Interesting Observation

[GrahamJr]

I find all of the threads on Probiotics (to proactively manipulate the microbial communities nutrient processing in the aquarium to feed coral) fascinating. I have successfully used the Zeo and carbon dosing methods. I've been considering giving biopellets a try. But, a few minutes ago I just realized there maybe another very effective and easy method to increase beneficial bacteria in the tank with out any of the expense and hassle. A very simple process....give it a try. I'd love to get feed back if you discover the same thing. My coral love it.

GFO and vodka dosing has pretty well depleted any signs of algae in my tank, make my algae loving Tangs a little hungry, so I decided to hang a piece of lettuce into the tank. It has been a few days now and the leaf is starting to slowly dissolve as bacteria eats it up.

What I also observed, which I never gave close attention to in the past, was my corals response to the rotting lettuce leaf. The coral are all acting like they have just been fed Oyster Feast with opening and closed polyps all over the SPS coral and softies are compacting and reopening.

When thinking about it, it makes perfect sense. The rotting lettuce is releasing diverse bacteria into the water column and feeding the coral.

It isn't much different than when I first started raising fresh water egg layers , many years ago, and used lettuce to grow infusaria to feed the hatchlings.

I will continue to add a new leaf of lettuce after this one rots away to watch how the coral react over time. If it works, it maybe a very safe and easy method to increase tank bacteria population to feed coral. Not very sophisticated but a whole lot cheaper and easier than ZEO for sure. Nothing to keep you from adding Zeobac to get bacteria diversity.

Comments...........

 

[Jonviviano]

Interested, what differs the bacteria on the lettuce from another food source?

 

[GrahamJr]

Interested, what differs the bacteria on the lettuce from another food source?

Interesting question. The question should probably be what differs the heterotophic bacteria in any type of bacteria biofilm, be it on the tank walls, the live rock, substrate, zeolites in the Zeo system, from the carbon source in bio-pellets, from carbon dosing vodka, or rotting plant organics?

All of these approaches are a way to use additional carbon to bind up dissolved phosphates and nitrogen from the water column with the a rather complex bacteria mass that grows, then to use it as food for the coral and/or extract it from the tank through skimming. Some system like Zeovit introduce its own strain of bacteria and enrich it with different foods.

The interesting thing about bacteria is that we often try to categorize it into groups and types. What the majority of people don't understand is it is totally different in every tank. Bacteria is almost as unique and different as people are to each other. Los Alamos Labs did a study on the bacteria in a single spoonful of earth. With the help new DNA equipment and computers they discovered that a single spoon full contained millions of different and unique bacteria, that was continually evolving and changing into unique new forms.

I think if the same study was done for a reef tank or on a natural reef, there is no reason to believe we would not find the same thing in a spoonful of bacteria covered substrate. One strain of bacteria often becomes the food for another strain as the bacteria ages and evolves. To a great extent the food value of bacteria in a reef tank is probably more dependent on what it eats rather than on what it is are growing on. Below is a quote from a very good article on the topic. Probiotics Demystified

I think you will find that the coral in a reef tank will find the taste of bacteria that gets into the water column after being grown on a rotting leaf of lettuce, using it as a carbon source, just a delicious as bacteria grown on bio-pellets or zeolite.

That is not to say that there may be different ways to feed and enrich the bacteria feeding on the carbon in the lettuce to make it taste even better to the coral eating it. In any case I will continue to evaluate the effect on my coral of allowing a leaf of lettuce rot away naturally, distributing and feeding heterotrophic bacteria to the coral. It is cheap, easy, uncomplicated, and appears very effective.

Discussions about the role of bacteria in captive marine ecosystems often include the issue of bacterial densities, and whether we already have enough bacteria in our tanks. The bacterial biomass on and adjacent to coral reefs is enormous. Benthic bacterial densities (in biofilms, sediments, in and on algae and other organisms) have been estimated as high as 100 million bacteria per cubic centimeter. Bacterioplankton densities in reef waters, although lower, are still impressive—as high as 2 million bacteria per milliliter of seawater. Some studies have suggested that heterotrophic bacteria may comprise 90 percent of bacterioplankton biomass in waters adjacent to coral reefs, at least in .2–2 micron (picoplankton) size ranges.

Although definitive studies have not yet been conducted, the widespread reported success of probiotic systems leads to a reasonable conclusion that bacterial densities in marine aquaria are not as high as in natural reef waters, although our understanding of the diversity of microbial life in the waters adjacent to coral reefs is still in its infancy.

To boost the bacterial populations in their captive reefs, aquarists have utilized multiple sources of organic carbon, with varying degrees of success. These include ethanol (usually in the form of vodka), acetic acid (usually in the form of vinegar), sucrose (table sugar), glucose (in the form of dextrose or corn sugar), ascorbic acid, and acetate. Most commercial systems probably utilize one or more of these organic carbon sources, or related substances, although exact information is difficult to verify.

The specific metabolic pathways involving these sources of organic carbon have not been identified to a significant degree, and are not completely understood.

 

[GrahamJr]

Additional comment.

After a few minutes of thought and a little internet research; I think lettuce may produce a very enriched bacteria for coral to feast on.

"Although lettuce leaf is 90% water, it contains many other things that may help to make it an excellent food source for bacteria and to produce enriched bacteria for coral in a reef tank.

Inside a lettuce leaf, glucose is combined with nitrogen and other elements to make amino acids, the building blocks of proteins. These other elements are obtained from the soil as minerals. Phosphorus plays an important role in the reactions involved in photosynthesis and respiration. It is also needed to make DNA and cell membranes. A shortage of phosphorus results in poor root growth and purple leaves. Potassium helps the enzymes involved in photosynthesis and respiration to work. It is also important for the production of flowers and fruit. Without potassium, plants have yellow leaves with dead spots and show poor fruit and flower growth. Magnesium is needed to make chlorophyll, which is essential to absorb light energy for photosynthesis. If magnesium is lacking, the leaves turn yellow.If plants do not absorb sufficient minerals for their needs, they show deficiency symptoms. These relate to the specific use of each element in the plant. Nitrogen is needed to make amino acids, which are the building blocks of proteins. Proteins are an important part of cell membranes and enzymes. Without proteins, plants cannot grow properly or function efficiently.

A lettuce leaf has a wide range of vitamins, a cup of lettuce has 11.3 mg of vitamin C, 48.2 mg of vitamin K, 1673 mcg beta carotene, 1087 mcg of lutein + zeaxanthin, 16 mg calcium, 116 mg potassium, 64 mcg folate."

 

[dbhavoc]

This is very interesting. Please continue to update us all on your research.

 

[jdegrasse]

I like this train of thought.

Often, these boards are filled with stories of failing tanks/livestock. Just as often the tank params are seemingly within normal specs.

What if there are bacteria species that are more beneficial to the tank? So let say the bacteria that inoculated your tank with the lettuce is an easily consumed type. The lettuce bacteria consume the lettuce and in turn the filter feeders consume the lettuce bacteria and get all the beneficial nutrients.

What if a tank gets inoculated with a species of bacteria that is hard for feeders to consume? In this case, the bacteria would still grow, but because it is not consumed it will overrun the tank to upset the balance. I'm thinking of Cyanobacteria strains and other bacterial mats and films.

So maybe it's not so much the lettuce, but where your lettuce is from and the fauna the inhabit the leaf. Lettuce from somewhere else will have different epiphytic bacteria and may no be as good or maybe better.

I think you are on to something here. The whole idea of probiotics is to boost and promote colonization by beneficial bacteria. And that is what you are doing. The lettuce is a food source for the good guys, but cyanobacteria and the like won't touch it.

I tried vodka dosing. My bacteria seemed to be more of the colonial mat type that I would have to clean out. I'd surmise that this type of benthic bacteria would not be as beneficial than pelagic bacteria.

One supposed benefit of the zeo system and other additives is that it is supposed to contain good strains of bacteria. But I'm not sure if those are truly the best types or if they work by anecdote.

One other variable is fungus. I have no idea what fungus, if any, thrive in saltwater that are not infectious to livestock.

I wonder if we'd ever end up trading water "frags" to inoculate our tanks with a successful reefers biome. We try so hard to not introduce foreign water into out tanks. But if someone's water has a nice probiotics population then why not inoculate a failing tank to see if it helps?

 

[jacob.morgan78]

you have my attention...

 

[JohnnyRI]

This is very interesting topic. I do wonder though if other organic matter would have the same effect.

 

[Sherrf1]

Do you think the type of lettuce used would make a difference, like dark leaves vs. iceberg? What type did you use?

 

[jdegrasse]

Good points Sherrf1 and Johnny.

From composting for gardens, we know that some organic matter is easier to digest than others. I'd guess lettuce (especially the thinner leaf varieties) is one of the best "composters."

Anything the does not have much cellulose (so no tough matter like carrots or romaine hearts) should be OK.

I think it is either the ease of which the tank bacteria can digest the lettuce or some of the natural bacteria on the lettuce which is somehow able to survive in the saltwater (not too much of a stretch...bacteria are survivors).

 

[Lwhite]

Following along excitedly! If this turns into something, the benefits it could reap not only for advanced aquarists but budget reefers as well are incredible. I am excited to see what you find

 

[GrendelPrime76]

would you be able to place the lettice in your sump or should it be clipped in the dt?

 

[seapug]

Interesting topic. If people are going to experiment with this, I'd recommend trying sushi Nori as the "lettuce." If you're experimenting with a type of "vegetable" that would have beneficial marine bacteria strains on it, something that comes from the ocean would be a good place to start.

 

[Gorgok]

How much longer would it take for a dried/processed nori take to start rotting vs lettuce which has already been 'on the road' for a bit when it arrives at a supermarket?

 

[Lwhite]

I guess the only way to find out is to try it! I do wonder if there could be a significant bump in random chemicals or (P/N) from a processed food like the dried nori Vs. an organic lettuce leaf. Unless you can get organic nori?

 

[ecomdesign]

Subscribed!

 

[JohnnyRI]

I wouldnt use processed stuff. Organic would be best choice the more natural the better.

Maybe spinach would warrant a test or kale?

I would expect the starch veggies would not be a good choice.

 

[dallasg]

sounds very interesting and being a vegan i can share dinner with my tank

 

[Lwhite]

I was looking up the nori the other night, and the "processing" is just shredding a drying. As far as I could find the standard practice is just to shred the initial algae into pieces and press/dry them into sheets with no added chemicals. Therefore for the most part the nori should be organic.

 

[GrahamJr]

The lettuce could probably be put in the sump, but the fish like to nibble on it.

Another thought.......A fresh head of lettuce put under water for an hour freshens it up as the leaves suck in the water and get crispy again. Also, I often drop the used stump of a head of Romaine lettuce into my koi pond, after cutting it up for a salad. It often floats around on top of the pond and if the koi don't eat it right away it starts to grow new leaves again.

I wonder if I put a few leaves into a glass of water, with a few drops of SELCO added to the water, and let it sit for a day before using it to feed the tank; if the lettuce would suck up some of the vitamins and nutrients to enhance the bacteria formed as they eat it up in the tank? I'll give it a try!


Has any one else given it a try yet and had positive response from increased numbers of coral polyps closing up as they eat the bacteria? It takes a few days before the bacteria start eating into the lettuce and the bacteria enter the water column..