the links

 

[Sk8r]

What your lfs told you is common myth in the field, and what they sold you is just not effective: they probably believe it's true, but it doesn't help your situation. I'd recommend you read the stickies in the New to the Hobby forum and get a qt tank, after the ich has had time to clear out of your display tank. Go slow and you'll be fine.

 

[55coolgalreef]

just out of curiousity why doesn't fish stores just start quarantine fish...I mean after 10 weeks they can start making money again......I know it would be a long time to not sell fish.. but wouldn't it be safer to people.. and if they charged say 20 percent more.. I would pay it. to not have to worry about it..

 

[HumbleFish]

just out of curiousity why doesn't fish stores just start quarantine fish...I mean after 10 weeks they can start making money again......I know it would be a long time to not sell fish.. but wouldn't it be safer to people.. and if they charged say 20 percent more.. I would pay it. to not have to worry about it..

Most brick & mortar LFS live hand to mouth as it is. They simply cannot afford to wait 10 weeks to sell a fish. They need to sell as many fish as they can, as quickly as they can, to make room for next week's shipment. And even if it was somehow financially advantageous to do so, most don't have the expertise required to properly QT fish.

 

[snorvich]

Most brick & mortar LFS live hand to mouth as it is. They simply cannot afford to wait 10 weeks to sell a fish. They need to sell as many fish as they can, as quickly as they can, to make room for next week's shipment. And even if it was somehow financially advantageous to do so, most don't have the expertise required to properly QT fish.

I agree. Totally. However, there is another issue and that is that LFS have systems which share water among tanks which makes quarantine an impossibility. Quarantine requires isolation, ideally with as few fish as possible and that does not fit the LFS business model at all.